Profile of wehrwolfzug

Hmmm keeping the initiative and dictating the play while denying the enemy mp to call their super heavy late game unit. That actually sounds like real strategy. You are in the wrong forums my friend. People don't like to hear that sort of thing around here.....

How much damage will a Stuka strike or pack43 do to an 152? Does the 152 out range the pack 43? Just wondering because nobody has listed these as counters?

Removing Rifle Grenade would be like removing Oorah, it's a key part of the unit's combat ability. I use that comparison because Grenadiers can use Rifle Grenades to stun a Maxim and try to crawl away, whereas Conscripts can evade an MG by Oorah'ing away. Alternative you could compare it to the Molotov, aka forced decrew / retreat of any support weapon within range.



Using the "Grens with Assault Rifles" comparison, you should look into why x4 MP 44's for 60m aren't worth it compared to x2 G43's for 60m. The reason is because less G43's allow for some range, but still give you an incentive to close in, while the MP 44's force you to close in but you can't close in too much or you lose, and if there's no cover nearby you automatically lose. The G43's are more versatile and effective, while the MP 44's are funneled into a role that the unit wielding them isn't great at.



CoH1 Panzer Grenadiers are not comparable at all to CoH2 Panzergrenadiers. CoH1 Panzer Grenadiers start off as the weakest core infantry but slowly become the strongest core infantry as you upgrade them.

Likewise vCoH Grenadiers are not comparable to CoH2 Grenadiers, and CoH1 Grenadiers were much stronger than CoH2 Grenadiers. CoH1 Grenadiers had higher health than any American or British unit in the game, and were more accurate as well. They came out generally when Americans researched BAR's, but could still counter them with just their Kar 98's, and could get 2 MG 42's to counter any Infantry the Americans or British could throw at them. CoH2's Grenadiers are much weaker in comparison.

Actually volks grenadiers were the weakest. To be honest the comparison I had made was based off how a Wehrmacht player used pg, snipers, mortars, smoke and flame pios to assault weapon support teams. All that was needed was some basic skills and tactics. Not clicking a grenadier button with no risk whatsoever. This was one of the reasons Wehrmacht players were considered good players. You had to have skill to win. You are desperately grasping for things that are not being discussed.

Once again pg work great at their role. One bundle nade will almost sqaud wipe an at gun, support team or infantry squad. The assault rifles will Finnish what's left in about a second. Duel shrecks will make waste to any armor you attack from the side or rear. If you attack frontally, well that's a player issue and it is not a balance issue. The killing power of pg easily are worth their cost. Every time you use pg squad correctly you get squad wipes or tank kills usually followed with some vet. Even if you lose two models that's a pretty good return on investment if you ask me.

If a lowly conscript squad can get a flank on a mg gun and toss a Molotov without Oorah, why is it so hard for ost players to get a pg squad to flank and toss a bundle nade? Heck you can even use the vet one sniper shot to stun a mg and then frontally attack with pg. One bundle nade will pay for pg in mp taken. Retreat and heal up and use your now vetted and more effective pg.

I have listed many ways to ues pg effectively but you keep saying how terrible they are. It is a complete lie and fabrication of the truth.....

You said you didn't want to nerf Grenadiers, but I'd say removing their grenade would be a pretty massive nerf.



There's nothing wrong with Ostheer's design, and G43's being close-medium aren't a problem. Yes it was the role of the PG, and it still would be if they weren't nerfed separately of the G43 rework.



They only need changes because they're terrible at their own role now. If other units do their role better, that means something's wrong with them, not with everything else. The changes you outlined would just throw off the entire faction and you'd have a mess.

It wouldn't be a nerf. You would see more snipers mortars/mortars half track , flame pios and smoke in games. That's how we did it vcoh 1. We didn't have a rifle nade and the game worked just fine. Us Wehrmacht players had to use skill and tactics instead of the line infantry clicking a button.

Why would you ever pick a pg over a g43. G43 are better in every single way except pure at roles. And that is a design issue because you have over lapping roles with core infantry. One is doctorine specific but in many of the most powerfull and used doctrines I may add.

Pg are not terrible. They do exactly what they have done since vcoh. People compare their economics to grenadiers and right now coh2 grenadiers are way more powerfull than vcoh Grenadiers and the difference is the rifle nade added on coh2.

Let me guess, you're going to say the answer is to nerf Grenadiers, Assault Grenadiers, and G43's?

No I am not going to say that. Although I would like to see rifle nades removed from vanilla grenadiers as they cause a lot of balance issues in many different ways. They should be doctrine specific.

I am trying to discuss how some of the ost design concepts are in need of some reconstructing and pg are kinda redundant now as a result. I don't like how g43 are medium and close range weapons. That was the role of pg. but it is way better to have g43 Grens as you get a Faust + rifle grenade + cq weapons and cheaper.

Just trying to bring to light why some players have the perception that pg are needing buffs when in my opinion other units are crossing over and out performing in the pg role.

Are you seriously advising to play vs the AI to finetune a strat or do you just want to show your condescension? May I inquire at what level you are playing, broadly speaking? Because any solid player will shut that kind of play down with either just conspam or T1 and proceed to camp your cutoff before you even have t2 up...since you have neither capping nor serious fighting power and Mgs dont do terrible DPS either - provided they dont get flanked in the first place. And FYI, I do not use any but the standard commanders in either faction, and German Inf. remains in my opinion the weakest of the lot.

I am sorry I can no longer or help you. I have tried at great length to provide advice and encouragement to try something new and quite frankly your attitude sucks. If you want to be top players bracket then purchase a p2w commander and copy what the top ten guys are currently cheeseing. Boom now your problems are solved and you are high level.

There is no set build to win at this game. War is fluid which means your build will vary depending on the situation at hand. The more diverse options you have in your pool of tactics the better you will be able to respond. I provided a variable option that in the right scenario could be executed with pg to great effect.

If you wanna try new things and explore more options in the coh2 world have to change your attitude and open your mind a bit more. I am sorry I failed you comrade.