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September Balance Patch preview [SPBP] - general discussion

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30 Aug 2019, 19:22 PM
#501
avatar of thekingsown10

Posts: 232

The patch is looking good so far but I must add 4 things.

1. Remove smoke from churchill (there is no reason for such a high health and armor unit to have it) or at the very least limit it to 1 like every other heavy tank in the game.

2. Brummbars accuracy needs some improvement (I find myself having to manual fire everytime due to how bad the auto aim is)

3. M8A1 motor even with the tweaks still does too much damage.

4. Soviet Field HQ should be replaced with the buildable HQ entirely. There are some truly massive buildings in the game and when converted just cannot be balanced in any shape or form as there is no decap option.
30 Aug 2019, 20:49 PM
#502
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 2358

...
2. Brummbars accuracy needs some improvement (I find myself having to manual fire everytime due to how bad the auto aim is)

Brummbar bad acc is intentional, its designed as a high APM high reward unit, but the game doesnt tell the player of it.
30 Aug 2019, 23:06 PM
#503
avatar of Mazianni

Posts: 785

Thompson SMG Assault Guards! And they keep the halftrack! Awesome.
30 Aug 2019, 23:31 PM
#504
avatar of gbem

Posts: 1979

Nerfs t2 cost because claims "to reduce the rush to conscript builds and T70"

Yet t2 is still retardedly dumb with a failure of a machinegun and a chronic inability to deal damage... somehow the balance team forgot to make T2 more viable when nerfing its cost...

FFS balance team... T2 conscript/support team builds exist and SIMPLY DONT WORK outside of doctrines... stop gauging the factions performance from the strength of T1 and take a look at the clearly underperforming T2

------------------------------------------


Another thing to note is mobilize reserves is still borked with a fuel and manpower cost on top of the muni cost.... just remove that upgrade or make t4 cheaper + tie it with tech
30 Aug 2019, 23:50 PM
#505
avatar of gbem

Posts: 1979

The patch is looking good so far but I must add 4 things.

1. Remove smoke from churchill (there is no reason for such a high health and armor unit to have it) or at the very least limit it to 1 like every other heavy tank in the game.



Maybe because the churchill is soo slow and has no ability to rescue itself from bad situations unlike mediums which have speed + 1 other ability for escape
31 Aug 2019, 02:32 AM
#506
avatar of Support Sapper

Posts: 1220 | Subs: 1

The patch is looking good so far but I must add 4 things.

1. Remove smoke from churchill (there is no reason for such a high health and armor unit to have it) or at the very least limit it to 1 like every other heavy tank in the game.



A 19 pop cap, 165 fuel, latest tech unit doesn't allowed to have some utilities because it is belong to the allies ?
31 Aug 2019, 02:51 AM
#507
avatar of Grumpy

Posts: 1958

The patch is looking good so far but I must add 4 things.

1. Nerf Allies
2. Buff Axis
3. Nerf Allies
4. Nerf Allies


The abridged edition - glad to see one buff in there for variety...oh, wait.......
31 Aug 2019, 03:17 AM
#508
avatar of Smiling Tiger

Posts: 207



A 19 pop cap, 165 fuel, latest tech unit doesn't allowed to have some utilities because it is belong to the allies ?


No, it's because it has highest HP in game ,decent armor, and is effective against both infantry and vehicles, all while being relatively cheap even after the nerf. It should either have it's base performance nerfed, or lose it's utilities.

It's amazing how far the balance team have gone to avoid actually touching the Churchill's performance, same goes for Volksgrenadiere.
31 Aug 2019, 05:40 AM
#509
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Aug 2019, 23:50 PMgbem


Maybe because the churchill is soo slow and has no ability to rescue itself from bad situations unlike mediums which have speed + 1 other ability for escape


Mediums have low chance to pen churchill...
Panther needs to get in mid range to pen churchill...
I like how such armor is considered only 'decent' ...

Smoke is just so extra when it already have good vet buffs.
At vet3 it can rotate and reposition like a t70...and vetting churchill is much easier because of its nature...
31 Aug 2019, 05:41 AM
#510
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794



No, it's because it has highest HP in game ,decent armor, and is effective against both infantry and vehicles, all while being relatively cheap even after the nerf. It should either have it's base performance nerfed, or lose it's utilities.

It's amazing how far the balance team have gone to avoid actually touching the Churchill's performance, same goes for Volksgrenadiere.


Reduce churchill main gun to 120, revert pop to 18.
Problem solve.
Ukf will use it more as soaker and will want to build more AT.

I guess give main gun a bit more pen, to get more favourably rng. maybe a +5 to all ranges.
31 Aug 2019, 10:19 AM
#511
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

It's amazing how far the balance team have gone to avoid actually touching the Churchill's performance, same goes for Volksgrenadiere.


Because making changes to "secondary" unit stats (like cooldowns, build time, abilities etc.) has proven to be a very good tool to balance units by adjusting their availability or timing, without having to nerf their performance. One major advantage with this is that it allows for units to remain strong to keep them attractive to use, but helps prevent them from being deployed in quick succession and/or in overwhelming numbers.

In the last 2 patches units like Pathfinders, Assault Grenadiers, Valentine and Jaeger Light Infantry all triggered a vast amount of complaints after their initial timings or performance changes about overperformance, and ultimately they have been fixed without touching their performance at all just by limiting their availability (I have barely ever seen any complaints about those units since the follow-up patches). These small changes are usually way more effective than people initially think.

As for the Churchill specifically, I personally do not believe a single Churchill is overperforming (except that grenade ability they had at vet 0), and that the unit is only really problematic when deployed in overwhelming numbers (~3 at once). So from my point of view, there is no reason to overly punish players using 1 or max 2 Churchills in a diverse build by nerfing the unit's primary performance.

So for now, availability will be more limited to see if that alone works, and if ultimately it doesn't work, performance can always still be nerfed later. But the first option is preferred.
31 Aug 2019, 10:23 AM
#512
avatar of Divisionario

Posts: 32

in my opinion the churchill tank only needs a nerf in the penetration capacity in its cannon
31 Aug 2019, 10:27 AM
#513
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

in my opinion the churchill tank only needs a nerf in the penetration capacity in its cannon

And its not going to get it, because it already has a bad gun, you will not find second vehicle that is generalist at that price point with lower penetration in game.
31 Aug 2019, 10:34 AM
#514
avatar of Balanced_Gamer

Posts: 783

FHT buff performance (since it needs improvements and fixing which were the elements that were missed in the last patch).

In turn nerf veterancy.

Changes for OKWs Flak Half Track.

Move Vet 2 to Vet 0 (to default). This is a quick fix for performance. Nerf all the vet bonuses.

Add something Vet 2 for the removal/exchange.
31 Aug 2019, 10:35 AM
#515
avatar of Divisionario

Posts: 32

jump backJump back to quoted post31 Aug 2019, 10:27 AMKatitof

And its not going to get it, because it already has a bad gun, you will not find second vehicle that is generalist at that price point with lower penetration in game.


It is undeniable that the high survival capacity and being able to get more than one churchill makes it very powerful and does not have a bad cannon, has good damage and penetration and that should not be in a tank that resists like a tiger.

not for 185 fuel.

or a little nerf in your penetration or just being able to get only one
31 Aug 2019, 10:39 AM
#516
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8



It is undeniable that the high survival capacity and being able to get more than one churchill makes it very powerful and does not have a bad cannon, has good damage and penetration and that should not be in a tank that resists like a tiger.

not for 185 fuel.

or a little nerf in your penetration or just being able to get only one

That's exactly how it should perform for its price point.
It got regular medium tank gun. It doesn't cost as much as tiger, because specifically it does not have tigers gun capabilities. Its firepower is nothing exceptional and Sander already explained why it will never be touched.
31 Aug 2019, 10:50 AM
#517
avatar of Divisionario

Posts: 32

jump backJump back to quoted post31 Aug 2019, 10:39 AMKatitof

That's exactly how it should perform for its price point.
It got regular medium tank gun. It doesn't cost as much as tiger, because specifically it does not have tigers gun capabilities. Its firepower is nothing exceptional and Sander already explained why it will never be touched.


a medium gun in a tank with very high armor and health for only 185 fuel already makes it exceptional even more as the penetration and you know how rng works in this game.

Are you going to tell me that you have never destroyed tigers with just one churchil? and a churchill always has a firefly behind.

if they will never modify the unit then talking about this is in vain but you greatly underestimate the power of the cannon
31 Aug 2019, 10:53 AM
#518
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8



a medium gun in a tank with very high armor and health for only 185 fuel already makes it exceptional even more as the penetration and you know how rng works in this game.

The constant buffs KV-1 is getting proves you wrong by default.

Are you going to tell me that you have never destroyed tigers with just one churchil? and a churchill always has a firefly behind.

If you are losing tigers to churchills, that's L2P issue.
If churchill has FF behind it, that's because churchills gun is inadequate against what it goes against, which further proves its fine.

if you are never going to touch it then talking about this is in vain but you greatly underestimate the power of the cannon

No, you are greatly overestimating it.
Its regular cromwell gun, cromwell is nothing exceptional in terms of firepower.
31 Aug 2019, 11:09 AM
#519
avatar of Divisionario

Posts: 32

jump backJump back to quoted post31 Aug 2019, 10:53 AMKatitof

The constant buffs KV-1 is getting proves you wrong by default.


If you are losing tigers to churchills, that's L2P issue.
If churchill has FF behind it, that's because churchills gun is inadequate against what it goes against, which further proves its fine.


No, you are greatly overestimating it.
Its regular cromwell gun, cromwell is nothing exceptional in terms of firepower.


kv1 and churchills should be comparable but in the game one is crap and the other works great, don't make straw men.


I destroy tiger with churchills *.

Imagine when I take more than one, or even if I carry a firefly behind.

You've done it, seen it, played it and you know it, you're not dumb.

To say that carrying a firefly behind a churchill demonstrates how bad a cannon is like saying that the tiger is bad because it needs infantry with faust because otherwise any light AT vehicle could destroy it, again do not make straw men.

again obvious that that chromwell cannon is in a very resistant chassis that is capable of destroying heavy tanks with many shots, will not penetrate many shots? Yes, will you deflect many shots? Yes, can you take the tiger 1 vs 1 to the limit? quite provable.

I reiterate what makes the churchill great is the capacity of very high armor and health with a medium cannon that can have the trouble of taking time and penetrating and destroying tanks, with a very good price of fuel and the ability to take more than one.

no more straw men pls
31 Aug 2019, 11:16 AM
#520
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

Actually the kv1 is perfectly fine after the buff too mg (if not too strong)

it needs 7 shells to die (as much as a tiger) , it repairs much faster than Churchill, it has more frontal armor and is much cheaper
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Lady Xenarra: Does anyone else think that USF needs buffs? It feels like they’re on life support sometimes
Yesterday, 02:36 AM
Willy Pete: @Rosbone Ahh I missed that memo. I still think its a bad decision though. Adds frustration for players and isnt gonna make them that much money
Last Thursday, 15:46 PM
Rosbone: It is also good they left it free until after the free to play weekend. Points for that.
Last Thursday, 09:34 AM
Rosbone: But I agree, the cost to get a full decent Coh game pushing $115 US is not the best idea. Especially when it needs so much more work for casuals.
Last Thursday, 09:32 AM
Rosbone: To be fair, it was a thank you to early fans right? They said it was not free for long and it would become a pay DLC at some point.
Last Thursday, 09:30 AM
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Soheil: Coh2 still broken server ?
25 Mar 2025, 18:27 PM
Rosbone: Congrats to Relic. Looks like Coh3 has finally usurped Coh2 s the popular Coh. You smell terrific. :snfQuinn:.
24 Mar 2025, 02:46 AM
Nickbn: and again someone else replies. I mean come on guys. Give @adamírcz a chance
22 Mar 2025, 14:00 PM
Willy Pete: @Nickbn you didn't ask a question, and this is a chat box...
20 Mar 2025, 13:11 PM
Nickbn: @Rosbone it's incredibly rude to speak on someone elses behalf, especially when a question is directly adressed to them. I understand your passion for the subject at hand but I want to hear from him.
20 Mar 2025, 10:16 AM
Rosbone: @Nickbn No, I am just saying people should not be using any Relic owned forum since they have proven they ban anyone who says true things about Coh3.
18 Mar 2025, 19:01 PM
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18 Mar 2025, 16:47 PM
Rosbone: #RelicModdedEchoChamber
16 Mar 2025, 17:54 PM
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16 Mar 2025, 17:54 PM
Nickbn: @adamírcz might be a better idea to voice this to relic directly than to voice it here, in a shoutbox of a nearly deade fansite #justsaying...
16 Mar 2025, 16:36 PM
webdesign-muenchen-w: @Rosbone it is sick
14 Mar 2025, 22:09 PM
aerafield: @adamírcz aren't the first two disconnects free every day?
14 Mar 2025, 19:26 PM
Rosbone: It is so unlike Relic to punish its fans and community.
14 Mar 2025, 12:07 PM
adamírcz: So, I just got a leaver penalty without even getting onto the loading screen because of the game disconnecting, bravo Relic
14 Mar 2025, 10:45 AM
Rosbone: It is an indicator of the very short sighted capitalist view that plagues any company where leadership does not understand the product.
13 Mar 2025, 20:00 PM
Rosbone: They dont care about Coh3 or Coh in general. They are just trying to grab cash by ripping off the small user base they have.
13 Mar 2025, 19:58 PM
Rosbone: Just making mistake after mistake after mistake.
13 Mar 2025, 19:57 PM
Rosbone: It is clear they crapped out an unfinished game. And are now barely supporting it as they make new smaller games. Coh3 is stillborn. It will be meh for at least another 2-4 years. Meaning they killed the whole franchise instead of growing it.
13 Mar 2025, 19:56 PM
Rosbone: For a thing they could fix in minutes. Literally minutes.
13 Mar 2025, 19:53 PM
Rosbone: If I did play coh3 and was mainly a skirmish player, I would be pissed and probably stop playing. And it has been like this since release. Why? I would not tell my friends to buy a game I am not even playing. Lost sales and angered users.
13 Mar 2025, 19:53 PM
Rosbone: I am just saddened how Relic keeps hurting themselves by not fixing 5 minute things like menus. Why anger users with stuff that could be fixed in minutes???
13 Mar 2025, 19:50 PM
Rosbone: I was wondering why people think I was raging. I think it was when I said "because coh3 sucks so bad". That was not my opinion. Just a general feel from top players/streamers. I dont play Coh3 and have NO opinion of it.
13 Mar 2025, 19:48 PM
OKSpitfire: You can rage as often as you like btw, you usually manage to make it pretty funny.
12 Mar 2025, 11:18 AM
Rosbone: So it was a systemic failure across multiple disciplines and check points.
12 Mar 2025, 04:30 AM
Rosbone: Knowing how companies work, I imagine a new hire making the menus. The API they are using is complicated and things were hard to figure out. But at some point QA or management should have addressed these things. Usually within 6 months of starting.
12 Mar 2025, 04:29 AM
Rosbone: @theekvn I dont hate Coh3 or Relic. I just dont understand how you work on Coh3 for like 7 years and the menu system is worse than if a Programming 101 student made it. Feel free to explain it to me.
12 Mar 2025, 04:07 AM
theekvn: + 33% dmg rear hit was best deal ever.
12 Mar 2025, 04:00 AM
theekvn: KT just need fuel debuf from 15% to 50%, Ele arc of fire- aim time improve and they are good to go
12 Mar 2025, 03:59 AM
theekvn: and please Rosbone,I know you hate Coh3 to the bone due to your drama with relic, Still, Can you give a proper point of view instead of raging ?.
12 Mar 2025, 03:54 AM
theekvn: you rather go 76 to unity Whizbang 2.0 or go home.
12 Mar 2025, 03:52 AM
theekvn: also US tier 4 is 145f and Sherman pen 140 nerf is too much.
12 Mar 2025, 03:52 AM
theekvn: Whizbang lock behind CP, meanwhile stuka is techtree progress
12 Mar 2025, 03:51 AM
KoRneY: @aerafield It's possible that it is underpriced for what it is capable of now, no need to go full retard and take it immediately as a massive problem. It costs 60 more MP than a pz.3 and in 2v2 the barrage can be quite strong.
07 Mar 2025, 19:14 PM
OKSpitfire: I do like that they made the Stuka more expensive instead of nerfing it into the ground though. Found it pretty unsatisfying to use before that buff a while back....
06 Mar 2025, 16:35 PM
aerafield: USF already is by far the shittiest faction in terms of countering blobbing and turtling, now they supposedly have one overtuned tool locked behind a BG and it's immediately a massive problem?
06 Mar 2025, 13:33 PM
Lady Xenarra: I think post-2.0 Whizbang buffs, the price is too low esp since the Stuka got nerfed in cost too. Speaking of which, how exactly is one supposed to successfully dive this Sherman in disguise? Med tank spam running into SSFs?
06 Mar 2025, 12:13 PM
OKSpitfire: A powerful, doctrinal unit that outperforms stock stuff? Colour me shocked! :P
06 Mar 2025, 10:49 AM
Willy Pete: Cool you wanna lose your stock lategame arty too then?
06 Mar 2025, 03:20 AM
Lady Xenarra: WTB Whizzbang for DAK instead of Stuka, 5 fuel cheape, 60MP more expensive and next to impossible to dive. :rofl:
05 Mar 2025, 20:27 PM
Rosbone: It is also hard to expect Relic to help Coh2 when they cant even make working menus in Coh3 yet, 2 years after release and at full price+ for DLCs. Thats like asking a fish to do calculus.
04 Mar 2025, 02:58 AM
Rosbone: But this last patch has made good progress for grabbing players. All we can hope is Coh3 gets to Coh2s quality level before everyone abandons the franchise. Its Relic so they will completely f*%k it up as usual. But its a hope/cope.
04 Mar 2025, 02:55 AM
Rosbone: Relic wants Coh2 to fail so players will migrate to Coh3. It is hard to blame them since Coh3 sucks so bad. It needs all the help it can get.
04 Mar 2025, 02:53 AM
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