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Sturmpioneers - Uberpioneers

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18 Mar 2016, 14:05 PM
#61
avatar of JohnSmith

Posts: 1273

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Mar 2016, 14:01 PMKatitof


The unit is fine, isn't overperforming and doesn't lack anywhere.


Its a T0 STARTING engineer unit, not ubermenshen(this line goes both, to you and to OP)


I agree, but I merely wish that OKW did not obtain that slight MP resource advantage at the start that other factions do not get.
18 Mar 2016, 14:10 PM
#62
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8



I agree, but I merely wish that OKW did not obtain that slight MP resource advantage at the start that other factions do not get.

That is another issue, which I agree with.
OKW have already enough freebies as it is.
18 Mar 2016, 14:20 PM
#63
avatar of Jadame!

Posts: 1122

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Mar 2016, 14:01 PMKatitof
They beat tommies, they beat conscripts, they beat rifles, unless they are upgraded and weren't approaching over red cover.


They are not tho. They are beated by anything on long range same cover, they can roflrush tommies and kill them, but will be killed on aproach trought no and yellow cover by rifles and scripts, will kill rifles med-close range same cover which is bad example, coz this is the fight ami player can and should avoid, and will be beaten by scripts in pretty much every situation where scripts have where to kite with oorah.

Dire Irony is that they are more of a defensive unit after first 3 minutes when it becomes extremely easy to focus fire them, yet most of players in this topic seem to have problem with them used aggressively, lol.
18 Mar 2016, 14:21 PM
#64
avatar of scratchedpaintjob
Donator 11

Posts: 1021 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Mar 2016, 14:01 PMKatitof

300mp unit reinforcing for as much as 240mp unit.
I don't even need to argue here, numbers do the job.
still, 30mp is more than a lot of standart infantry. am i right or not? numbers do the job

They beat tommies, they beat conscripts, they beat rifles, unless they are upgraded and weren't approaching over red cover. They are utility unit, not a shock troop, obviously they get outperformed by elites, they are NOT elite themselves.

They vet reasonably fast, not faster or slower then any other infantry unit and by extension of your logic, apparently no unit can vet decently if they have no AIAT (FTFY).
well, as they are repairing or laying mines often, they dont have a lot of time in combat, therefore they dont vet fast. and no, that is NOT what i said. i personally think that volks vet a little too fast when they attack vehicles a lot


Again, they are NOT shock troop, the armor is irrelevant, only single infantry unit in the whole game uses armor, they have decent rec acc bonus from get to making them more durable.

4 men is NOT an argument, allied weapons are DESIGNED to go against 4 men squads, so it makes no difference unless you run frontally vs HE shermans or over mine fields.

And last but not least:

ALL units die pretty fast if you focus them, even shocks go down quickly to volks if they focus them.
unlike grenadiers for example, you have to close in, which means you are out of cover, which means you die faster......


The unit is fine, isn't overperforming and doesn't lack anywhere.


Its a T0 STARTING engineer unit, not ubermenshen(this line goes both, to you and to OP)

errr what???

as i already stated i do not think that they are übermenschen or OP. feel free to actually read my posts and try to think about it. you are the person here that tries to play down their weaknesses
18 Mar 2016, 14:23 PM
#65
avatar of Tobis
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4

You made this same thread one week ago, and everyone said you were wrong. Why did you make the same thread, with the same arguments, and expect different results? Why can't you just accept you are wrong?
18 Mar 2016, 14:25 PM
#66
avatar of MissCommissar

Posts: 673

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Mar 2016, 14:23 PMTobis
You made this same thread one week ago, and everyone said you were wrong. Why did you make the same thread, with the same arguments, and expect different results? Why can't you just accept you are wrong?


What? That's first time I write here about Pios, lol. Is everything ok with you?
18 Mar 2016, 14:27 PM
#67
avatar of TickTack

Posts: 578

Gotta say, the Sturms seem fine to me as well. Sorry MissCommisar!
18 Mar 2016, 14:27 PM
#68
avatar of Bananenheld

Posts: 1593 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Mar 2016, 14:20 PMJadame!


They are not tho. They are beated by anything on long range same cover, they can roflrush tommies and kill them, but will be killed on aproach trought no and yellow cover by rifles and scripts, will kill rifles med-close range same cover which is bad example, coz this is the fight ami player can and should avoid, and will be beaten by scripts in pretty much every situation where scripts have where to kite with oorah.

Dire Irony is that they are more of a defensive unit after first 3 minutes when it becomes extremely easy to focus fire them, yet most of players in this topic seem to have problem with them used aggressively, lol.

did you just say katitof is wrong? are you insane mate?
18 Mar 2016, 14:30 PM
#69
avatar of Tobis
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4



What? That's first time I write here about Pios, lol. Is everything ok with you?

Sorry, I was remembering the wrong poster.

Maybe you would appreciate the poll in this thread, though.
https://www.coh2.org/topic/49468/sturmpioneers-as-it-is-need-to-be-removed-from-the-game
18 Mar 2016, 14:31 PM
#70
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Mar 2016, 14:20 PMJadame!


They are not tho. They are beated by anything on long range same cover, they can roflrush tommies and kill them, but will be killed on aproach trought no and yellow cover by rifles and scripts, will kill rifles med-close range same cover which is bad example, coz this is the fight ami player can and should avoid, and will be beaten by scripts in pretty much every situation where scripts have where to kite with oorah.

Dire Irony is that they are more of a defensive unit after first 3 minutes when it becomes extremely easy to focus fire them, yet most of players in this topic seem to have problem with them used aggressively, lol.

Dude preparer yourself for kat response go open coh2 tool and rember it all or prepar to get rekt
18 Mar 2016, 14:33 PM
#71
avatar of zarok47

Posts: 587



I played today 2 or 3 games as OKW and I should say - it was sooooo easy...


http://www.companyofheroes.com/leaderboards#profile/steam/76561198062472736/history

Your match hisotry.

Out of your last 10 games, you played 2 games as okw.

You lost both.

One game even lasted a grand total of 8 minutes.

Your definition of "easy" seems to be suprisingly similair to getting your ass kicked.

No wonder you think axis are OP.
18 Mar 2016, 14:35 PM
#72
avatar of Tobis
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4

nmv
18 Mar 2016, 14:36 PM
#73
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Mar 2016, 14:20 PMJadame!


They are not tho. They are beated by anything on long range same cover, they can roflrush tommies and kill them, but will be killed on aproach trought no and yellow cover by rifles and scripts, will kill rifles med-close range same cover which is bad example, coz this is the fight ami player can and should avoid, and will be beaten by scripts in pretty much every situation where scripts have where to kite with oorah.

Dire Irony is that they are more of a defensive unit after first 3 minutes when it becomes extremely easy to focus fire them, yet most of players in this topic seem to have problem with them used aggressively, lol.


Since starting SP can be at your cutoff before your 1st RM, keep USF out of the argumentation please. In many maps, your the one trying to gain back your territory.
18 Mar 2016, 17:05 PM
#74
avatar of Hans G. Schultz

Posts: 875 | Subs: 2

Don't make anymore posts until you play 100 more games... Then, if you have a problem with something, come back and make a nice thoughtful post about it.




I agree with you.



Done close topic


+1

/thread
18 Mar 2016, 17:35 PM
#75
avatar of Unknown Legend
Donator 11

Posts: 418 | Subs: 1

Don't make anymore posts until you play 100 more games... Then, if you have a problem with something, come back and make a nice thoughtful post about it.


Please lord let COH2.org implement this!
18 Mar 2016, 19:19 PM
#76
avatar of GhostTX

Posts: 315

IMO, as stated in another thread, OKW should start with the new Kubel and the OKW player can decide to built a SP or volks. The problem with the SP is OKWs ability to dominate a cut off at the beginning of the game AND capture the rear. With a Kubel start, OKW would have to decide cut off OR rear cap. It couldn't do both.
18 Mar 2016, 19:29 PM
#77
avatar of EtherealDragon

Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1

I wouldn't be opposed to removing their 100% movement over rough terrain - it seems a bit excessive after their cost was reduced and would eliminate a bit of their somewhat annoying ability to YOLO rush some units. But essentially they are fine.
18 Mar 2016, 20:01 PM
#78
avatar of Domine

Posts: 500

100% movement over rough terrain



Doesn't that only exist on Chateau de luvnest?
18 Mar 2016, 20:36 PM
#79
avatar of Spinflight

Posts: 680

I just had a play around with Sturms on CheatCommands II...

Vet 0 Sturm squad was able to cross red cover, close with and destroy a Vet 0 Tommy squad which was in green cover, generally for the loss of only 1 or 2 models. Other than a garrison or a trench this is the best the British mainline infantry can hope for ( the mod didn't seem to have trenchs and exited a garrison when I tried to change their faction).

Vet 2 Sturms appeared to be superior to Vet 0 Commandos, seemed to depend who started in cover ( commandos being callins would be likely to meet Vet 1 or 2 Sturms). With both at Vet 0 and starting both out of cover at short range Commandos would edge it, often with a single model left. Vet 2 Sturms would give Vet 2 Commandos a very close fight at close range ( saw both win it by 1 model) even if the Commandos were cloaked and had ambush bonus.

Vet 2 Sturms could close with Royal Engineers @ 0 in green cover across red cover and win. Sometimes for the loss of a single model. Again, engineers are likely to meet Sturms with Vet.

Now Commandos are 440MP, and admittedly can spawn from houses which is frightfully useful, but in pure combat ability there isn't that much daylight between them. Sturms basically rape Tommies even when the Tommies have the most favourable position possible.

18 Mar 2016, 20:38 PM
#80
avatar of EtherealDragon

Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Mar 2016, 20:01 PMDomine



Doesn't that only exist on Chateau de luvnest?


Good question... I didn't really think about what qualifies as "rough terrain" since they removed all deep snow. I always thought things like craters counted as well but I could be wrong.
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