Profile of Dangerous-Cloth

The most problematic thing being the stug vs the new Jackson, something you didn't bring up because I suspect you haven't even played the FBP.

https://www.coh2.org/topic/62683/fbp-update-v1-2/post/624817

Thanks for the trust bro

Other stuff

I´m fine with your opinions, I don´t agree with them however. As for your remark on repeating the stug nerfs, they are a central theme in the now enlarged Ostheer problem. Tier 3 and Tier 4 have been nerfed. Tier 3 is the crutch and the Stug is the crutch of tier 3. If you can´t see the rising problem, along with the Jackson shitting on the entirety of tier 3 now, then I don´t know what to say.

I didn´t say anything related to the SU85 not being fine. I made a point for the ISU152 and the IS2. The only point I make for the T34/76s is that, although it is cheap and reliable for a 80 fuel vehicle, it enhances the reliance on doctrinal vehicle because it lacks any kind of late game capability.

Ofcourse I do play ostheer and it has more then enough to counters to anything thats coming your way. Also every mp spent as ost is better spent than any other faction in the game. Only problem ost has is 4 man gren squads. Other than that ost has so much good units to choose from that sometimes I feel like a kid in a candy store. Anything I buy with my mp will be delicious.

You have no side techs, you dont rely on any tiers or commanders, all your units are high quality, you have versatile tiers, no hard counters, basically you're living the dream. Ofcourse you have to micro your units well but at least its worth it. With soviets you have to micro your worthless units and its not really worth the effort. ^^

And you have just shown that you don't play Ostheer lol.

I admire your reasoning but you fail to notice one thing, these are not new problems, they last for years now and nothing ever changes about that.

I have not failed to notice this, I have played the game since launch. My point is that the current FBP actually enhances the problems that have existed since launch.

As for your other points, very well put. I agree with some of your views. However, you seem to be a little more Allied minded. Which is fine, but you can't get around the fact of actually acknowlidging that Ostheer's tier situation is fucked as it is and dictates particular play every single game or you lose.

I mean seriously axis dont even have to think strategically in this game because they get all the important stuff anyways.

Have you even played Ostheer?

With the current balance preview focusing fully on tank destroyers, artillery and some other units here and there, I find that the EFA are still (and in some cases ever further now) left behind in 1v1 when it comes to strategic options, diversity and versatility.

Ostheer

Faction design
Ostheer is a faction that relies heavily on combined arms, as its design entails it should. However, Ostheer has a faction related problem where it has to crutch and rely on its tier 3, or have the risk of losing the game in 99% of the cases. Tier 4 is almost always not a tier to that one can reliably get to in a 1v1 game, which is strange to say the least. This problem is to have significant issues if not fixed in the FBP.

Tier 3
Tier 3 is the workhorse of the Ostheer faction. It is the tier on which Ostheer crutches and a tier it can't skip in a 1v1 game, or it will lose the game vs any competent player. Tier 3 itself has some problems here and there, mainly the very cost efficient Stug and the overpriced Panzer IV. The Stug is the backbone of Tier 3 and the Panzer IV, which is the generalist mainline medium tank of the Ostheer faction, somehow is not. The Stug outperforms the Panzer IV in cost efficiency and performs better in many ways, including fighting armored fighting vehicles. The Panzer IV struggles vs cheaper tanks such as the cromwell. You can't rely on the Panzer IV like you can on a stug.

The STUG is getting nerfed (rightly so) in the FBP, but the Panzer IV's price and/or performance are not being adjusted. This means that the potency of the backbone (tier 3) of the Ostheer faction is getting nerfed without any kind of versatility buffs. This is a bad situation.

Since Tier 4 is nothing to write home about (more on that later), Ostheer players have to stick with Tier 3 or risk of losing the game by having no serious armor presence on the field. This means you will get into a vicious circle of getting Tier 3 units for the entire game.

Tier 4
Tier 4 is an entire different problem. The problem with tier 4 is that it is underwhelming and quite expensive to get too. It has an underwhelming 'tank hunter', namely the Panther, which performs nowhere near its cost. It has problems with performing its actual role: 'Hunting Tanks', since it can't hit anything on the move and has pretty poor accuracy on top of that in general. The Brumbahr is however a good unit, but requires constant attack ground babysitting to perform reliably. On top of that, it is expensive in an expensive tier. Lastly, the Panzerwerfer, which is the worst of the non doc rocket artillery, is getting nerfed. This unit is almost never seen in a 1v1, and I predict it will never be seen in a 1v1 after its nerfs. The unit itself is decent, but underwhelming compared to its counterparts. It is in an underwhelming and expensive tier which includes an underwhelming and expensive tank hunter and anti infantry tank. There is no reason to get this unit when you finally get tier 4 in a 1v1.

Tier 3 is getting nerfs in the FBP (stug) and is not getting its versatility adjusted (Panzer IV price reduction and/or performance increase to reflect its current price. On top of this, Tier 4 is getting nerfs as well without receiving any buffs. This means that Tier 4 will remain an underwhelming and overpriced tier with an underwhelming Tank hunter, a decent but micro intensive anti infantry tank and an even more underwhelming rocket artillery unit (weakest non doctrinal rocket artillery too).

There will be now even less incentive to get to tier 4. The FBP actually makes Ostheer tier 4 even more uninteresting and desirable . This is a very bad situation for Ostheer.

Soviets

Versatilty
The Soviet faction has a serious problem in where it has to play a certain way, or it will lose the game quite easily. The underlying fault in this problem is that the Soviet lack any kind of diversity in quality and their core units.

Infantry
The problem with the Soviet faction's infantry is that you need to go penal squads, or face losing the game because your infantry will be out performed in the later stages of the game. On top of this, Penal Battalions perform so well, that there is no incentive to even get conscripts. Not only do conscripts lose to Volksgrenadiers and grenadiers, but will lose quite harshly vs upgraded and vetted up versions of these units later on. No player in their right mind will thus rely on Conscripts.

The fault in this issue was shown by Maxim meta in the past and DHSK and Penal meta in the current live version of the game. The so called mainline infantry is not on par with its counterparts, even more so than grenadiers get outclassed by their counterparts. There is no relying on this unit, thus people resorted to Maxim spamming before the Penal buffs and Penal and DHSK spam after the Maxim nerfs.

The FBP buffs the Maxim and nerfs the Penals and DHSK, but does not fix the underlying problem. This versatility issue is not only limited to infantry however.

Support Weapons
The Soviet faction has some serious problems with team weapons and their performance. The Maxim was nerfed back to the stone age and is now receiving buffs. The DHSK is receiving some nerf, but will still stump the Maxim as a support weapon that can A-move its way easily across the map. However, there will still be nothing resembling a great incentive to choose maxims over DHSKs since you need tier 2 to get it. As Soviets you need tier 1 and your trusty Penals, or else you will face serious problems later on. This means that if you want to use the Maxim, you will need to get both tier 1 and 2. This is too taxing when you also need to get your T70 and/or SU76. Sure you might get tier 2 later on, but then the Maxim will not be up to the task when facing vetted infantry. So what will you do? Yes indeed, you will skip tier 2 and get a DHSK.

The Soviet mortar is another issue in the support weapon spectrum. This mortar is anything but impressive. This mortar has bad performance, poor accuracy, a poor rate of fire and has nothing going for it but its 6 men crew. I have had games where this unit got only one or two kills after 20 minutes. It is, for all intents and purposes, an expensive smoke dropping platform. This means you can't rely on the Mortar for indirect fire, since it not only sucks, but also gets outperformed by its Ostheer counterpart.

The Soviet anti tank field gun is something I see being used more often as indirect fire than the core mortar team. This is an issue.

Tanks and Tank destroyers
The Soviet faction has a very good set of tank destroyers. Their SU76 is very solid Tier 3 tank destoyer that can punch far above its weight. The SU85, although needing some veterancy to become truly potent, is a very good tank destoyer that struggles only with the heaviest of targets. The T34-76s however, the generalist mainline medium tank of the Soviet faction, leaves much to be desired and performs pretty subpar. Although it is very cheap, performs well vs infantry and can be used in mass due to its cheap price, is a serious problem when times get rough and you can only rely on this medium tank to help you through your darkest moments in a game. This means the Soviet faction has no choice but to either spam tank destroyers (su76) or rely on doctrinal tanks (T34-85 and mainly call ins) to fill their ranks with potent medium tanks.

The results of this are shown in almost every game you play as or vs the Soviet Faction. You either play or encounter T34-85s or (mainly) M4C shermans. This problem of course has something to do with the call in mechanics, which are being adjusted in the FBP, but more to do with the core of the Soviet Faction. Nothing in the FBP changes anything in this regard, which means the Soviet faction again has to play a certain way to fill its rank with more potent units (armor).

Further more, the Soviet heavy tanks (and tank destroyers) are all doctrinal. On top of this, the doctrinal heavy tanks are anything but special. When was the last time you encountered an IS2 or an ISU152 in a 1v1? That is right, a long time ago or very few times in the recent months. The IS2 is an expensive heavy call in tank with decent but somewhat lackluster performance that easily gets beaten into submission by 2 Stugs (way cheaper options). The ISU152 is anything but impressive and just leaves too much to be desired. These factors in combination with the T34-76 situation together push M4C sherman play even further, limiting the Soviet faction's versatility and options further. This is something the FBP doesn't adjust.

To add insult to injury, the KV1 dares to show its face as a proper Heavy Tank every solar eclipse.

Conclusions regarding the EFA and the FBP
The FBP, although changing many things for team games in a good and interesting way, does nothing for the versatility limbo in which the EFA operate. In some cases the FBP even negatively strenghtens the versatility limbo of the EFA.

This situation is serious and in serious need of adjustments.

Allied artillery isn't superior in any way. UKF and USF cannot even field proper artillery without commanders.


Show Spoiler

The general problem of the Infantry+Artillery combo is: It works until the axis bring the counter. The counter will usually be something like:
->KT+JP4+Stuka
->JT+P4+Stuka
->Ele+Brummbär+Panzerwerfer+Offmap
->Ele+P4/Ostwind+Offmap
-> so in general: strong AI tank + strong AT tank + strong Artillery unit/offmap, supported by sporadic infantry

Speaking about lower entity squads: ... tell that the USF/UKF players who go up against OKW with Pfusiliers and Volksgrens. Soviets are dead in the endgame anyways, unless they receive life support from USF or UKF.

I agree with your points, however saying that in the current live version Allied artillery is weak is stretching realms or reality here. The calliop and land mattress and kattyushas are capable of delivering very good artillery and are superior to the non doctrinal artillery form OKW and Ost.

Now yes they are doctrinal, but so are the units we are discussing in this thread. It seems there is a general consensus that countering doctrinal tank destroyers with other doctrinal units (artillery in my example) is somehow unreasonable.

As for the powerful off maps, the Brits have the most powerful ones in the game, they are totally insane. Stuka loiter goes into the same window as well. As for Soviets having nothing in the late game. Vet 3 shock troops run through everything, as do penals. I play Soviets a lot lately and penals shit on everything at vet 3. They only come into trouble vs mass vet 5 stg volks and lmg obers. Guess what, Allied artillery wipes them pretty easily!