60 range TD

I like how to avoid to mention the damage reduction from 240 to 160. Oh and
.

Jackson were given extra sigh and then removed.

It is fun because the aim of M36 jacksons changes have always been survivability in exchange of firepower, and now you want to reduce its survivability but no words about firepower.

The damage change came from much earlier, the goal for that was reliability . It was not compensation for health it was compensation for pen.

Glad you agree that survivability should come at the change of firepower. We're on the same page there, you are simply misremebering that the health buff did not come with a firepower nerf.

Make M36 hits do 120 damage, like Su76's.

Make M36 hits do 120 damage, like Su76's.

And make it shoot every 4 seconds or less, like SU-76 too?
Or make it cost 70 fuel?

The SU-76 has ROF around 5.3 down to around 4.3 at vet 3.

The fact that this topic comes up almost weekly, and always gains dozens, if not hundreds, of replies should indicate that something is wrong. Balanced units don't get this much attention; there are no massive weekly threads about STUGs, Shermans, or even rocket arty.

The fact that this topic comes up almost weekly, and always gains dozens, if not hundreds, of replies should indicate that something is wrong. Balanced units don't get this much attention; there are no massive weekly threads about STUGs, Shermans, or even rocket arty.

Whats more alarming is when a change is made its usually inconsequential and unrelated.

"we admit the jackson is over performing, therefore +5 fuel cost, and so balance was restored"

The fact that this topic comes up almost weekly, and always gains dozens, if not hundreds, of replies should indicate that something is wrong. Balanced units don't get this much attention; there are no massive weekly threads about STUGs, Shermans, or even rocket arty.

The fact that despite all the REEEE nothing was done for multiple patches indicates that too many players are unrecoverable noobs who will blame anything and everything before admitting THEY are the problem at the end.

Balanced units DO get this much attention if they are inconvenient to fight against and require putting some thought or effort to countering them.
ISU being prime example of that, followed by halftruck shenanigans, loitering planes vs people who refuse to build AA, years if people screaming about performance of grens and nothing being done about that performance and so on.

The fact that this topic comes up almost weekly, and always gains dozens, if not hundreds, of replies should indicate that something is wrong. Balanced units don't get this much attention; there are no massive weekly threads about STUGs, Shermans, or even rocket arty.

You must have missed the target size buff for medium generalists to decrease TD effectiveness, as well as the heavy nerfs to decrease TD necessity.

The fact that despite all the REEEE nothing was done for multiple patches indicates that too many players are unrecoverable noobs.

Quite a bit is being done with the new patch. There's nothing noobish about complaining over TDs being too good.

Quite a bit is being done with the new patch. There's nothing noobish about complaining over TDs being too good.

Oh yeah, all the pop cap and 5 fuel cost increases, that screams doom for TDs.

I myself might be talking a bit of bs at times, but I'm quite positive there are DOZENS of "balance issues" balance team would love to slap players with a fish about and scream L2P at them, but they really can't due to having to keep certain communication standard, being pretty much balance representatives and renown community members for their hard work.

Oh yeah, all the pop cap and 5 fuel cost increases, that screams doom for TDs.

READ

Oh yeah, the 20 armor reduction for jackson, which makes little difference for P4 and no difference for anything else.

If you were reading forums, you would actually remember Sander explaining that the reason for med tanks target size reduction was NOT TDs, but ATGs being too effective against them.

If you were reading what you've quoted really well, you would see the changes are meant to make meds more "resilient" to ALL forms of AT, not TDs specifically.

You must have missed the target size buff for medium generalists to decrease TD effectiveness, as well as the heavy nerfs to decrease TD necessity.

The vast majority of the community doesn't base their discussion around balance previews; they base it on the 'live' version. The upcoming changes do look interesting, but I'm not going to jump to a conclusion until I've played with them for a week or so in multiple game-modes - something I haven't done in the preview.

I'm guessing OP is referring to the live version, as the question is "[will] There will be any kind of nerfs in the 60 range TD", rather than referring to changes in a possible v1.4 preview.

The fact that despite all the REEEE nothing was done for multiple patches indicates that too many players are unrecoverable noobs who will blame anything and everything before admitting THEY are the problem at the end.

Balanced units DO get this much attention if they are inconvenient to fight against and require putting some thought or effort to countering them.
ISU being prime example of that, followed by halftruck shenanigans, loitering planes vs people who refuse to build AA, years if people screaming about performance of grens and nothing being done about that performance and so on.

Firstly, you really need to stop insulting players - it's not a good argument to make. Any player can make a valid suggestion or critique, regardless of skill level. If you disagree with their perspective based on their skill level, you can make helpful suggestions, rather than referring to them as "Reee", "noobs", or suggesting that the "balance team would love to slap players with a fish about and scream L2P at them".

Secondly, balanced units don't get this level of attention. I can't recall a single thread (within the last year or two) with 100+ replies regarding the STUG, mediums, ATGs, or even mortars, specifically - whereas I could probably find at least 5 from this year regarding 60 range TDs.

If you were reading forums, you would actually remember Sander explaining that the reason for med tanks target size reduction was NOT TDs, but ATGs being too effective against them.

If you were reading what you've quoted really well, you would see the changes are meant to make meds more "resilient" to ALL forms of AT, not TDs specifically.

Not only are these two lines contradictory ('the changes were only to improve against ATGs, not TDs' compared to 'the changes were to all forms of AT, including TDs'), but the first one is also wrong. Sander's quote is:

They aren't, and have never been. Double ATG is so good at fighting off medium tanks that I consider it one of the main reasons players go straight for a heavy instead, now that heavies are viable. It's so easy to make a small mistake and lose a medium to double ATGs, so players choose the reliability of heavy durability instead. The target size buff is meant to make mediums better against ATGs as well as TDs, so messing with the TD accuracy (which would also make them worse against all other vehicles and buildings) is not a solution for the intended goal here.

The changes are meant to impact the Medium vs. TD matchup.

And make it shoot every 4 seconds or less, like SU-76 too?
Or make it cost 70 fuel?

Why not both? And lock the turret to be like a casemate, like the Su-76.

Pd: Vipper proved you wrong, Su-76's fire each 5.3s. Nice try though

No firing on the move or lower its moving accuarcy to 0.25 so your forced to micro the unit, no more roaming td swarms.

Perhaps a considerable reduction of long range accuracy would help a bit - and I mean across the board. The fire and almost guaranteed to get a hit an pen from the FOW is what that is degenerating every late game 3vs3 and 4vs4 match into rocket-arty-behind-the-TD-wall meta.

This is somewhat OK with units like ATG, or units like the SU 85 - they are exposed and vulnerable, and promote very little other tactic other than good positioning and keeping distance, but a couple of misses should be expected at maximum range and it would add to the game and force players to manouvre their units more instead of just camping them there.

That or just add more curve to the pen values - decrease extreme long range pen and add a bit to short range pen.

Without TD, How can deal with axis Heavy armor?

Flanking is suicide and most attempts fail

AT gun have no mobility and easily neutralized

Bazooka? haha

Can someone give the Allies some captured Panzershrek?

Panthers vs. TDs:

Flanking is suicide and most attempts fail

AT gun have no mobility and easily neutralized

Shreck? haha

Can someone give the Allies some captured TD?

Panthers vs. TDs:

Flanking is suicide and most attempts fail

Or panther vs Jackson, to ve exact ?

Panthers vs. TDs:

Flanking is suicide and most attempts fail

AT gun have no mobility and easily neutralized

Shreck? haha

Can someone give the Allies some captured TD?

Panther will win versus a Jackson in a straight up fight though though, unless you dive with no support and get snared by infantry or hit a mine or something. Any other allied TD it's a similar story, even easier due to lower mobility stats and moving accuracy.

There's no need to flank allied TDs with Panther since Panther will penetrate any allied TD 100% of the time at any range. If you do decide to flank anyway the SU-85 is comparably easy to flank.

Shreck will penetrate every nondoc allied medium tank and TD 100% of the time.

How will TDs kill your ATG?

Captured panther or jagdpanzer or stug III g would be cool for allies I guess

Panther will win versus a Jackson in a straight up fight though though, unless you dive with no support and get snared by infantry or hit a mine or something. Any other allied TD it's a similar story, even easier due to lower mobility stats and moving accuracy.

There's no need to flank allied TDs with Panther since Panther will penetrate any allied TD 100% of the time at any range. If you do decide to flank anyway the SU-85 is comparably easy to flank.

Shreck will penetrate every nondoc allied medium tank and TD 100% of the time.

How will TDs kill your ATG?

Captured panther or jagdpanzer or stug III g would be cool for allies I guess

sure buddy in your dreams maybe.

U know that Su 85 gets shots of even before Panther sees the Su...

If the Panther can deal with all the allied Tanks sooooo easyli.... why we have a heavy Tank metagame ?

maybe u play a little bit before writing BS here.

The SU-76 has ROF around 5.3 down to around 4.3 at vet 3.

So four seconds more or less