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Schwerer Flak Truck Balance ideas

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14 Aug 2016, 18:48 PM
#41
avatar of Zyllen

Posts: 770


The difference is that the free USF squads don't completely shut down elements of the game. Shore USF might get an extra boon when they tech, but no playstyles are specifically prevented against them. Even the captain lost it's free zooks so that they don't get a automatic vehicle counter.

On top of that they do end up paying pop costs over time, so they aren't exactly as free as they seem.


That is simply not true every faction has strengths and weaknesses that puts certain play styles at a disadvantage or makes it outright impossible. if you play against the okw and use planes then its your own fault, planes are not shot down 100 % of the time anyway.
14 Aug 2016, 19:20 PM
#42
avatar of Brassatko

Posts: 175


The difference is that the free USF squads don't completely shut down elements of the game. Shore USF might get an extra boon when they tech, but no playstyles are specifically prevented against them. Even the captain lost it's free zooks so that they don't get a automatic vehicle counter.

On top of that they do end up paying pop costs over time, so they aren't exactly as free as they seem.


Well, the faction does get a free squad just by teching and that enables even more aggressive swarming early on. SThe fact that it has a has a pop cost doesn't turn it into a disadvantage, right :-)?

The guy I replied to stated 'Axis get too much cheap and free stuff' and that is simply bs.
14 Aug 2016, 19:29 PM
#43
avatar of Budwise
Admin Red  Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2075 | Subs: 2

More OKW nerfs plz. :lol:
14 Aug 2016, 19:36 PM
#44
avatar of siuking666

Posts: 707

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Aug 2016, 19:29 PMBudwise
More OKW nerfs plz. :lol:


Well the suppression on that gun is kinda annoying.
aaa
14 Aug 2016, 20:28 PM
#45
avatar of aaa

Posts: 1487

If you put a price on it you'll have to nerf the other side techs' costs so it's fair.


There is no such thing as axis side tech. Unit unlock is already so cheap that its beyond words. I was thinking that they just missed it
14 Aug 2016, 20:57 PM
#46
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

If you put a price on it you'll have to nerf the other side techs' costs so it's fair.

You mean like OKW T3 and ost T4 price was increased when brit hammer/anvil got cost increase?

Oh wait, that didn't happen, because that's now how balancing works.
14 Aug 2016, 21:03 PM
#47
avatar of Smiling Tiger

Posts: 207

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Aug 2016, 18:48 PMZyllen


That is simply not true every faction has strengths and weaknesses that puts certain play styles at a disadvantage or makes it outright impossible. if you play against the okw and use planes then its your own fault, planes are not shot down 100 % of the time anyway.


Actually on small 1v1 maps and team games with more than 1 OKW player planes are pretty much out of the question and the problem is that its not really a conscious choice that the OKW has to make to cancel other opponents strategies it just fluidly happens through their teching with the SChwerer HQ.
nee
14 Aug 2016, 21:49 PM
#48
avatar of nee

Posts: 1216

It's fine. If anything it needs to be smarter and shoot the tank killing it rather some far away plane that's already flying away after dropping payload.
If I want a specific nerf it's to reduce it's AA range, if at all possible. I would think the primary design purpose of this structure (it's not a unit per se) is for ground defense rather than aerial denial.

Reduce it's firepower and it's just a lemon and no one will ever deploy it front lines ever again (though that might be your agenda).

Make it side tech and people will still complain that it's free and that it shouldn't be there at all, and you also get Ostheer clone either way.

I do wonder, however, if this thing is affected by smoke? I swore a few times I've seen it, the gun still fires even when I or enemy fires smoke at it.
14 Aug 2016, 21:52 PM
#49
avatar of insaneHoshi

Posts: 911



Im pretty sure the Bofors needs to be crewed to get suppression and I meant that the Schwerer gun could effectively hit any target in its range, so of course units out of its range cant be hit.


No it still suppresses.

So apart from its counters its effective? And the shwer isnt effective against all medium tanks and furthermore smoke nullifies the truck too.
14 Aug 2016, 22:08 PM
#50
avatar of Zyllen

Posts: 770



Actually on small 1v1 maps and team games with more than 1 OKW player planes are pretty much out of the question and the problem is that its not really a conscious choice that the OKW has to make to cancel other opponents strategies it just fluidly happens through their teching with the SChwerer HQ.


Then dont use planes against the okw. This is not a problem of the flak but of bad players.
14 Aug 2016, 22:18 PM
#51
avatar of Smiling Tiger

Posts: 207

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Aug 2016, 22:08 PMZyllen


Then dont use planes against the okw. This is not a problem of the flak but of bad players.


So you are perfectly ok with an important staple of the game being ruled out for allies in half of 1v1 matches and lots of team games for something that could easily be changed wow
14 Aug 2016, 22:20 PM
#52
avatar of Smiling Tiger

Posts: 207



No it still suppresses.

So apart from its counters its effective? And the shwer isnt effective against all medium tanks and furthermore smoke nullifies the truck too.


ffs im not saying that the thing cant be countered im just saying its too effective at the moment for no teching so it should either be toned down or be given a price.
14 Aug 2016, 22:25 PM
#53
avatar of Smiling Tiger

Posts: 207

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Aug 2016, 21:49 PMnee
It's fine. If anything it needs to be smarter and shoot the tank killing it rather some far away plane that's already flying away after dropping payload.
If I want a specific nerf it's to reduce it's AA range, if at all possible. I would think the primary design purpose of this structure (it's not a unit per se) is for ground defense rather than aerial denial.

Reduce it's firepower and it's just a lemon and no one will ever deploy it front lines ever again (though that might be your agenda).

Make it side tech and people will still complain that it's free and that it shouldn't be there at all, and you also get Ostheer clone either way.

I do wonder, however, if this thing is affected by smoke? I swore a few times I've seen it, the gun still fires even when I or enemy fires smoke at it.


Reduce it's firepower and it's just a lemon and no one will ever deploy it front lines ever again (though that might be your agenda).
I dont want to take away its damage, just its penetration so it can still be a great suppression platform and a light vehicle killer


Make it side tech and people will still complain that it's free and that it shouldn't be there at all, and you also get Ostheer clone either way.
People might complain but they will be wrong and I dont see how this particular change will make the OKW more like Ostheer(although I will agree that too many things have been changed that make them similar)

I do wonder, however, if this thing is affected by smoke? I swore a few times I've seen it, the gun still fires even when I or enemy fires smoke at it.
Its probably either a bug or it was in AA mode at that moment.
14 Aug 2016, 23:11 PM
#54
avatar of zerocoh

Posts: 930

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Aug 2016, 21:49 PMnee
I do wonder, however, if this thing is affected by smoke? I swore a few times I've seen it, the gun still fires even when I or enemy fires smoke at it.


this is the ridiculous part, it still fires at aircraft even if it is smoked.
14 Aug 2016, 23:18 PM
#55
avatar of Thunderhun

Posts: 1617



Well the suppression on that gun is kinda annoying.


We could say the same about a maxim beating a pre-set MG-42.

Well the suppression on that gun is kinda annoying, first bullet drops squads to the ground.
14 Aug 2016, 23:30 PM
#56
avatar of Vuther
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1



We could say the same about a maxim beating a pre-set MG-42.

Well the suppression on that gun is kinda annoying, first bullet drops squads to the ground.

You forgot to mention the 42 is also in better cover than Maxim :snfQuinn:

Truly, a silly occurrence that should be impossible.
14 Aug 2016, 23:39 PM
#57
avatar of Kamzil118

Posts: 455

I suggest the Schewer should have a prioitize mechanic which is similar to how Relic allowed the resource focus for the OKW before they ripped it out.

There are three kinds of focuses, air, armor, and infantry. Whatever it focuses on it will shoot that focused unit. Then there is a time limit until the OKW player could switch between focuses.

For example, focusing on infantry and then a Sherman appears out of nowhere. OKW player switching focus will make the schewer shoot the tank, but if infantry come out of nowhere as the tank leaves the gun will not shoot them.
14 Aug 2016, 23:40 PM
#58
avatar of pigsoup
Patrion 14

Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2

whether it is fine or not, it it isnt 120fu. like major, major is not 120fu the tech is. and major is free. so is the flak.

lets not BS pls.
14 Aug 2016, 23:48 PM
#59
avatar of easierwithaturret

Posts: 247

I don't think it's that big of a deal. Getting t4 vehicles out takes a long time for OKW, if you want to get healing before that stage it takes even longer. Trying to hold with just a raketen and one tier's units is pretty difficult.

Once raketen is fixed it will be easier for OKW to hold until their tanks, but for now the only change I think it should have is a range nerf for the AA. I'm fine with an AA structure that actually does a decent job against aircraft, but being able to do that over most of the map is a bit much.

15 Aug 2016, 00:22 AM
#60
avatar of Waegukin

Posts: 609

I'm not a big fan of its "free" AA capabilities but other then that I think its fine.
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