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Kyle wants feedback on the PIV

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Iron Emperor
1 Dec 2016, 23:26 PM
#21
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jump backJump back to quoted post1 Dec 2016, 22:49 PMmiragefla
I would say give the PIV a slight increase at mid-long range penetration.

Allied medium tanks have the advantage at short range that combines well with their speed. PIV wants to slug it out at a distance using higher armour and better range penetration.


+1 I agree on this point. This tank can't reliably compete with other tanks, although the ostheer and OKW Pz4 is extremely expensive. I voted for the increase in penetration so it can attack better tanks more reliably.
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Sturmpanther
1 Dec 2016, 23:29 PM
#22
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jump backJump back to quoted post1 Dec 2016, 23:14 PMDonnieChan
why is this in discussion and the comet untouched:faint:


true true.

And well if i'm not wrong, the brit player can have an AEC and go for Chromwell, while Ostheer has his 222 and PIV.

Both time the brits wins.

Chromwell vs PiV --> Chromwell win. And don't forget Chromwell still can crush very well inf.


I would not change the PIV, because then USA shermans, soviet t34 are failing. Just nerf the Chromwell+ Comet.

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skemshead
1 Dec 2016, 23:42 PM
#23
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jump backJump back to quoted post1 Dec 2016, 23:10 PMSmaug
accuracy on the move for both panzer 4 and panther from 0.5 to 0.75


^^This 100%.
The amount of Anti tank counters allies can usually field means opportunities for proper tank battles is limited, so seeing the piv miss all the time is really disapponting.

Or rng could just hate me.<444>_<444>
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Firesparks
1 Dec 2016, 23:43 PM
#24
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jump backJump back to quoted post1 Dec 2016, 23:05 PMMr. Someguy


Wasn't the Cromwell's target size smaller than every other tank?


yes, and it allow the cromwell to scale into late game by giving it survivability. Medium shouldn't be trying to complete against late game unit by firepower. the cromwell's penetration should have been decreased instead.

jump backJump back to quoted post1 Dec 2016, 23:12 PMCultist_kun


I'm not saying that Sherman is must have unit or it suppose to save late for USF, but its by far has bigger impact then PIV and it CAN be effective in late game, not good or bad but it CAN be effective, while PIV with our without vet is still half stug half ostwind which in quite bad at both AT and AI


The sherman is an excellent shock unit, but it can't carrying the the USF late game. That's biggest reason why the USF got the calliope and pershing DLC.
jump backJump back to quoted post1 Dec 2016, 23:14 PMDonnieChan
why is this in discussion and the comet untouched:faint:


nerf comet range to 50 meter and it would be fine-ish. (probably need a cost decrease as well


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Kyle_RE
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1 Dec 2016, 23:46 PM
#25
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Technically this is false. There was a post on the P4 in the Winter Balance Preview Feedback thread and since this was out of scope of the patch I move it out. That is all. Or is it?
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Budwise
2 Dec 2016, 00:05 AM
#26
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TBH the P4 has terribly underperformed for its cost for ages. IMO, just lower the fuel cost.
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BIH_kirov_QC
2 Dec 2016, 01:08 AM
#27
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jump backJump back to quoted post1 Dec 2016, 23:46 PMKyle_RE
Technically this is false. There was a post on the P4 in the Winter Balance Preview Feedback thread and since this was out of scope of the patch I move it out. That is all. Or is it?


JackDickolson is jsut axis biased.
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zerocoh
2 Dec 2016, 01:53 AM
#28
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PIV is fine, its a mini tiger, it can kill half squads every shot, super annoying, and can pay itself very fast.

If people really want a good AT on T3, then go for stugs...
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Tric
2 Dec 2016, 02:24 AM
#29
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Cheaper or nerf the equivalents.
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Tric
2 Dec 2016, 02:25 AM
#30
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jump backJump back to quoted post2 Dec 2016, 00:05 AMBudwise
TBH the P4 has terribly underperformed for its cost for ages. IMO, just lower the fuel cost.


Yup, comes out later and does less.
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Mr. Someguy
2 Dec 2016, 03:08 AM
#31
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jump backJump back to quoted post2 Dec 2016, 01:53 AMzerocoh
PIV is fine, its a mini tiger, it can kill half squads every shot, super annoying, and can pay itself very fast.


Had a bad game?
jump backJump back to quoted post22 Jan 2016, 01:09 AMluvnest
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Crumbum
2 Dec 2016, 04:44 AM
#32
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Increase the penetration slightly at all ranges (10 or 20) and buff the moving accuracy from 50 to 60 or 65%.

I would not increase the moving accuracy to the standard 75% since allied vehicles should still maintain an advantage if they were to execute a good flank. The p4 on the other hand should at least be better at slugging it out at longer ranges than its counterparts (Sherman, Cromwell).
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OuTLaWSTaR
2 Dec 2016, 05:32 AM
#33
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P|V becomes a glorified infantry mower late game because it gets outscaled and outranged hard, please increase long range penetration to bring it in line with the other TD. If a nerf in anti-infantry happens i won't complain.
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Brassatko
2 Dec 2016, 05:46 AM
#34
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IMO Cromwell, Comet, T34/85 and most of all MC4 Sherman need to be looked at as they are too cost efficient currently compared to any of the Axis counterparts.
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Tobis
2 Dec 2016, 06:06 AM
#35
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Increase the pen slightly, improve accuracy, adjust the other factions mediums that are overperforming.

The expensive price is fine imo. If you maintain good field presence it comes out at the right time. Main problem is unreliability dealing with other tanks. It is in a spot where it is clearly inferior to the t-34/85 and E8, while not being very much better than the sherman, t-34/76, or the cromwell. A little more penetration and accuracy will go a long way to evening it out with the other "higher tier" mediums without making it significantly better than the basic ones.

This also is only for the Ostheer p4, I think the OKW one is fine. The much much better okw veterancy on the p4, the higher starting armor, and the faster OKW repair times make up for its shortcomings.
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Tomakaze
2 Dec 2016, 06:12 AM
#36
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I feel it should have its fuel cost decreased by 15 or so and have a slight buff to accuracy. That way its cost compares better with its counterparts and its gun can be more reliable to hit (even if it doesn't penetrate tanks).

(I voted better long range accuracy but like with most of these polls, I wish we all had 2 or three votes which I feel will clarify the poll results.)
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TheMachine
2 Dec 2016, 06:40 AM
#37
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jump backJump back to quoted post2 Dec 2016, 06:06 AMTobis
Increase the pen slightly, improve accuracy, adjust the other factions mediums that are overperforming.


That's the ticket.

But more specifically, it's the moving accuracy that lets it down. 0.5 for Wehrmacht PIV whilst Sherman and Cromwell is 0.75.
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Mr. Someguy
2 Dec 2016, 07:02 AM
#38
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jump backJump back to quoted post2 Dec 2016, 06:40 AMTheMachine
That's the ticket.

But more specifically, it's the moving accuracy that lets it down. 0.5 for Wehrmacht PIV whilst Sherman and Cromwell is 0.75.


0.5 is the norm for all tanks except the Sherman. The Sherman had 0.75 because real life they had gyroscopes that helped to balance the main gun while moving. No idea why the Cromwell was also given 0.75 considering it did not have this feature, either they used the Sherman as a base and forgot to change this, or it's just good ol' power creep.
jump backJump back to quoted post22 Jan 2016, 01:09 AMluvnest
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ElSlayer
2 Dec 2016, 08:15 AM
#39
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The problem of Pz.IV is power creep. You don't fight power creep with buffs.

Nerf the overperforming equivalents. And not only equivalents, but next tiers of vehicles of the same class (I'm looking at you, Comet).
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tightrope
2 Dec 2016, 08:59 AM
#40
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Long range pen buff is probably the safest option. OKW P4 is also way too expensive to rebuild if you lose the first one.

Generalist mediums have trouble in a world of no tech heavy tanks (mainly looking at the Pershing here)
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