[Winter Balance Update] SOV Feedback

ram and T-34-76s are useless without offmaps though

You can buff it as needed.

How is isu getting nerf? 100% pen and cheaper now

Its high explosive range is reduced by 10, so you're already slow and vulnerable unit now has to get closer to do its job which makes it vulnerable to dives from the newly buffed Panthers which the newly nerfed SU85s are worse at fending off. Plus less armor.

"Other vehicles" have lower rear armor because the Soviets have T-34-76 as their only standard turreted tank. Ostheer and OKW both have nondoctrineal Panthers, there is no reason to balance the ISU as if it were to face T-34-76.

The change in the rear armor makes no difference for Panther.

Penal Battalion

Show Spoiler

Hm, I appreciate the change but this doesn't change the fact that penals scale quite badly against upgraded volks or 5men Grens. Especially not for their cost of 300MP. T1 openings take quite a heavy toll on your manpower (especially since healing costs 250 MP for some reason). I'd suggest lowering the penal cost to 280 mp to better reflect their combat performance on top of the changes above. A tommy squad is at 270 and with the global 5th man upgrade I'd rather have that squad instead of a penal any time.

M5 Half-Track

Show Spoiler

Gotta see how this plays out, if it becomes too much of a dice roll to take down a plane,

Please this. I haven't played 1v1's in awhile, but in team games, the extra cost of Penals really hinders them in the early game. Combined with not scaling well, it makes T1 starts difficult on many maps. The RA might help MP bleed a little, but not enough to make a difference.

The AA nerf to the M5 is way too much. Combined with the T70 nerfs, it makes T3 unappealing. If they're going to do this, they should make T3 optional.

A lot of these changes feel like a nerf to Soviets.

Penal changes doesn't really change late game MP bleed as most deaths come from explosives. Received accuracy buff is nice vs tanks but again most models in late game will die from indirect, explosives and such. If reducing MP bleed is the goal then a t3/t4 upgrade to reduce reinforce cost should be implemented (like OST or cons 7th man upgrade).

ZiS gun. I feel this has been a long time coming. The barrage ability is way too powerful. High cost sure, but very strong area denial weapon.

T-34 ram at vet 1. Can't say I agree with this. This is the main way to deal with super heavies in team games. Vetting a t-34 is not an easy task considering what tanks it is up against and how flimsy it is. As other people have pointed out, the T-34/85 is more expensive to throw away with a ram ability. I see this as Axis getting a huge buff because this nerfs the ram/il-2 combo which in return buffs super heavies such as elefant, king tiger and jagdtiger.

Katyusha. I'm excited to try the Katyusha creeping barrage ability. Being able to move my infantry behind a slow moving, large area buff as the ability was originally intended for will be awesome.

SU85. Another buff to super heavy axis tanks. Especially to their frontal armour.

Maxim
The sustain fire seem oppressive at start and progressively losing power.
I suggest a MU increase and discount with each vet level.

what the actual fuck? seriously vipper? the maxim has to PAY for an ability that allows it to perform like a normal MG... if anything sustained fire needs to be free...

the amount of cognitive bias it takes to even suggest this is amazing...

what the actual fuck? seriously vipper? the maxim has to PAY for an ability that allows it to perform like a normal MG... if anything sustained fire needs to be free...

the amount of cognitive bias it takes to even suggest this is amazing...

Have you play a single patch game as soviets?

Easy just don’t play Soviets in team games. Seems to be the goal with a lot of these changes. But don’t worry because penals are slightly more effective now and that surely balances it all out. Even though penals still have no real AT or snare and lack any form late game scaling so they have to rely on other units from T3 and T4 to and pray it can lead to a win. Oh wait those all just got nerfed huh......

the goal is to remove the soviets from the game entirely

Have you play a single patch game as soviets?

the maxim takes 4 seconds to suppress things at maximum range... sustained fire brings it to around 1 second which is on par with other machineguns of a similar price range... but sure "maxim OP"

That's the idea, but now you only have to avoid the vetted T34(s) to prevent it. More doable than avoiding 3+ T34's at once.

yes of course... you're not gonna see 3+ T34s anymore since nobody`s gonna play the soviets now since you've literally nerfed every single half decent soviet core unit in the game...


the faction already underperforms and these changes essentially REMOVE IT FROM THE GAME...

the maxim takes 4 seconds to suppress things at maximum range... sustained fire brings it to around 1 second which is on par with other machineguns of a similar price range... but sure "maxim OP"

I will have to take that a "NO I have not played single patch game as the soviets."

Have you play a single patch game as soviets?

You are paying munitions for a timed ability that you have to use before the enemy walks into your cone of fire just to do what the mg42 does out of the box.

I will have to take that a "NO I have not played single patch game as the soviets."

i will take that as cognitive bias...

The change in the rear armor makes no difference for Panther.

then in all fairness it shoudnt be lowered if it wont make a difference for panthers. p4's already outshine t34's in most aspect but price. and they have panthers as stock backup. whom also get a undeserved and unneeded buff to accuracy.

then in all fairness it shoudnt be lowered if it wont make a difference for panthers. p4's already outshine t34's in most aspect but price. and they have panthers as stock backup. whom also get a undeserved and unneeded buff to accuracy.

Not really.

There is not reason for ISU-152 to have higher rear armor than Elefant and JT. If an ISU-152 get flanked it should be in disadvantage.

Not really. There is not reason for ISU-152 to have higher rear armor than Elefant and JT.

there's no reason for the maxim to need munitions on a timed ability to do what any other machinegun does out of the box for free but here we are...

impressive double standards by vipper....

there's no reason for the maxim to need munitions on a timed ability to do what any other machinegun does out of the box for free but here we are...

impressive double standards by vipper....

Pls try to provide feedback on the patches preferably after you try it than instead of feedback on me.

its has the anti infantry of a panzer 4 while being completely helpless against armor for a 30% fuel discount... while costing even more fuel to deploy than a panzer 4 initially due to expensive soviet teching and AT nade/molotov sidetechs

Fact Check: False
It's only a 25% fuel discount, 120 fuel compared to 90 fuel. 120 x 0.75 = 90 fuel.

Pls try to provide feedback on the patches preferably after you try it than instead of feedback on me.

don't comment till you get rid of your double standards vipper...

Fact Check: False
It's only a 25% fuel discount, 120 fuel compared to 90 fuel. 120 x 0.75 = 90 fuel.

why thank you... that actually helps my argument... yeah (1-90/120)*100 = 25%

So some ideas for further penals and T1 changes in general:

1. Give penals some sort of AT snare. Just let them get the conscript AT grenade when that is teched. Would be a massive improvement to T1 builds to actually have a chance to fight against light vehicles without relying on the small doctrinal AT gun.

2. Tie some buffs for penals into the mobilize reserves upgrade. They don't need to get a 7th man or cover bonus like conscripts do. But giving them say a cheaper reinforcement cost or a reduced model size would be a good way to give them better late game.

3. Buff the SU76 to be reliable AT. The nerf to the T70 should give more wiggle room to make other T3 units more viable on their own. With T1 builds not having any reliable AT, making the SU76 their form of AT would be a great addition to helpi0ng T1 builds actually be viable without taking doctrines into account. An idea to do this could be making the SU76 cheaper but only able to reliably handle light vehicles until it vets up (say only at vet 2 could it reliably pen a Pz4). Whatever the exact values would be idk but this would give the SU76 strong synergy with T1 openings.

Not all the changes above need to be done but they could be fantastic in making T1 builds more viable on their own. I think there are some other things that need to be done also for how many nerfs the soviets are getting but those are also a lot more numerous.

For now maybe like a slight cost reduction in T4 to compensate all of those nerfs to the T34, SU85, and Katy. Say make it 10 fuel cheaper or whatever could make it bit easier for the Soviets to tech up even though the units they are getting are overall worse now.