I just played with Tactical Support Regiment. Aside of 150 munition vickers/6pdr bundle this commander is pretty useless.
Not only that but "Forward HQ" or whatever it's called is actually bugged.
Once it's destoyed you cant make another one and I'm pretty sure you cant make two of them at the same time. So if you lose one you're bummed.
Kinda hilarious nobody even noticed commander-defining ability being bugged for so long
Yeah I noticed that, I kinda just assumed it was lelic being lelic and just nerfing it for the sake of it. |
Also...
I honestly think i know a lot more about the British faction and their mechanics in this game than you
Currently you're yet to prove you know anything about the British faction in this thread mate, so I suggest you keep your God complex to yourself and find something constructive to say before we just dismiss you as trolling?
We're trying to have a productive discussion and brainstorming sesh here and nothing you've said has helped or promoted that. |
Buff it but make it slow like the Churchill I'd say. It's an infantry tank so that's probably more historically accurate and a 'light' vehicle that's durable rather than fast isn't something the game has right now.
Yeah I suppose totally revamping it's combat purpose would work, I quite like that, a sort of Heavy T-70 I guess? But yeah, you'd need it early, either 3 CP max or just allow it to be built from the platoon command post, in order for it to be effective. Just keep the recon ability at 8CP instead. The unit actually being useful early game would allow you to get some vet on it as well for once!
As I said previously, the valentine has a smoke mortar on it already. Allowing UKF to get it out early to deploy smoke for their infantry would give them a much needed offensive buff at the start of the game too, especially against MGs, without needing a mortar pit.
Would be a great "screw you" to a Panzer II rush as well. XD |
Thread: vickers20 Aug 2018, 13:24 PM
Tbh nerfing anything british right now is just kicking them whilst they're down. UKF are so teetering on the edge of being unplayable at the moment and people are still saying they're OP?
Yeah imo, the vickers is probably one of the best MGs in the game because of its kill potential but making it an mg34 clone? Just why? Currently british infantry are crap, they lose to anything out of cover and when in cover they pretty much just lose again because they cost so much, the vickers and Universal carrier are the only things keeping early UKF infantry play afloat right now.
Considering how good mortars are against garrisons now, people really shouldn't be having a problem dealing with MGs. Might I remind everyone that Brits are the ONLY faction in the game that cannot respond to mobile mortars unless you let them build a pit as they don't have their own mortar team nor a mortar halftrack, in which case it's your fault anyway. Just build mortars, fire at the MG and then relocate and fire again. The MG will die. You've literally just countered Brits with 1 unit... congrats. GGWP |
Really? I just counter raped them with Hummels and Hotchkiss Walking Stukas.
I never said I was any good at CoH1 XD |
P.S.- 25 pdr emplacements... my arse is still raw from the pounding I got from 25 pdr emplacements as panzer elite in coh1. |
Hey guys, I've scanned this thread so sorry if i end up repeating what people have said, but there's some things I think are worth mentioning.
I think we need to focus on what's going to make british usable, not what we think would be cool or quirky.
so things like adding the scot/honey etc, we already have aec which is really good anyway and light vehicle generally affects only a 10 minute portion of the game. Not that this isn't important, panzer 2 or puma play can straight up win you the game, but british don't really struggle here, especially with how quick you can get a cromwell/centaur out if you want one. In my opinion brits struggle very badly in the late game. they struggle against LefHs, mobile mortars and panther dives due to lack of snares. As well as british infantry are all very expensive other than sappers so the late game blob fests are nearly always won by OKW as they trade out with you better.
Changing the valentine is fiddly, it's never going to be as good as the cromwell, or if you buff it, it becomes literally a cheaper cromwell. It's radar ability is really good, yes, but nerfing and changing it is pretty harsh as you cant fire anything into the fog of war anyway and remember OKW already have the infra red halftrack as stock. Although it's not quite as good as the valentine's it costs 5 fuel and comes earlier, in my opinion that is OP not the valentine. So nerfing the valentine literally is just buffing OKW.
It's very difficult changing the base 25 pdrs as at the end of the day they are basically free and unkillable. However if I go royal artillery, the only dedicated artillery commander in the game, I would expect the best artillery in the game, not the worst.
My opinion on royal artillery is it actually wont take much to make this commander useful, I would propose:
1. Early Warning: Early warning should be changed to be identical to other artillery flares where you get one flare but get to choose the location of the flare.
A small view of random sections of the map is not useful and it costs far too much anyway for something based on luck to find what you are looking for and only covers frontline sectors anyway. The valentine already gives you a view of frontline sectors for free, why would I pay for the same ability. In order to make most of the royal artillery regiment useful, this commander needs it's own PROPER recon, like the other artillery flares or a recon flyover in order to find and counter LeFHs or spot other targets further back than the frontline without relying on an american ally with a major. Someone suggested swapping this for a command vehicle which would also be good because command vehicles can call in recon.
2.Concentration barrage: This used to be the most OP ability in the game, it could be cast through FoW and all airburst shells landed on the marker meaning you could just snipe OKW trucks and LeFHs etc. They essentially double nerfed it by getting rid of the firing through FoW and dispersing the airburst shells.
That change essentially means that whilst LeFHs and ML-20s can be fired into fog of war, the british equivalent can't. In fairness the british equivalent can't be destroyed so it's not completely unfair, but with the change to early warning, this ability becomes a lot more useful as you can actually use it to counter LefHs which is what it should do. Alternatively, you could remove airburst and allow it to fire into FoW, this also seems fair to me as whilst LefHs can be fired for free, they can be destroyed, meanwhile 25 pdrs can't be destroyed but require munitions to fire.
3.Valentine: As much as people complain, the valentine is pretty good, it'll beat up a panzer 2 if need be and the recon is godly and the sexton ability is just downright funny if you get the chance to use it, it can also deploy smoke for your infantry to push mgs as well which is definitely underused.
Perhaps it could be better in combat. the issue is buffing the cannon makes it just a cheaper cromwell, I suppose you could make it fill a similar niche to the puma? like a light tank destroyer might be cool, but the easiest thing to not screw with balance is buff the MGs like the AEC, that way it won't replace the cromwell like the AEC did for a bit and will be good enough to actually fight infantry and hold off panzer 2s etc if need be. I personally like the idea of adding the valentine as a buildable unit at 0 CP from the platoon command post then at 8 CP you unlock the recon ability, seems fairer to me. Makes it actually usable in the early game as a light vehicle but then can revert to it's original use at 8 CP.
4. Sexton: It's a pretty good unit tbh, people always say it needs more range.
If they made concentration barrage to be used with an accurate artillery flare to counter LefHs it wouldn't need the range upgrade. It only feels like it has bad range because you can't counter LefHs with it in my opinion. If you give the regiment the ability to counter LeFHs, the sexton can be used for its intentional use of killing blobs to defend points and squashing mortars and infantry support guns which it does really well already.
5. Perimeter overwatch: Everyone knows it's bad. It's better than people think, but it's bad still.
Use it when the enemy has 50 points left and you have 2 capture points and you win, it's just a niche win button. Either they need a new ability or to fix this one. Best way to fix this is make it 'Sector' overwatch where the 25 pdrs (and maybe all sextons?) work like OKW sector artillery and rapid fire on everything in a chosen sector. For the price (250 muni) I would expect to be able to choose any sector, alternatively decrease the price to 120-150 muni and it could be only owned sectors making it great for defence if you increase the firerate or give it a mix of HE, Airburst and AP shells or something.
Alternatively you could just trade this ability for some other artillery strike or something, maybe railway arty/240mm whatever it's called? like special weapons reg gets?
Also if we're revamping commanders, I would be more than happy to trade the first commander abilty from every regiment for tank hunter sections. Brits need a snare desperately. |
Are we playing the same game?
Churchill penetration stats are: 105-120-135
KT has frontal armor of 375. So the chances to pen that are between 28-36%.
Meanwhile Comet has 210-190-170 pen. Which means it pens a KT frontally between 45-56%.
*Shrugs* 28%-36% is pretty damn good considering how many shots you fire during that duel, With a bit of support, the churchill does really well against the King Tiger right now.
Also Ignore what I said about commandos, I've been using commando reg recently and given good ambush timing etc you can really bleed people hard, that plus demo charges hidden behind corners and the bombing run win button you can really deal with, especially turtley, axis players well. Sneaking commandos with a single piat in to kill rocket artillery and demo charge LefHs works really well too. Commando regiment with a full amount of munitions caches and you can absolutely flatten people. |
Bren is ok, especially as it only costs 45 muni, and I still use the UC every game anyway and the mortar pit I would say needs a revamp instead. It's OP unless they counter it in which case it's unusable.
Comet definitely need a buff, it either needs to go back to being a rival to the panther, or at least needs a lot more penetration. Not being able to pen panthers frontally makes it just a very expensive cromwell with worse anti infantry cos everything can go through the back of a panther anyway. I'd rather the comet become a british version of the Jackson personally though, as anything else it just becomes a worse firefly. It doesn't really need anti infantry, if I want that I'll go churchills. Although churchills already pen KTs through the front just as often as they pen it right now which is really funny.
I also think Infantry sections should be reverted to what they were before because despite the moving and out of cover buff, they still lose to everything else when out of cover and now without the buff they lose to everything in cover as well unless they have brens or you have multiple squads. As without OP Brens, their firing from cover accuracy shouldn't be an issue anymore. |
Yoooooo, so I feel like a lot of people have missed the point of this post and it's been derailed entirely.
Regardless of whether Royal artillery has offmap or onmap or airburst or whether the sexton's range is fair compared to the stuka zu fuss or whatever.
The main point of this post is why royal artillery sucks. Which, regardless of your opinion, is kind of inherently true. UKF is not used in 1v1 right now at all, especially Royal Artillery. And has significant weaknesses in team play, regardless of how good you are. The British faction, IS flawed and unusable in 1v1 especially, that is not up for debate, if it was, people would still be using it according to proportion. Which they aren't.
The main point of this post is how to balance it. Which yes is hard.
My 2 cents on this is:
-The Valentine infra red is good yes, but not OP. It's not that much better than the OKW UHU halftrack and is doctrinal, I would argue the OKW UHU is too powerful in comparison to the valentine as it's stock for OKW. The valentine cannot really be balanced as a passable tank as it will not and should never be as good as the cromwell, which with buffs, it will be. Like I suggested earlier, in my opinion the only buff that can prevent this, is a buff to the MGs like the AEC. Say for example you buff the anti infantry blast radius, unless you decrease the CP requirement it will be useless and that good recon would be too good early game at low CP.
-Royal artillery wasn't OP when you could use concentration barrage through fog of war, it just directly countered LEfHs like it should have done. For 200 munitions, stuka dive bomb also counters ML-20s, and most doctrines have some form of recon with it for very little. The only OP thing was the fact that the airburst all landed in the same place making it stupidly effective against OKW Base trucks which was not the intended purpose. At the moment, even with recon, it still takes 2 concentration barrages to destroy an LefH, which costs the same as a stuka strike, and costs more with recon.
-If you are losing Static arty frequently you are doing something wrong. If you are building static artillery and losing it, they are pushing you/flanking you and shelling it out, in which case, that's on you for leaving holes in your line. Or they are using recon to find it and shell it out, in which case, you should be building anti-aircraft to deal with that. I play both factions and I have never had a problem with losing my static artillery unless I am double teamed to get it destroyed, which in my opinion is fair enough, especially as it's a bargain at 50 fuel.
-If you are losing too many men to the combination of Valentine and Sexton, you are standing still for too long, the same is equally true for UHU + stuka, I would argue that UHU + stuka is more effective as it is more devastating in a shorter time. And that comes stock for OKW.
-Perimeter overwatch, I don't think anyone is arguing that this is good. Although. In my opinion, it's quite underated, they could add light arty support like in tactical support and typhoon strafes and 250 munitions would still be ridiculously over priced. Royal artillery either needs a different ability, like special weps Railway arty, or perimeter overwatch, for 250 munitions, should be utterly the best ability in the game, like tactical support artillery cover for the entire map complete with tank blinding and typhoon strafes, otherwise it will remain unusable, even if it cost 80 munitions, no one would use it. |