Nerf the panzerwerfer already

Panzerwerfers are great against groups of team weapons, especially those ATGs that blob up and a-move.

That said, if I am trying to use a Panzerwerfer to specifically kill a single MG crew covering an approach or a single pak in a field, they actually aren't that reliable unless they pull up silly close.

When my opponent's entire force is all in one screen width, all crammed together, I can inflict a ton of damage though. Conversely, if my opponents spread their units out further out than a single rocket's blast, then it can be a considerable challenge killing and keeping those team weapons decrewed. Even two panzerwerfers struggle to wipe squads when the targets are mobile and/or spread out.

If anything, their ability to outright destroy team weapons might need to be looked at, because outright obliterating the ATGs can be all I need to make a final push. That's probably the most broken thing about panzerwerfers. That, and the reduction in cooldowns could probably be tweaked a bit, as they can start rapid firing barrages with vet, well beyond any allied player's ability to reinforce.

I think the pak howie is probably the only unit that might routinely struggle to survive against it, mostly because it decrews itself way early. At best, that's a pak howie issue, not a panzerwerfer.

Also, IIRC, the katyusha always overshoots its target slightly, so for best results you place the far edge of the AoE on your target, not the center of it. This may have easily changed though, I haven't specifically tested it in a long time. But that might explain the variation in perceived effectiveness.

The Pwerfer is overperforming for sure, not least of which is its ability to deal with units in garrison far too effectively.

Its very concept is a squad wiping machine, and this I dislike. The unit has no counterplay, either it hits and wipes or it doesn't and you survive to try again. It should do damage over a longer period of time to help players have obvious counterplay to it. To compensate cool downs or AoE could be increased, etc. to make it lethal when it does.

It is also able to pair very well with the Arty officer, and help to saturate areas, especially late game as vps are ticking down.

Relic nerf it, coz this wipes are so stupid (and supression). Nerf PW and CaliiOP.

Panzerwerfers are great against groups of team weapons, especially those ATGs that blob up and a-move.

That said, if I am trying to use a Panzerwerfer to specifically kill a single MG crew covering an approach or a single pak in a field, they actually aren't that reliable unless they pull up silly close.

When my opponent's entire force is all in one screen width, all crammed together, I can inflict a ton of damage though. Conversely, if my opponents spread their units out further out than a single rocket's blast, then it can be a considerable challenge killing and keeping those team weapons decrewed. Even two panzerwerfers struggle to wipe squads when the targets are mobile and/or spread out.

If anything, their ability to outright destroy team weapons might need to be looked at, because outright obliterating the ATGs can be all I need to make a final push. That's probably the most broken thing about panzerwerfers. That, and the reduction in cooldowns could probably be tweaked a bit, as they can start rapid firing barrages with vet, well beyond any allied player's ability to reinforce.

I think the pak howie is probably the only unit that might routinely struggle to survive against it, mostly because it decrews itself way early. At best, that's a pak howie issue, not a panzerwerfer.

Also, IIRC, the katyusha always overshoots its target slightly, so for best results you place the far edge of the AoE on your target, not the center of it. This may have easily changed though, I haven't specifically tested it in a long time. But that might explain the variation in perceived effectiveness.

I'm sorry but you're wrong. Here's a random video I found on youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgFtcpL4oj4

It destroys single weapon teams along with groups. It completely destroys units in garrison and the building itself. A vet3 mortar was instantly wiped in the video. Katyusha does not do that generally and it gives you time to escape/retreat. It also pins everything in the vicinity.

If you have trouble with mobile units, maybe you're not predicting their movement, or learning to delay their movement with troops of your own before unleashing panzerwerfer. We'll see in patch notes if there's a nerf or not but I believe there will be.

Okay, first off that video is just a collage of rockets hitting. You don't see or hear the rockets firing.

A absolute ton of those shots were units that weren't moving, or did not change their pathing once during, before, or after the barrage.

But most of all, the vast majority of those blasts didn't decrew.

But I'll concede that they're absolutely devastating to garrisons. Both the werfer and the Fuss are ridiculous in that.

But the way buildings take damage, get destroyed (or not) in this game is already odd and offputting.

Let's not forget it can kill USF armor in a single volley, too.

i saw tons of support teams decrew... maybe that's just me then. As you can see it's an amateur video. Most of the time, the delay time between when the rockets fire and land is too short. If I hear it, press retreat, i still lose the whole squad. Again, we will see in future patch notes what relic thinks of the situation.

There's a difference between MP loss and squad wipe. I don't see Katyusha causing squadwipes on the first barrage unless maybe point blank. It causes damage and MP loss. There's is no chance of retreat and is uncounterable. That is not the point of this game. Otherwise, B4 would still be in full effect.

PW= Katy precision shot... But without vet....and with more rockets.... And with better rockets...and with supression... Suuuure reluc remobed precision shot because its not the way they want the game to but but OBVIOUSLY the PW is fine....

You can't really complain about an early-game indirect fire weapon being wiped by a late-game indirect fire weapon.

It'd be like saying "try to move your infantry without the pack howie causing you MP loss"

I don't see a katushya doing it. And besides, the pak howie is 380 MP, a huge investment for USF. Yes I complain when a 380 mp crew weapon can't retreat nor move out of an area in time.

There are two ways of tweaking the PWerfer:


The first (and easiest) option: Increase its price to match its performance. 100-120 fuel.

Second option: Nerf it . Put it into T0 > unlocked after BP2. Or just put it into T3 directly.

SOV T4 = OST T3 so it only makes sense to put the PWerfer into T3

@Dustbing; you didn't pay enough attention;

You need the PW to counter those mentioned unit.

Should have bigger AoE of suppression, but lower AoE dmg.

I really think it's fine (without the suppression).
If you decide to bunch up your units in 1 freakin' area, you should get punished for it.

I really think it's fine (without the suppression).
If you decide to bunch up your units in 1 freakin' area, you should get punished for it.

So you say that if Katuysha could erase your vet 3 pak, vet 3 HMG42 or vet GrW without any chances to survive, it would be fine?

If I can't move out, even when I start moving the moment I hear rockets, it's fine?

If I have double Rifles, IS and I hit "T" the moment I hear rocket, yet I still get wipes, it's fine?

Imagine katysuha wiping double vet 4 Obers without chances to survive, would be fine?

Gosh, if PzWerfer is fine, bring me back B4's precision strike

I really think it's fine (without the suppression).
If you decide to bunch up your units in 1 freakin' area, you should get punished for it.

No problem. Bring Katyushas up to the same standard then. If people are intent on having squadwipes, okay, just let all the factions get a squadwipe rocket arty and be done with it, not just Axis (and a certain p2w US commander).

So you say that if Katuysha could erase your vet 3 pak, vet 3 HMG42 or vet GrW without any chances to survive, it would be fine?

If I can't move out, even when I start moving the moment I hear rockets, it's fine?

If I have double Rifles, IS and I hit "T" the moment I hear rocket, yet I still get wipes, it's fine?

Imagine katysuha wiping double vet 4 Obers without chances to survive, would be fine?

Gosh, if PzWerfer is fine, bring me back B4's precision strike

Instawipes? Son, the PW is good I agree but it does not instawipe every god damn teamweapon. I too play COH2 and I play a lot of brit. I don't get mad when my AT gun gets wiped when the PW drives up close and takes the shot when I can hear it coming.

Sorry but no.

Oh, and I love to see the old B4 coming back. Would be awesome to see it wipe Brit emplacements.

No problem. Bring Katyushas up to the same standard then. If people are intent on having squadwipes, okay, just let all the factions get a squadwipe rocket arty and be done with it, not just Axis (and a certain p2w US commander).

Katy can use a serious buff imo. Now it's like 'aaaaw cute'

Instawipes? Son, the PW is good I agree but it does not instawipe every god damn teamweapon. I too play COH2 and I play a lot of brit. I don't get mad when my AT gun gets wiped when the PW drives up close and takes the shot when I can hear it coming.

Sorry but no.

Oh, and I love to see the old B4 coming back. Would be awesome to see it wipe Brit emplacements.

Uhh... sorry but no. B4 belongs to Soviet and there's no Sov vs. UKF at the moment... you sure have great knowledge of factions for playing so much...

Katy can use a serious buff imo. Now it's like 'aaaaw cute'

If you listen to the rest of the community, most people say katyusha is the most balanced rocket artillery at the moment. All others should go to its level, not the other way around.

Wiping squads with no time to react or counter play destroys the game. Which is why katyusha was nerfed when it used to do that, b4 was nerfed because it could do that, isu-152 was nerfed for squad wiping, commandos was nerfed for damage, obers with mg34 was nerfed, sturms were nerfed, stuka damage/aoe was nerfed. Anything that involves squadwiping with no counterplay usually gets nerfed if it gets over used.

Katy can use a serious buff imo. Now it's like 'aaaaw cute'

Yeah

When I hear a Panzerwerfer, Stuka or Calliope, I'm like "RUN FOR YOUR LIVES! RUUUUUUUUUN!!!"

Katyusha is like, "lol, I don't know if I can even bother to move my guys, it will probably kill 1 or 2 models at best, anyway"

Hmm.. I don't know that it's correct to compare the Katty with the PWer guys.
I think you have to consider the squadsize here.

OSTH has 4 man squads, while Sov has 6 man squads (overall). So I think the arty of OSTH can be slightly 'better' to make up for that. I don't know if you can follow me here, but if 3 men get killed in an artillery barrage, it's much more of an impact for OSTH than it is for Sov.

It can be toned down a tiny bit though.