Don't expect someone who is crutching on Volks dirt cheapness to respond in any other way, as if LMG Rifles were worth is over Double BAR after the nerf.
Indeed.. |
In my opinion on certain maps like the 3v3 and 4v4 Angermuende map, or other close combat maps you can try something like Soviet Shock Army. You get like 4 conscripts you upgrade them with PPSH-41's and you get like 2 Shock Troops and early-mid game I am pretty certain that you will dominate the infantry game. Late game vetted up shock troops are pretty good IMO and they shed most things pretty easily at close range. I do agree however that the Cons do not scale well into late game and they get shredded by vetted Obers, vetted up volks, and vetted LMG Grens. However in my opinion conscripts can be useful for their merging but mostly for their AT nades. Merging can be good to keep team weapons alive. In my opinion conscripts have better AT capabilities than penals, I think it is much easier to oorahhh into a tank w few conscripts and throw the AT nades at it than for penals to throw the sticky satchels onto the tank.
However this is too situational I definetly agree that conscripts need to be majorly reworked make them competitive and to make them scale better into the late game. I think penals need a little nerf and conscripts need a pretty significant buff in order to make the Soviets more fun, more diverse and more balanced infantry wise.
Good points! I have tried the very same things and found that vs volk spam, it just falls apart even when none of the units are vetted. Shock troops do shred everything at higher vet, but they bleed you soo hard. How do you work around the bleed? |
so remove stg volks right ? ho wait what about lmg for rifle should we remove them too ? but wait there's more what about stg and mg 34 for elite unit? Remove them too ?
Where do I say to remove stg volks? All I am saying is that Cons don't work.
No need to start putting words in my mouth. |
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It seems you hit the AT gun dead on. At least you wiped 3 models from the captain, an echelon squad, 2 models from the major and 7 rifelmen models. That is a lot. |
Sorry: rubbish, frankly. 4 con start, map control is good.
Yeahhh, but then the stg volks show up and the obers and lmg grens. Say goodbye to your 4 cons being anything but cannon fodder. |
Yeah but my point is it's doctrinal for usf and brits. Also, only ostheer has lower entity squads. OKW has volks for the most part, with maybe a few four man squads (obers/sturms) and occasionally (actually, a lot in this circumstance) pfusies, which have more men than usf and british squads. Let me be clear, that doesn't in any way invalidate what you say, in fact, I might go tactical support or royal arty/mobile assault every time I see that an enemy player has chosen or has in their loadout a doctrine with elefant or the jagdtiger doctrine (I'm not playing soviets for the most part in this patch because I don't enjoy spamming penals).
Dude, Elefants and Jagdtigers are doctrinal too lol. |
I'm really sad about this one. I like soviets, but personally, I think penals in their current state are boring, as they are a good combat squad (at the very least bordering on overperforming) but don't have any AI upgrades and their only utility is satchel charges. But then there's cons.
Penals are way too good. They shit on everything for the entire game. Only getting beaten by lmg obers. The problem is that you have to absolutely get penals or you lose the game as Soviets. There is nothing you can do but spam penals.
It is so fucking boring for an otherwise fun faction. |
Not if you don't have it. Otherwise, yes, but you still will be at the mercy of tanks and their artillery wiping YOUR support weapons, which you need to not be at the mercy of tanks. I guess part of my point is, remember when okw complained about not having a nondoc mg and usf complained about not having a mortar? The parallel is that regardless of the balance aspect, it's harmful to leave out basic elements of the game from certain factions, and it's also harmful to have units that make it so you literally can't use basic elements of a faction to the degree that heavy TDs do, and also making said units insanely hard to kill.
That is the entire point of all of my responses in this thread. You go INFANTRY with ARTILLERY. Allied artillery is superior and can do more devastating strikes because you face lower entity squads. |
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I have another one:
Penal syndrome. Either go penals or lose the game. You have no other option but to go penals or you will lose straight up every game. Conscripts suck so hard, it can't be made to work vs stg volks. |
Just wanted to say, I was really presently surprised by the level and quantity of civilized posts for the most part (until you hit the middle of page 2).
That's the thing though, not making tanks really really sucks, as it presents a couple big problems. For one thing, you're going to be bleeding manpower like no tomorrow in the lategame even if you win every engagement, and whatever armor they have will have a major advantage since they're way more mobile than at guns. Then there's the problem of enemy artillery wiping out your at guns and other team weapons, leaving your infantry basically all by themselves sometimes, and if you're brits or usf, chances are you don't even have access to artillery anyway. I'm not saying it's not doable, and it may honestly be the best solution, but I also just wanted to put that out there.
And your artillery can´t wipe their support weapons and infantry? |
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