Penals
Posts: 1702
Except, Penals
Seriously thought, with the current vet 3 buff for cons theres just zero reason to use penals.
I propose some received accuracy when they vet up OR just buff their stock rifles.
Or perhaps buff their flamres? I wouldn't mind penal flamethrowers doing more damage than all other flamers to make them more uesful.
I tried using them a few times, and theres basically zero reason to use them since combat engineers get flamers and conscripts get good scaling now anyways..
Posts: 2819
For the rest, I dunno I find them pretty useless too. 'Anti-infantry' - sure.
Posts: 412
Posts: 2184 | Subs: 2
Posts: 1702
Received accuracy bonuses aside, aren't flamer penals sort of like flamer rifles right now, except for smoke?
Their rifles are slightly better at close range than rifles but rifles M1 garands are incomparably better at mid-long range.
I mean making svt-40 doing same damage as M1 garand would also be an idea.
Posts: 670
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Their flamer upgrade make them pretty useful in urban maps .
For the rest, I dunno I find them pretty useless too. 'Anti-infantry' - sure.
So does the CE flamer.
Penals are tier restricted unit who does the same job as engineer.
Penals should get 100% far accuracy increase to double their far DPS for starter, if that won't be enough, I'd go for vet change, even if it meant cost increase.
But far dps being 2x of what its now should be enough-simple change, hard to fuck up, even relic could do it.
Posts: 589
Pointless unit as they stand. I have never been in a situation where I thought to myself "I need penals for X job".
Posts: 83
Their flamer upgrade make them pretty useful in urban maps .
For the rest, I dunno I find them pretty useless too. 'Anti-infantry' - sure.
For mid-late game that flame benefit goes away imo. Because now you have one less rifle shooting (which isn't all that effective anyway. And now you have a unit that needs to get close to shoot...which against obers for example just melts them away. Would make more sense on a close range unit like shocks, or it makes sense on USF because they can smoke and BAR. SO now you're stuck with a expensive unit. IMO conscripts scale better late...even though they are paper, but they at least have molvs and Anti tank grenades.
Posts: 97
Posts: 2819
So does the CE flamer.
Penals are tier restricted unit who does the same job as engineer.
Penals should get 100% far accuracy increase to double their far DPS for starter, if that won't be enough, I'd go for vet change, even if it meant cost increase.
But far dps being 2x of what its now should be enough-simple change, hard to fuck up, even relic could do it.
For mid-late game that flame benefit goes away imo. Because now you have one less rifle shooting (which isn't all that effective anyway. And now you have a unit that needs to get close to shoot...which against obers for example just melts them away. Would make more sense on a close range unit like shocks, or it makes sense on USF because they can smoke and BAR. SO now you're stuck with a expensive unit. IMO conscripts scale better late...even though they are paper, but they at least have molvs and Anti tank grenades.
Actually good arguments of you guys.
+1 both of them.
Posts: 545
Posts: 246
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Let them upgrade 2 flamethrowers for 120 muni - DONE.
Done what?
You'll end up with underperforming unit with 2 flamers instead of 1.
And it still makes more sense to get 2 CEs with flamers instead.
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
Making their rifles more similar to G43's (like Gren and Fuss ones) would work, since yknow the whole semi-automatic thing. I would also remove the flamethrower package (since their gimmick used to be they never exploded and flamer explosions are so rare now it basically doesn't matter) and replace it with commissar upgrade (unlocked after T3 or T4 is built) that makes them fight harder as they die and cheaper to reinforce.
Posts: 354
Posts: 2115 | Subs: 1
The reason why Penals suck isn't because their vet is shit. They have some of the best veterancy bonus's in the game (they get 30% more accuracy twice which is huge as accuracy is the biggest determiner in DPS next to just damage). The issue is their rifles are horrible. Not necessarily in reload, but they are highly inaccurate and have a long cool down and aim time (especially at far to mid).
Making their rifles more similar to G43's (like Gren and Fuss ones) would work, since yknow the whole semi-automatic thing. I would also remove the flamethrower package (since their gimmick used to be they never exploded and flamer explosions are so rare now it basically doesn't matter) and replace it with commissar upgrade (unlocked after T3 or T4 is built) that makes them fight harder as they die and cheaper to reinforce.
omg alex...you make sense
Posts: 246
Done what?
You'll end up with underperforming unit with 2 flamers instead of 1.
And it still makes more sense to get 2 CEs with flamers instead.
Let's do not make suggestions without proper testing, it's Relics' job. I ment that penals can have some shock value with this upgrade, but because they are quiet fragile they can be huge muni waste. Also they do not have some sort of AT, just like obers.
Posts: 1702
Posts: 344
We could also make them full on demolitions experts with access to a massive range of grenades/demo options as they vet, and maybe reduce the muni costs of their abilities as they vet up.
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