Short barreled p4 for OST?

???



Again, you described the Ostwind. A vehicle which trumps all lights, serves as AI and can still do chip damage against mediums.

???????

Did you read my OP? The whole point was giving OST an earlier trump card to light vehicles and light tanks. They do not have one right now, and must overinvest in AT when they're already losing the infantry battle barring excellent MG play.

If you think OST does well enough against light vehicles and light tanks then okay, please state so. I don't think many players will agree, but I can always be wrong.

I don't think OST has a good option vs light tanks, and my whole point is fixing that. The Puma from mobile defense used to make OST competitive, but the tech and building requirement changes have made that strategy obsolete.

Allied players will never regret building a t-70, AEC, or stuart against OST. There's no punish beyond overextending those vehicles against anemic AT options.

If you think I'm "describing the ostwind" then okay. Throw away the whole short-barreled p4 idea.

Is moving the ostwind to t2, or the HQ with a battlephase 2 requirement a decent idea? Why or why not?

???????

Did you read my OP? The whole point was giving OST an earlier trump card to light vehicles and light tanks. They do not have one right now, and must overinvest in AT when they're already losing the infantry battle barring excellent MG play.

1) Have you considered even for a moment that... maybe... just maybe they are not meant to have it?
You know, like most factions have nothing like panther and literally no one has mini ISU in form of brummbar?
2) Getting 1 ATG by 7th minute is not overinvesting, its staple unit for that time.

If you think OST does well enough against light vehicles and light tanks then okay, please state so. I don't think many players will agree, but I can always be wrong.

Well, you are wrong, which has been confirmed by last 6 years of games lifespan and its even more easy them ever to counter lights as ost, given PGs don't need T2 and are cheaper to get and upgrade then they ever were.

I don't think OST has a good option vs light tanks, and my whole point is fixing that. The Puma from mobile defense used to make OST competitive, but the tech and building requirement changes have made that strategy obsolete.

222 is extremely good in countering all light vehicles, against light tanks you should have proper AT infantry or ATG or 70+ fuel unit, just like any other faction facing them.

Allied players will never regret building a t-70, AEC, or stuart against OST. There's no punish beyond overextending those vehicles against anemic AT options.

Have you heard of teller mines yet? You know, these things that one hit kill T7-, AEC or Stuart and are invisible for opponent.

If you think I'm "describing the ostwind" then okay. Throw away the whole short-barreled p4 idea.

Done!

Is moving the ostwind to t2, or the HQ with a battlephase 2 requirement a decent idea? Why or why not?

Its not and it won't be even considered by anyone serious, because there is this thing called timing for medium vehicles and tiers are balanced so units of certain power arrive at certain time.

Ostwind in T2, BP2 or not is equally smart idea as T70 from soviet T1 after you upgrade molos and AT nades.

2) Getting 1 ATG by 7th minute is not overinvesting, its staple unit for that time.

Ahhh, so every USF player goes captain for the 57mm of course, and every soviet player goes for support weapons company for the zis. It seems I'm playing some really weird players! Alot of them seem to really like lieutenant and special rifle command! And they just tech straight to t4 without a single AT gun. How weird is that!?

Well, you are wrong, which has been confirmed by last 6 years of games lifespan and its even more easy them ever to counter lights as ost, given PGs don't need T2 and are cheaper to get and upgrade then they ever were.

How many years has the mobile defense Puma been locked behind battlephase 2(t3)?

222 is extremely good in countering all light vehicles, against light tanks you should have proper AT infantry or ATG or 70+ fuel unit, just like any other faction facing them.

Ahhh. That must be why m20 just got nerfed. 222 was just countering it so hard it had to be nerfed because USF just shouldn't build it. Very sound reasoning.

Have you heard of teller mines yet? You know, these things that one hit kill T7-, AEC or Stuart and are invisible for opponent.

Oh okay. OST should just rely on their opponent to not mine-sweep and then run over a single 50 muni mine in the mid-game. Now I see that they're a very fun and interactive faction!

Again, you described the Ostwind. A vehicle which trumps all lights, serves as AI and can still do chip damage against mediums.

Imo Ostwind is not that great vs light vehicles on the move due to poor accuracy and sort scatter that make it dificult to score both naturale and collision hits.

The Ostwind struggles against AECs and even Stuarts so I wouldn't say it automatically trumps all light vehicles.

I agree with elchino, a short barreled p4 is just a post buff ostwind.

I would love to see stug e to have two shell types, the classic HE and a faster low pen AT oriented round.

snip

222 is enough against most light vehicles with exception of AA HT (which i think it has too high anti light potential) and enough assistant to tackle light AI tanks.

Regarding light tanks, both AEC and Stuart had been made pretty average to bad regarding AI, so you don't actually need AT to avoid been steamrolled by them. It's the same as panic reacting to a Puma (Yes, the Stuart from all those is slightly better AI wise but comparable way worst at AT).

T70 is the real game changer and guess what, from all light vehicles and light tanks, it's the one which is arriving the latest.

Meta game wise, since like 2/3 patches ago, OH has been proved to be able to skip both T1 and T2 for a fast T3 Ostwind rush. 2 Pio + 2 MG + 2 PG or variations using AssGrens are common. The answer to this has been the usage of more light vehicles (M20 into Stuart/AA HT, T70) which provides a risk to the build. This result on people not skipping T2 if they are even or behind as they need the 222/Pak cause they would be too behind otherwise before the Ostwind has any impact.

PD: PG shreck is also risky to be your sole AT to depend on, but doable.

Is moving the ostwind to t2, or the HQ with a battlephase 2 requirement a decent idea? Why or why not?

Bad idea. Cause while it's a risk been without heavy/light AT on 1v1, that's not the case for teamgames at all.

I consider that while OH weakness to lights is a thing, post USF nerfs to M20 and adjustments through the years on power levels of lights, OH has enough tools to deal with them without requiring the hard counter that has been the Mobile Defense Puma meta.

222 is enough against most light vehicles with exception of AA HT (which i think it has too high anti light potential) and enough assistant to tackle light AI tanks.

Regarding light tanks, both AEC and Stuart had been made pretty average to bad regarding AI, so you don't actually need AT to avoid been steamrolled by them. It's the same as panic reacting to a Puma (Yes, the Stuart from all those is slightly better AI wise but comparable way worst at AT).

T70 is the real game changer and guess what, from all light vehicles and light tanks, it's the one which is arriving the latest.

Would you be in favor of an armor buff or HP buff for the 222?

While the Stuart might not have as devastating AI as t-70 you can't just ignore it, and the 4 squads of RM running around. You'll waste all your munis on fausts or pshrecks, and your MG will be stuck in base or lost. Stuart and AEC can both roll in to your base and kill your medic bunker and low health squads if you just ignore them.

OST already has an anemic early game. I don't see why they should always have to invest 500 something manpower and some munis/fuel into some sort of (weak) AT option and cross their fingers that their opponent makes a big mistake.

Meta game wise, since like 2/3 patches ago, OH has been proved to be able to skip both T1 and T2 for a fast T3 Ostwind rush. 2 Pio + 2 MG + 2 PG or variations using AssGrens are common. The answer to this has been the usage of more light vehicles (M20 into Stuart/AA HT, T70) which provides a risk to the build. This result on people not skipping T2 if they are even or behind as they need the 222/Pak cause they would be too behind otherwise before the Ostwind has any impact.

PD: PG shreck is also risky to be your sole AT to depend on, but doable.

I don't think anyone serious is rushing Ostwinds. I'd say T2 rush is only a novelty stratagey. It works against conventional builds, but easily gets torn apart by someone who's seen it before.

Bad idea. Cause while it's a risk been without heavy/light AT on 1v1, that's not the case for teamgames at all.

I consider that while OH weakness to lights is a thing, post USF nerfs to M20 and adjustments through the years on power levels of lights, OH has enough tools to deal with them without requiring the hard counter that has been the Mobile Defense Puma meta.

Why exactly is it a bad idea for team games? OKW can field both luchs and puma in roughly the same time period, and just one of those at a much earlier time point.

I don't remember anyone complaining about the command p4 when it was a techless call-in. I don't remember anyone really using it either just after the Puma change, but I think both of those call-ins preformed an unspoken role as a possible punish to heavy LV play. Now that they're gone the meta has shifted to always using LV and light tanks against OST since they're such a strong investment with no downsides.



What are your thoughts about StuG in t2? With or without battlephase 2 requirements?

What OP really need is .....
PzIII !!!
(The one varient that use the same gun as Puma AT).

What you describe is basically the current Ostwind.

+1

Ost mid game AT is high risk medium/high reward

mines: oh look a sweeper that’s useless
- If not 50 munitions just ended their entire mid game
Double 222: one rock in their way and they start fucking each other
- Good AI power
PaK: zero tactical mobility, enemy just goes to the opposite side of the map
- Amazing vs mediums/heavies, still, sucks vs LVs
Shrecks: bad range, bleed a lot
- Late game Shreck blobs wreak face, doesn’t help vs LVs
Faust: kited
- Best snare, still has the same easy counter as all other snares
- bUt 7% rAngE buLLeTin

Just go watch dane,s lehr on the ostwind. Judging from that and other games where i saw it, it wrecks inf esp when stopping to fire.

I find it strange that very few people get it. I only faced it a few timrs but it wasent rushed so ii wasent as impactfull some even want the stug to become multyrole and seem to forget the ost wind excists.

You can use camoflage grens with sprint and 7% extra faust range to ambush enemy LVs. It might not kill them, but LVs these days are not super lethal anymore so you won't lose squads doing it and you will force them back for repairs, negating their impact entirely. Then you can rush out and Ostwind and win.

You can use camoflage grens with sprint and 7% extra faust range to ambush enemy LVs. It might not kill them, but LVs these days are not super lethal anymore so you won't lose squads doing it and you will force them back for repairs, negating their impact entirely. Then you can rush out and Ostwind and win.

Not many people are going to have unscreened light vehicles. You're talking 60+ munis multiplied by the three or so times you'd have to faust before getting out your own medium.

That's not a counter, that's bleeding yourself out with a panic tactic.

You'll have a slower ostiwind timing than their first medium.

is it truly impossible to import new models into the game?

is it truly impossible to import new models into the game?

It was possible, before Relic disabled it:

while they might have done this to lock DLC content... this makes no sense in context of a game thats well developed and no longer updated with DLCs...

maybe we can petition to reinstate this?

It was possible, before Relic disabled it:

Beautiful

while they might have done this to lock DLC content... this makes no sense in context of a game thats well developed and no longer updated with DLCs...

maybe we can petition to reinstate this?

Oh believe me I've been trying for quite a while now and you can pretty much guess the answer.

There are just not enough people crying enough and loud enough in order for Relic to actually listen.

Oh believe me I've been trying for quite a while now and you can pretty much guess the answer.

There are just not enough people crying enough and loud enough in order for Relic to actually listen.

Is it easy to do stuff like that? I mean new models.