Do you think cons deserve some nondoc AI upgrade ?
26 Mar 2019, 14:30 PM
#1
Posts: 1660
Title. Question regarding cons state and the possibilities on a nondoc upgrade in light of the new doctrine "stv drop"
26 Mar 2019, 14:50 PM
#2
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
First of all the grenade package must be made cheaper because right now it´s just ridiculously expensive.
USF grenade upgrade was recently made cheaper yet Conscripts need to pay 25 fuel for snare and another 10 for terrible Molotovs? Doesn´t make much sense to me.
USF grenade upgrade was recently made cheaper yet Conscripts need to pay 25 fuel for snare and another 10 for terrible Molotovs? Doesn´t make much sense to me.
26 Mar 2019, 14:56 PM
#3
6 Posts: 328
First of all the grenade package must be made cheaper because right now it´s just ridiculously expensive.
USF grenade upgrade was recently made cheaper yet Conscripts need to pay 25 fuel for snare and another 10 for terrible Molotovs? Doesn´t make much sense to me.
Awhile ago someone suggested bundling them together, which would be good.
The throw speed could also do with being improved.
26 Mar 2019, 15:02 PM
#4
Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1
I would like cons to be useable without weapon upgrades if possible, and keep that to doctrines. But the side-tech bundling is a must, 35 fuel combined for mollys and snares is insane.
Bundle them or add something to make them worth the cost. Preferably not a weapon upgrade though.
Bundle them or add something to make them worth the cost. Preferably not a weapon upgrade though.
26 Mar 2019, 15:10 PM
#5
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
I would like cons to be useable without weapon upgrades if possible, and keep that to doctrines.
I don't believe that's possible.
They had veterancy increased, weapon change to be less RNG fest, got extra 10% accuracy vet and all of that is still irrelevant in comparison to regular LMG or G43 grens.
However, if they were to get a T3/T4 weapon upgrade, it should be this current SVT.
Upgrade is too weak to be doctrinal and simply doesn't bring enough for the cost and functionality(unless you drop it for ost player, hoping he'll pick it, nerfing his grens DPS and blocking weapon slot), but it would be sufficient for late game upgrade for cons.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
26 Mar 2019, 15:33 PM
#6
Posts: 2184 | Subs: 2
Awhile ago someone suggested bundling them together, which would be good.
The throw speed could also do with being improved.
Awhile ago? This proposal came with the introduction of the US faction in the game, but simply ignored without justification.
26 Mar 2019, 17:36 PM
#7
Posts: 206
I wish they had some kind of bonus in cover, like the game says. (cheap infantry, good in cover). There are no point building sandbags because they lose almost every engagement in a battle cover to cover. Maybe vet 1 remove the flair mine and give them a bonus to cover?
I don't like the idea to give them nondoc upgrades, don't think it fits the theme of conscripts.
I don't like the idea to give them nondoc upgrades, don't think it fits the theme of conscripts.
26 Mar 2019, 17:36 PM
#8
Posts: 2358
First of all the grenade package must be made cheaper because right now it´s just ridiculously expensive.
USF grenade upgrade was recently made cheaper yet Conscripts need to pay 25 fuel for snare and another 10 for terrible Molotovs? Doesn´t make much sense to me.
Free molos for the revolution!
I really want molos to be free, dont get me wrong
26 Mar 2019, 17:41 PM
#9
Posts: 2358
I would like cons to be useable without weapon upgrades if possible, and keep that to doctrines. But the side-tech bundling is a must, 35 fuel combined for mollys and snares is insane.
Bundle them or add something to make them worth the cost. Preferably not a weapon upgrade though.
Cons have the "jack of all trades, best of none" design. Thats why when they have no doc upgrade they become "trashy"
I like that design and used it a lot. Its simple modular logic, you dont need it, you dont loose at all for it. Imagina a backpack where all the units in a faction go toghether, cons are the lightest of all, because without doc upgrades they do nothing. But on the other side you DONT WANT to use cons, they are just as a recon / cap troop they can be. With oohrah! bonus. To put things in perspective, OST always have the burden of grens as USF with riflemen, if they decide to NOT use them, the faction has already invested so much design in them its just a really bad idea. Faction Flexibility in a nutshell.
though I like the idea to give cons the "hit the dirt" ability nondoc for free, or behind T1/T2 build
26 Mar 2019, 18:25 PM
#10
Posts: 48
There was a huge thread about this where it seemed most people agreed something should be done to make cons late game viable. While I enjoy the idea of bundling the molly with AT snare, that won't change the opinion that they are useless against any other infantry late game. I'd like to see a weapon upgrade. I think the molly and nade will still need to be addressed. A weapon upgrade will add to the investment to a unit that will undoubtedly become "Ok" late game rather than useless.
26 Mar 2019, 18:41 PM
#11
Posts: 4474
as i always said cons gets non doc upgrade when ost get 5 man non doc upgrade
katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
26 Mar 2019, 18:42 PM
#12
Posts: 3260
If the relative combat performance of Cons and Penals isn't being changed, I'd ditch the Conscript unlocks completely. Just give them molotovs and AT grenades outright.
26 Mar 2019, 18:50 PM
#13
Posts: 1527
Permanently BannedJust make the molly/at nade upgrade cheaper and then nerf the AT satchel in some way.
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26 Mar 2019, 18:59 PM
#14
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
Conscripts are mostly fine it the power level of other infatry that has gone thru the roof.
26 Mar 2019, 19:00 PM
#15
Posts: 206
I still don't think a weapon upgrade is necessary, just an ability like hit the dirt or better combat in cover or anything like this is enough. Conscripts don't need to be winning every engagement since they are not a dedicated AI squad, but at least not lose that much.
26 Mar 2019, 19:15 PM
#16
Posts: 1304 | Subs: 13
I would say either bundle their grenades or make them dirt cheap and I keep saying I believe they should be cheaper as the game progresses in reinforce cost or maybe cover bonuses in the late game through the T4.
You could probably tone down some vet, but if this infantry is supposed to be utility, defensive meatshields when not upgraded they shouldn't bleed as hard in the late game and be better if you do lose vetted squads.
You could probably tone down some vet, but if this infantry is supposed to be utility, defensive meatshields when not upgraded they shouldn't bleed as hard in the late game and be better if you do lose vetted squads.
26 Mar 2019, 19:23 PM
#17
Posts: 1660
You could probably tone down some vet, but if this infantry is supposed to be utility, defensive meatshields when not upgraded they shouldn't bleed as hard in the late game and be better if you do lose vetted squads.
Maybe i'm wrong, but don't you think that the "meatshield" design of cons is a ship that sailed with maxim nerf ?
26 Mar 2019, 19:27 PM
#18
Posts: 1660
I like the idea of bundling side tech and making it 10-15 fuel cheaper, but i advise caution when talking about molotov buffs. Flame nade timer was added for this reason.
Want to further add that MY PERSONAL OPINION, is that adding veterancy bonuses is useless. Some kind of early buff, either stat or weapon up, would only help for cons to be relevant.
Want to further add that MY PERSONAL OPINION, is that adding veterancy bonuses is useless. Some kind of early buff, either stat or weapon up, would only help for cons to be relevant.
26 Mar 2019, 19:29 PM
#19
Posts: 1660
Conscripts are mostly fine it the power level of other infatry that has gone thru the roof.
I agree, but that ship sailed already. Hard to imagine a rework of all WFA mainlines, EFA penals and g43 at this point.
26 Mar 2019, 19:59 PM
#20
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
I agree, but that ship sailed already. Hard to imagine a rework of all WFA mainlines, EFA penals and g43 at this point.
Either the trend of buffing units will continue (resulting in reducing the time player have to react and having to buff QCQ units even more) or will see a return to using grenadiers as the benchmark and units available before minute 1 will be toned down. I prefer the second.
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