What if Volks became a long range/close range squad with anemic damage at medium range?
Laser accurate but low damage Kar98Ks, and a single model with a buffed SMG to represent a squad leader. They trade very evenly in long range fights (except against UKF) and trade well in close range fights, but lose hard in medium range fights against Penals and Rifles because of hypothetically tweaked Kar98Ks with reduced damage. You could then choose between x4 MP44s which turn them into more of a CQC squad, or a single LMG34 upgrade. There is defintely overlap with Sturmpios if this ever happened, but then Sturmpios could have a more defined role as AT/support infantry.
can someone comment on this? I think its a really unique concept that could be applied to other infantry squads.
(Gren squad leader model with G43, soviet leader with PPSH-41, Rifle leader with carbine.)
Luftwaffe Really doesn't have anything particularly big time or good right now.
Falls are average infantry for their cost and often are behind in the veterancy game.
Recon overflight, nice complementary ability.
Vallaiant assault-probably the best part of the doctrine, no comment on buff values but its a nice type of ability to have access to.
Flak emplacement- Really doesn't fit the doctrine. Either make it bigtime like pak 43(pretend its a flak 88) to make this more attractive or just go all out offensive abilities, like a real airstrike
Airbourne assault- Pretty mediocre ability. You save up a ton of munitions to basically convert it to manpower. The pin and 1 strafe aren't worth much. The falls have no vet and come vs multiple tanks when their performance was already questionable. Its also likely that they can die on landing easily to vehicles.
It would be most useful it it cost some manpower and a lot less munitions. So you didn't have to save for so long to use it. 300 Mp, 125 munitions? It could be more a part of strategy than a once a game mabye thing. vet 0 falls still gonna bleed badly though and i would assume you already have falls, their in another ability
Overall- It needs something big time so it can even pretend to be useful lategame since its mediocre in the midgame and early game right now. Nothing gamechanging comes on the ground or in the air right now.
Well a proper change should consider the whole picture, callins included.
And obers do actually require a bit of a compliment, much like sturms, in that they need acreening, cheaper units or they lose their cost effectiveness.
But volks do fill the role of a cheap recrewer.
This is more or less the crux of it. Volks, with only their bolt action rifles, fit the role they need to for the OKW faction.
Their STG upgrade currently simply improves their all round effectiveness/mitigates their weaknesses. A full smg package would have situational utility, synergy with okw callins, and support the faction by filling a role that is actually largely unviable for okw.
But more than anything, full smgs instead wuld mean OKW players would/could leave volks unupgraded, which is where they are actually a balanced unit for the faction.
But like the above poster said, incendiary nades are a big factor. Normal nades for volks I think should be the case, with theincendiary being only doctrinal, or with the smg upgrade, or with vet.
STG in current form overlaps with BARs as well, same price and is a general DPS increase. OKW needs to be different than USF.
good long range units, ability to contest and hold the map well at that stage, durable units, ability to efficiently inflict manpower bleed. Note that this talking about 1v1.
Volks lose to double LMG/elite infantry, Obers are only good if you are already winning. Puppchen lategame is very bad unless you are already winning, ISG is only good because Flak protection and if it has vet. OKW light vehicles don't scale into the lategame well (aside from arty hunting Pumas) unless you are already winning, and OKW MP bleed options aside from a vetted ISG are Shu Mines and direct damage.
Double BAR rifles with smoke, Shermans with smoke that scale exponentially with Radio Net, dirt cheap bazooka infantry and nondoctrinal off-map recon and arty, light vehicles that are worth building lategame (for shell shock, mines, and flank control), mortars, and the HMC that is a squad wipe machine are all insanely effective lategame tools, if not super micro intensive. OKW pummels USF before this point is reached, so its a moot point though.
Due to WFA tech structure, Volks & upgrades have to hold out against each of the following potential threats (both individually and as a combination of said threats):
- Penals, with de-facto mid-long-range good performance
- Tommies, with de-facto long-range performance
- Tommies & Brens
- Riflemen
- Riflemen & Bars
- Riflemen & LMG
- Conscripts
- Conscripts & PPSh
So, IMO, the only two upgrades that would work for that would be either:
- An LMG42 upgrade; in that case we also give OKW access to T0 weapons and effectively remove them from the game, because now they've become Ostheer
- The weird STG weapon curve they have which gives them certain ranges to perform vs the forementioned units for each matchup
I can't think of any curve that will work vs each of the forementioned threats, and I can't think of any combination of upgrades that would help Volks to fight.
If you think that forcing Volks to pick mp40 alone will solve anything, feel free to give it a whirl in DBP trying the firestorm doctrine. You can maybe use up to 1 squad of Volks max tactically, but upgrading all of your squads with mp40, or letting the rest of the squads unupgraded is suicide.
Sure, we could tweak the curves a bit if necessary, e.g., cost, to prevent snowballing, and fire-on-the-move performance to prevent blob-ability. However, volks need to have a role in the late-game which is ideally complementary to Obersoldaten, without turning OKW into Ostheer v2.0.
What if Volks became a long range/close range squad with anemic damage at medium range?
Laser accurate but low damage Kar98Ks, and a single model with a buffed SMG to represent a squad leader. They trade very evenly in long range fights (except against UKF) and trade well in close range fights, but lose hard in medium range fights against Penals and Rifles because of hypothetically tweaked Kar98Ks with reduced damage. You could then choose between x4 MP44s which turn them into more of a CQC squad, or a single LMG34 upgrade. There is defintely overlap with Sturmpios if this ever happened, but then Sturmpios could have a more defined role as AT/support infantry.
Removing the mortar is the worst idea ever. RE rifle nades could go into a commander (infantry company for example) but taking the mortar away is a huge no.
OKW lategame isn't very good, it is only effective because you can't afford an equally sized army due to their infantry out grinding you and pushing you off the map.
OKW lategame comes the earliest, but unit per unit I would argue its weaker than even USF, and only beats USF typically because of Rifle bleed prohibiting a USF player from actually building an army, which is a factor from the first few minutes of the game.
0
Relic Entertainment
cblanco ★ 
보드카 중대 
VonManteuffel 
Heartless Jäger 
