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[Winter Balance Update] SOV Feedback

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5 Jan 2021, 22:15 PM
#1241
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1


No, I never said this a even single time. I disprove your point that Soviet tech is getting cheaper.

You can simply answer my points, that's all there is.

You can repeat that it were cheaper, that's not in line with the changes of the preview though.

Is medic cheaper? Yes
Is T3 cheaper? Yes
Is Mobilize reserves at T3 unlock cheaper? Yes
Does Mobilize Reserves provide extra utility with no additional cost? Yes

You want to argue that AT grenade is now more expensive? it is fine by we can agree to disagree.

Do you disagree with my original point that Soviet tech has already gotten buffs and does not need to be cheaper?

Is this issue worth all these pages? certainly not.
5 Jan 2021, 22:18 PM
#1242
avatar of Hannibal
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 3114 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 22:15 PMVipper

Is medic cheaper?
Is T3 cheaper?
Is Mobilize reserves at T3 unlock cheaper?
Does Mobilize Reserves provide extra utility with no additional cost?

Do you disagree with my original post?



You are deflecting. I responded to all these claims already in post 1235, you are free to respond.
5 Jan 2021, 22:19 PM
#1243
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1


You are deflecting. I responded to all these claims already in post 1235, you are free to respond.


Is medic cheaper? yes or no

"Medics

Given the high manpower cost of the Soviet tech structure, which does not grant new abilities or units like the other factions, the cost of medics is being reduced. This change should make it easier for Soviet players to afford vital healing for both tech routes.

Manpower cost from 250 to 200
"


Is T3 cheaper? yes or no

Tankiovy Battalion
Soviet tech costs are being adjusted with the Soviet Tankiovy Battalion having its price reduced while the price of the Mechanized Armor Kampenya has been increased. With the nerf to units such as the T70, there is no longer a reason for Soviet LVs to arrive much later than their counterparts

"Cost from 240 manpower and 85 fuel to 200 manpower and 75 fuel"



Is Mobilize reserves at T3 unlock cheaper? yes or no

No longer requires Conscript Molotov and AT Grenade upgrades


Does Mobilize Reserves provide extra utility with no additional cost? yes or no
5 Jan 2021, 22:23 PM
#1244
avatar of Hannibal
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 3114 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 22:19 PMVipper

Is medic cheaper? yes or no

Is T3 cheaper? yes or no

Is Mobilize reserves at T3 unlock cheaper? yes or no

Does Mobilize Reserves provide extra utility with no additional cost? yes or no

Well then keep that up if you like.
There's literally no point in trying to argue with you if you go down that road...
5 Jan 2021, 22:25 PM
#1245
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

Can't prove wrong someone who refuses to accept the thought of being wrong.
6 Jan 2021, 04:31 AM
#1246
avatar of gbem

Posts: 1979

with the death loop semi fixed i think its a decent idea to consider making the maxim a NORMAL 4 man MG... the faction is in dire need of nondoc suppression options and the M5 quad isnt good enough (yet)
6 Jan 2021, 04:36 AM
#1247
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 22:19 PMVipper


Is medic cheaper? yes or no

"Medics

Given the high manpower cost of the Soviet tech structure, which does not grant new abilities or units like the other factions, the cost of medics is being reduced. This change should make it easier for Soviet players to afford vital healing for both tech routes.

Manpower cost from 250 to 200
"


Is T3 cheaper? yes or no

Tankiovy Battalion
Soviet tech costs are being adjusted with the Soviet Tankiovy Battalion having its price reduced while the price of the Mechanized Armor Kampenya has been increased. With the nerf to units such as the T70, there is no longer a reason for Soviet LVs to arrive much later than their counterparts

"Cost from 240 manpower and 85 fuel to 200 manpower and 75 fuel"



Is Mobilize reserves at T3 unlock cheaper? yes or no

No longer requires Conscript Molotov and AT Grenade upgrades


Does Mobilize Reserves provide extra utility with no additional cost? yes or no


Makes sense.
I dont see why others are trying to disagree?

Sov got the real wholesome buffs overall.
The only loss is T70 gets a little unattractive.

What more do they want?

Alongside with heavy nerfs to Ost.
If im a sov player, i will be darn happy with this patch.
6 Jan 2021, 04:40 AM
#1248
avatar of gbem

Posts: 1979



Makes sense.
I dont see why others are trying to disagree?

Sov got the real wholesome buffs overall.
The only loss is T70 gets a little unattractive.

What more do they want?


this is SOV`s tech costs as of patch V5
https://www.coh2.org/topic/107284/soviet-teching-comparison

they still tech worse than ostheer
6 Jan 2021, 04:49 AM
#1249
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

jump backJump back to quoted post6 Jan 2021, 04:40 AMgbem


this is SOV`s tech costs as of patch V5
https://www.coh2.org/topic/107284/soviet-teching-comparison

they still tech worse than ostheer


the only thing i agree is T3476 comes too late.

otherwise base teching costs are already reduced to inconsequential.

It gets even harder to pin down after you account for tier skips, reinforcement, doctrine calls in, bigger squad sizes and vet bonus

sov are pretty much king of late games dig-in.
6 Jan 2021, 04:57 AM
#1250
avatar of gbem

Posts: 1979


otherwise teching is close enough, and hard to pin down after you account for reinforcement, bigger squad sizes.

no not really... reinforcement costs are almost always half the cost of the squad... model per model comparison is really irrelevant when you consider that infantry are balanced per squad not per model... squads with lower model count tend to have lower RA and higher DPS... the same is true vice versa...


doctrine calls in,


the soviets have some of the best callins true... but again core armies must be balanced against each other... a faction should not be reliant on doctrines for viability


sov are pretty much king of late games dig-in.


mostly thanks to 7 man zis3 su-85 and ram+offmaps... and all of them got nerfs
6 Jan 2021, 06:48 AM
#1251
avatar of vgfgff

Posts: 177



the only thing i agree is T3476 comes too late.

otherwise base teching costs are already reduced to inconsequential.

It gets even harder to pin down after you account for tier skips, reinforcement, doctrine calls in, bigger squad sizes and vet bonus

sov are pretty much king of late games dig-in.


Ostheer only got some doctrinal rework(nerf) . with reduce armor of brumbar by 10.
or I missing something?
6 Jan 2021, 11:27 AM
#1252
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 22:15 PMVipper

Does Mobilize Reserves provide extra utility with no additional cost? Yes

You want to argue that AT grenade is now more expensive? it is fine by we can agree to disagree.

How is it that the first is true and yet the second is in. Contention? If you never got the nolitov, which you shouldn't, because they are bad, you are now forced to get them with AT nades. At nades are more expensive as a result.
6 Jan 2021, 11:30 AM
#1253
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8


otherwise base teching costs are already reduced to inconsequential.

But... soviet tech costs are exactly the same as they were.

It gets even harder to pin down after you account for tier skips, reinforcement, doctrine calls in, bigger squad sizes and vet bonus

Soviets can't skip tiers.
Only Ost can.

sov are pretty much king of late games dig-in.

And ost is king of late game breakthrough, with rocket arty wiping whatever it aims at, especially post its massive buff and brummbar does not give a fuck and frontally destroys ATGs and infantry regardless of number of models.
6 Jan 2021, 14:42 PM
#1254
avatar of Clarity

Posts: 479

If they don't want to reduce the cost of Tier 1 and Tier 2 manpower wise could they at least include molotovs if you build one of these so the AT grenades cost can be reduced to 125 mp and 10 fuel. Or maybe you unlock Molo's by building Tier 3 if they are too strong early game.
7 Jan 2021, 15:19 PM
#1255
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

Maxim is still garbage. Increase the arc or lower the setup time. Long setup time, narrow arc and shit suppression should not be on the same unit.
7 Jan 2021, 16:13 PM
#1256
avatar of general_gawain

Posts: 919

the only thing i agree is T3476 comes too late.


T34/76 desperately needs its own tech timing by splitting T4 tech cost in two parts (first and second part). Both parts added together don't change tech costs for Katiusha/SU-85 and doctrinal T4 tanks.


Two options with same outcome:

A)
- first part is a T3.5 upgrade that unlocks T34/76 in T3 Building and is necessary to build T4
- second part to unlock all other tanks with T4 building

B)
- first part is for T4 building by only unlocking T34/76 with it
- second part to unlock all other tanks with a T4.5 upgrade in T4 building
7 Jan 2021, 20:22 PM
#1257
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279



T34/76 desperately needs its own tech timing by splitting T4 tech cost in two parts (first and second part). Both parts added together don't change tech costs for Katiusha/SU-85 and doctrinal T4 tanks.


Two options with same outcome:

A)
- first part is a T3.5 upgrade that unlocks T34/76 in T3 Building and is necessary to build T4
- second part to unlock all other tanks with T4 building

B)
- first part is for T4 building by only unlocking T34/76 with it
- second part to unlock all other tanks with a T4.5 upgrade in T4 building

Could attach the mobilize reserves to this middle tech to help iron out the timing.
7 Jan 2021, 21:29 PM
#1258
avatar of Spoof

Posts: 449

Maxim is still garbage. Increase the arc or lower the setup time. Long setup time, narrow arc and shit suppression should not be on the same unit.

Suppression definitely needs an increase. It is quite pathetic that squads can just stroll in and out of the arc.
8 Jan 2021, 06:13 AM
#1259
avatar of SgtJonson

Posts: 143

Assaulting a mg from the front without being supressed is bleeding the attacker out. Thats why maxim spam is still to be seen in bigger matches i guess

Edit:
I dont think maxim needs to be changed atm
8 Jan 2021, 06:15 AM
#1260
avatar of Mr. Someguy

Posts: 4928

Maxim is still garbage. Increase the arc or lower the setup time. Long setup time, narrow arc and shit suppression should not be on the same unit.


No dedicated HMG should be low in the suppression department.
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