The walking stuka is too good at one specific thing, that is what im saying
Obers in battlegroup? Lol that weapon upgrade better be much later. If 7man conscripts have to wait for t4, lmg obers in med truck is not okay
That is the whole OKW faction design... "too good at one specific thing" but badly complemented or expensive.
And please elaborate what is exatly Wstukas "too good at", since you dont agree that such expressions leave room for misinterpretation, exaggeration and subjective opinions of the balance situation?
Obers topic is already off, wanna bring Conscript to the table now? Are you trolling? |
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tnx elchino7, i was about to do the same. But the point is still solid, OH and SU benefit from not having FRP because they can have other options, to name a few, Stock rocket arty or elite infantry on T1 (or T2) |
Make leig as USF pak howi - problem solved (and thread to rebalance pak howi could be closed - 2 birds 1 stone). Basic mechanics such as "distance-scatter" must work for all units no matter which side.
We both have a true agreement. Nice idea about leigs. (i must confess i liked the leig semi ATG idea though)
LOCK IT TO TIER 4, MAKE OBER TO MED TRUCK, INFRARED TO MECH
Yeah i do like that very much too. But it will still wipe the crap out of their team weapons, just a couple of minutes later.
Obers on med truck sound fantastic though |
The katusha only has much faster ToT if move it close, which you need to for it be truly effective. This is a part of the whole picture. The stuka plays by none of the range/LOS rules
A true player knows that forcing a retreat is already a victory, there is no need to get the wipes every single time a katyusha rocket volley is fired.
You can always retreat or move infantry squads when under fire of wstuka and they wont get wiped, just take not not to make them run over the line AoE. Therefore kats and stukas are similar when referring to normal infantry.
Dont make me start with team weapons vs katyushas, you know how that will end...
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The circle which comes in 4 sets of 4, so you have plenty of time to dodge most of the rockets
I would like it to be cheaper and delayed in timing. And i agree with adamiricz, it should be better against blobs, worse at deleting single units
4 sets of 4 rockets are meant to give time to players to press that R button, otherwise its a wiping machine. Also kat rockets land way faster followed by its sound queue than wstukas.
There is no reason to change wstukas into other role for the sake of it. If you want to change that then you must adjust other units aswell, making the solution bigger than the problem. Devs cant afford trial and error if we dont discuss first which changes should be implemented.
All I'm trying to say is to keep it the way it is but delay it until flak hq is built. If that can't be done make it less lethal before flak hq is up.
Your proposition is a bit too much harsh for OKW players.
The best solution is either middleground or tweaking, redesigning with improvements rather pulling the game down |
If wstuka soo bad and have so many disadvantages - make all arty rock arty the same? 6 deadly, laserguided rockets. Then all players will be in equal positions. Sounds as BS, but it's better way to see situation from both sides.
Dont be like that, no one is arguing wstukas are bad.
They have its differences to other rocket arty. Oriented towards fighting team weapons rather blobs.
Its true they are very effective at it and somehow OKW other indirect fire option (leiGs) are better vs emplacements and garrisons, if we exclude smoke.
There could be a option to make leiGs cover the actual wstuka role and at the same time tweak wtsukas into a katyusha 'clone' |
Problem that you don't have any chances to retreat your team weapon on whole front when Wstuka fires. Any small moment that you missed and you lose very big amount of troops. No any rockarty could give you that. Katy could shredded blobs, werfer could too. But these are blobs, blobbers must suffer, especially when rocket arty on field.
And again - routes of retreat. If we could change routes to retreating squads in live action - Wstuka didn't be so much shock and then OKW players will be in hard situation, when enemy could evade even retreating squad your precise strike. It's just live exploit of situation where player don't have any power. You just unwilling viewer of doom of your soldiers. It's not fun.
Mostly agreed, if the barrage fall off were delayed, some team weapons could have a chance to move and only very distracted ones will get hit.
I also think that aligning the AoE patter to the vehicle orientation could help to increase the skill required to use wstukas |
... we are arguing that the lethality comes too early.
Sorry to step in, the too early expression is not objective enough, at least for everyone to settle up a common ground of discussion. (or it seems like you dont like your team weapons getting wiped too early)
I think the worst situation is tightly related to the Pak howitzer, there is a whole thread for it so i wont offtopic, but the fact that OKW can deal with it using wstukas is solidified withing the game design. If you nerf one, then you should nerf the other one too.
When would be the ideal timing for wstukas to show? IMO between mediums and other rocket infantry or its opportunity window will just disappear |
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I love the idea, but it has many flaws, but again i want to see more KT.
The main issue is game design/balance and the other one is KT balance itself.
Other than that thanks for the mod! |
Yeah, its terribly designed 
Six precision shots in a row… 
Needs to be worse at wiping single units that are even trying to dodge and better at countering blobs
That is related to the actual IRL wstuka firing pattern, the rockets were all aimed at the same angle, the vehicle then launched a single rocket, advanced a few meters, fire again and repeat. At the other end the rockets fell exactly at the same pattern the vehicle did. The rockets were fairly precise and the game mimics that.
In the actual game it can be a little unfair because you can always rotate the angle of the line the rockets land, you can even shoot them backwards. If the aoe were linear but always aligned to the wstuka it would requile lots, lots of skill to get 2-3 teamweapons in the same volley. |
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