Ostheer Mobile Defense Puma rework

Jump back to quoted post3 Jul 2019, 10:41 AMSander93

Its anti-infantry performance is actually easily on par or even better than a normal Ostheer Panzer IV's. It compensates slightly weaker AOE with significantly less scatter and a faster reload. It's actually surprisingly good considering its anti-infantry is mostly a secondary role (the damage reduction aura being its primary role).




The normal P4 needs the top mounted MG to achieve roughly similar TTK, but that is under ideal circumstances (at medium distance and in neutral cover, giving the MGs maximum DPS).

Jump back to quoted post3 Jul 2019, 20:09 PMYeltsinDeathBrigades

The general for me is just an AI duty here. Yes, it is OK against infantry, but what is the point in this tank when we can have an ostwind to complete AI duties? Just 2 percent reduced damage?

Jump back to quoted post3 Jul 2019, 20:55 PMSander93

It gives -20% damage reduction to anything around it. That means all your tanks and vehicles can take one extra shot and Brummbars and Panthers (and Elefant) can take two extra (160 dmg) shots. That's huge. Infantry and support weapons are more durable too, especially versus indirect fire.

Jump back to quoted post4 Jul 2019, 03:57 AMTobis

Put the puma in tier 2. Put the command panzer in t3.

Wow, finally people can't panic spit out puma then stall for cp4.

The puma was always fine, but the techless cp4 made it way way way too easy of a decision to get. The fuel price of the puma will actually set you back in the game now before you can get some decent AI on the field. A fair trade-off for locking in this doctrine.

Jump back to quoted post3 Jul 2019, 08:07 AMYeltsinDeathBrigades

Sry, but here is too much fanboys who is like to scream for "muh T70" and "USF weak early game" so even pshrek pgren are problem for them and OP support for T3 rush. What do you think will happen, when you will add puma to the same building, even after BP2 research?
(anyway, idea is bad)

Jump back to quoted post4 Jul 2019, 08:42 AMKiwiBirb

Who needs mobile defence when you have festung armour? Ignore hull down, elephant for if allies TD spam, recon run, panic smoke, and command panzer so your grens/ support weapons don’t get shredded by indirect fire & your grens can compete with 5 man non Bren tommies! Wow! Only cost me 350mp and 125 fuel....

Jump back to quoted post4 Jul 2019, 08:58 AMCorMovus

You gave no reason why this idea is bad just pointing out that some players would find it to strong. PG with Pazshrek are the komplett Opposite in terms of at to a puma. Puma is a Vehicle, fast and with good long range capability while PG are inf, slow and only reliable in mid range. With PG you can maybe hold the ground but with a puma, you can even chase down mediums.

Jump back to quoted post4 Jul 2019, 10:19 AMLago

If you add the Puma to T2 outright, you've already recreated the Mobidef strategy.

Jump back to quoted post4 Jul 2019, 15:13 PMTobis

Why is that a bad thing? It SHOULD be a valid strategy.

Jump back to quoted post2 Jul 2019, 22:15 PMClarity

Honestly I would probably just remove the Battlephase 2 requirement and let Ostheer have a Puma within Tier 2, maybe increase it's cost a bit to compensate I feel like 80 would be fine. I think the old call-in Ostheer Puma was that cost. Right now it takes OKW about 130 fuel to obtain a Puma, with these changes the Ostheer Puma would require about 140-150 fuel which I think would be reasonable. If the doctrine becomes too powerful finally tying the Command Tank call-in to Tier 3 I think would be a good nerf just to prevent people from Puma spamming into Command Tank call-in. I feel Ostheer is the faction that could really use the Puma as I feel they struggle harder against light vehicles than OKW does. Usually OKW can at least get a Panzer II to tank damage for the Rak's whereas the Ostheer light vehicles aren't able to efficiently defend the Pak unless you build multiple of them which delays Tier 3.

Jump back to quoted post4 Jul 2019, 07:30 AMEsxile

With the current rework on Pzgren I'm not sure for that, T2 strat around Pzgren and Puma into T4 would probably be too strong.
Your infantry dominate the AI
Your light tank dominate the AT
You still have the HMG.42

You can't simply give Ostheer the best early/mid game infantry and best mid game TD for no extra fuel cost or extra munition cost.

Just for the record, 1st Pzgren hit the field at 4 minutes without the need to cap half of the map. And you can have 2 HMG42 and pioneers before with no delay.

Jump back to quoted post5 Jul 2019, 23:33 PMthedarkarmadillo

I fail to see how the only faction with 4 tiers and 3 sub tier techs has trouble finding a place to tie units to tech. There are 7 bloody semi steps! We can figure out somewhere to stick the damn thing...

Jump back to quoted post6 Jul 2019, 13:42 PMUnit G17

4 tiers, yes, but their pacing be like:

T1 --- T2 --------------------------------T3 --- T4

That 90 fuel for bp2 is massive

Jump back to quoted post6 Jul 2019, 13:42 PMUnit G17

4 tiers, yes, but their pacing be like:

T1 --- T2 --------------------------------T3 --- T4

That 90 fuel for bp2 is massive