1- Because you are paying for Shock models. Situational is the case when you have to decide on whether you want to steal a weapon on the field or not and you don't have enough time for another squad to take it.
Armor (in case of Shocks) or good RA Elite infantry is only gonna help you slightly against infantry squads small arm fire without vet. Scatter weapons (vehicles), grenades, indirect fire or flame based weapons ignore all that.
Yes, a vet 0 Pio/Engineer might struggle a bit more, but any combat unit which gains real vet will offset the base stats of those units.
Which is why i suggested if weapon teams should gain RA with vet as well. The combination of ample amounts of light cover in mid to late game + weapon upgrades + vet basically cuts down the effectiveness of MGs overall.
2- Because it leds to weird behaviours whenever you tried to build a unit or call in it.
The UI doesn't show fractions therefore you could be at 90/100 popcap and instead really be at 90.4/100. While a constructed unit might stay in build queue till popcaps frees out, there were instances of call in units not been built and still consuming the resources.
I mean, in the case of Shocks their survivability is almost entirely due to their armour/base RA. They only get a 17% bonus from Vet. They're still very survivable even without that bonus, but I suppose I see your point.
2 - That makes sense. Surprised Lelic didnt catch something like that during development... Well, actually, I suppose I'm not surprised. |
1- Yep. Also even if they are the same unit, they are different entities with their own profiles. With years some units had been made to be similar and even the PV which basically have the same weapons, have different vet (Combat bliz =/= Blitzkrieg and vet 3)
2- Popcap system has been reworked through out the years. Before, each member of the squad used to have a fraction value of the total cost of the squad.
Nowadays it's squad popcap cost + 1 for each member.
Recrewing with elite squad support weapons end up been a bad idea, due to the cost to reinforce.
Shock-reinforced weapons teams are INCREDIBLY survivable, however. I think it's situational.
Any particular reason Pop was changed to be like that? Unrelated, but I've similarly heard Armour was calculated differently back in the day, but I don't know exactly what was different. Lotta changes that are poorly documented. |
Sure, go back to the 500VP games with meta commanders and you’ll see it.
Also look up something called hyperbole. 👌
Are there some recent tournaments where Ostheer had an 80% winrate? |
Almost as if germans haven't provided expert level elite training on ordnance that wasn't native to them, while squad size for soviets doesn't magically change depending on what squad operates, US forces after years of trial and error finally discovered that german vehicles also have doors and hatches they can use the same way they can for their own vehicles.
That's not really much of an argument, every faction has precisely the same veterancy for stolen units, they all apparently provide the same training for captured equipment as their own.
OKW being able to vet to five with captured gear would be exactly the same sort of faction flavouring as USF being able to decrew captured vehicles, or Soviet being able to crew team weapons up to six men (And subsequently merge with them). The only real reason they aren't like this is because it would mean Lelic would need to put in extra work to decide what every single non-OKW unit in the game would have for their vet 4 and 5.
Remember that they don't even get Fiveman Vet on captured Ostheer vehicles/equipment, it's not some "thematic training issue".
Also: An MG crewed with Shock Troops takes the same population space as one crewed with Conscripts. non-soviet MGs do cost two more pop when crewed by any soviet unit though, simply as they have two extra models over what they're "meant" to have. I presume this is all you mean. |
A 185 fuel costing medium tank that can be spammed, being able to single handily destroy a heavy tank that costs 230 fuel is BS.
Tank destroyers are meant to counter tanks, should a single Jackson be able to destroy a tiger now?
It can, assuming you use it as it's meant to be used. The Panther is a brawling "TD", the Jackson is a TD that relies on its range advantage. |
The healing is actually quite dope. While not, say... Quantifiable, it is a huge bonus to pressure and field presence. Less so against WFA because the AOE healing and forward retreats designed specifically to minimize the impact of retreating but against soviet its rather powerful in knowing unless the enemy squad headed back to base you will be full HP and they will not.
Vision also has value in picking engagements or seeing what's coming a bit sooner to position support. Again not quantifiable but has as much value as a good commander can extract (which imo is the best kind of "extra" vet for OKW to have)
Sure, but in DIRECT COMBAT accuracy and RA are still undeniably preferable. The healing and vision are certainly good, they're just not combat stats. |
yeah cus volks get healing and vision in vet 4/5...
Healing is alright, but isnt a combat statistic. The vision is similarly OK, but only defensively, given that it's an "in cover" bonus, and not as significant as other units vision-in-cover bonuses.
If you're actually fighting other units RA or Accuracy is generally preferable. |
The issue with LMG Grens is that they are good in a vacuum but when it comes to actual matches they are rather inflexible in combat. They are pretty good at max range but when you have to attack your opponent they struggle greatly due to being squishy before Vet 3 and not being able to use the LMG on the move at all. They also have the highest reinforce cost of mainline infantry until Tier 4 is built which drops it to 28 from 30. Now of course they have less models per squad but due to how squishy they are I find they drop models like crazy before they get their Vet 3 bonus. I think if Grens had a more versatile upgrade instead of the LMG42 they would actually be pretty solid. Maybe swap LMG's and G43's and give them a third G43 for an increase in muni cost to 60 from 45. Make the LMG-42 doctrinal like the M1919 for USF. So instead every one uses 5-man upgrade because it gives Grens great durability and isn't much weaker than the firepower the LMG provides. VSL definitely needs to have the 10% received accuracy bonus that you get for upgrading removed.
Ostensibly Pgrens are supposed to fill the "assault" role for Ostheer. Grens are indeed "meant" to hang back and shoot things from max range as much as possible.
Im not sure the G43 and MG42 need switching, really. |
Bonuses are multiplicative nor additive.
Ah, I wasnt sure which it was, thanks. Either way, Rifles still have significantly better RA than Volks at vet3/5. |
7 years and counting?
The sound bug i think it's more related to a situation on which there are a lot of sounds going on at the same time and that can apply to any type of sound.
I presume there are a limited number of sound channels, and for some reason Relic hasn't given Grenade Audio priority, honestly. |
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