Tiger without claws?

Tiger without claws?

Rebel without cause

The thread could be renamed. The Tiger has claws. It can dish out damage. It rather has a glass bone disease.

The thread could be renamed. The Tiger has claws. It can dish out damage. It rather has a glass bone disease.

The Tiger isn't much less durable than the IS-2.

Stat	Tiger	IS-2
Health	1040	1040
Armour(Front/Rear)	300/180	375/140
Speed	4.7	5
Damage	160	160
Range	45	40
Reload Time	5.13	6.53
Cost (Manpower/Fuel)	640/230	640/230

The tiger has 75 less armour, .3 less speed and lower ac/deceleration than the IS 2.

The tiger has 75 less armour, .3 less speed and lower ac/deceleration than the IS 2.

But the tiger has more rear armour, higher rate of fire and greater range.

They cost exactly the same. Needs to have pros that differentiate them. If you want it to be better then the IS2 in all stats increase its cost accordingly.

The tiger has 75 less armour, .3 less speed and lower ac/deceleration than the IS 2.

Lol people underestimate 75 less armor

Lol people underestimate 75 less armor

p4 vet2 = armor buff (1.3x)
stug vet2 = armor buff (1.3x)
brumbar vet2 = armor buff (1.3x)
panther vet2 = armor buff (1.1x)

tiger vet2 = should be armor buff, say 1.25x more armor.

tiger vet3 = should be current vet2 stuff (+5 range and scatter buff)
Should get rid of the current vet3 bonus of insane rate of fire

But the tiger has more rear armour, higher rate of fire and greater range.

They cost exactly the same. Needs to have pros that differentiate them. If you want it to be better then the IS2 in all stats increase its cost accordingly.

Flavour wise, the differences between the IS-2 and Tiger are correct. I think they should just increase the differences. Make the tiger slower with more range/sight and increase the the damage/pen/(maybe)scatter on the IS-2. So, if a Tiger player can keep his distance he can do ok but if the IS-2 manages to close he's screwed.

Flavour wise, the differences between the IS-2 and Tiger are correct. I think they should just increase the differences. Make the tiger slower with more range/sight and increase the the damage/pen/(maybe)scatter on the IS-2. So, if a Tiger player can keep his distance he can do ok but if the IS-2 manages to close he's screwed.

But... The is-2 gunner just went to his AA meetings... Hes been drunk for so long...

Lol people underestimate 75 less armor

Yeah, it makes a WORLD of difference against that 500 pen JT.

The IS-2 scatter isn't from the drunk driver but the inaccurate 122mm gun that was rushed through production.

The IS-2 scatter isn't from the drunk driver but the inaccurate 122mm gun that was rushed through production.

This had 2 causes:

1. German tank cannons have better aim system
2. After firing one shot, the IS's gun had to be brought in the initial position in order to be loaded. So the crew losed aim. Then, after loading, the crew had to aim again.

There was a joke:

Once, in the war commission, Stalin expected new solutions from his soviet tank builders, because the german tanks were clearly superior.
Ivan, tank construction expert at a soviet tank factory, says: Comrade Stalin, I have a proposal through wich we will reach the german technology and be on pair with it.
Stalin didn't look to pleased and said nothing.
Seeing this, Serioja, tank construction expert at a second soviet tank factory says: Comrade Stalin, I have a proposal through wich we will overpass the german technology and we will clearly be in front of them.
Stalin begun to smile, finaly satisfied.
Seeing this, Ivan stood up and said: Comrade Stalin, I strongly suggest not to overpass Germans, because they might see our ass ripped pants!
Stalin didn't listen, threw Ivan in gulag and built the IS tank.

balacnce of unit is not dictated just by its individual performance and cost, you need to take into account what faction it is in and the factions unique features that will give it + or - points So a IS2 and Tiger might cost same but still be balanced coz they belong to differnt faction ... Ppl always forget that and compare units individually when quotin balance issues

Yeah, it makes a WORLD of difference against that 500 pen JT.

Let´s just ignore that in about 90% of all cases a Pak40, Raketenwerfer, Panzerschreck or Panzer IV is firing at it which all easily bounce. Even Panthers and JPIVs bounce on a regular basis if the IS-2 is at medium range. No, we just take that one, doctrinal most expensive TD in the game that´s supposed to hard counter tanks to show how "weak" the IS-2s armor is.

Let´s just ignore that in about 90% of all cases a Pak40, Raketenwerfer, Panzerschreck or Panzer IV is firing at it which all easily bounce. Even Panthers and JPIVs bounce on a regular basis if the IS-2 is at medium range. No, we just take that one, doctrinal most expensive TD in the game that´s supposed to hard counter tanks to show how "weak" the IS-2s armor is.

~50% or less to bounce, depending on AT source you use.

Besides, the thread is filled with people complaining that tank destroyers destroy tanks(some people must've hit their heads too hard and too often recently I guess?).
I've merely added one more example.

3 stugs will chew through IS-2 armor like it was a warm butter.

Should we buff churchills and pershings armor as well maybe?

Tiger is best all-rounder tank in game, decent survivability, exceptional firepower and penetration, exceptional range for generalist tank.

You can't have it all you know, if people fail with current tiger, its definitely not tanks fault.

Again, tank destroyers destroy tanks, that includes Tiger.

IS-2 can take couple more shots, but its own TTK for opposing armor is longer, it all balances out at the end.

Its really hard to believe that non axis peasant tanks were better armored then superior krupp steel armor, but its how it was and no, that is not a reason to buff wunderwaffe again.

Heavy tank shouldn't win game for you. Pershing and tiger is example of balanced heavy tank while kt is iwin button. Have no idea how is-2 post buff will perform but penetration buff and 375 frontal armor will be over the top.

If you want tanks to be historical accurate than give churchill and m36 jackson historical frontal armor (around 300).

Heavy tank shouldn't win game for you. Pershing and tiger is example of balanced heavy tank while kt is iwin button. Have no idea how is-2 post buff will perform but penetration buff and 375 frontal armor will be over the top.

If you want tanks to be historical accurate than give churchill and m36 jackson historical frontal armor (around 300).

IS-2 didn't got any kind of penetration buff.

It will simply not shoot into the next sector when fighting infantry now.

Tiger got penetration and range buff recently.

The tiger is fine.

You can easily win games by going double PAK40, double Stug E into Tiger with Ostheer. It's downright OP on most 1v1 maps as it is; no need to make it any stronger.