WC51 Nerf?

I might be noob but can someone explain why it got nerfed ?

don't get me wrong, it dealed a shitload of damage. But considering the whole commander, not having an "op" unit in the beginning it will make that commander... quite unworthy to select (considering that paperveichles of us army are quite hard to make them survive until they become useless) compared to the others.

So.. Why didn't they empowered something mid\late game for that commander, leavin him with a weak late game (not really a usefull arty shoot the one in that commander, and the recon stuff.. with no arty makes him usefull only in team games to support allies).


Am i being noob and closedminded? if so, how can i be effective in late game with us, using that commander, considering how every units you can put are easily countered by the german counterparts ? considering that i find really, really hard to be competitive in late game (Expecially if you now don't have even the little advantage of having an high damage machine in your arsenal in your early game? since it goes down almost with a panserschrek hit ?)

Again, maybe i'm being noobish, but if you know how to correct me OR if you find that commander being sligtly underpowered compared to the others.. please do tell me.

If you watched some of BreakingBrad's streams playing this... he would spam 4 jeeps, then get 2 m3's, upgrade the engis with flamethrowers and shoved a captain in one and a lieutenant in the other. Then he heavily invested in shermans. For a tactic so silly, it was WAAAAY too effective.

Vet,how are you not banned yet? lol.

The reason it was nerfed is because it was Stronger than an M3 and it can garrison a rifle squad making it just insane. There is very little you can do against it early game as Okw unless you open Ratten first or second (and no one does that, you get a ratten reactionary when you see light armour, or by 7 minutes latest in prep for AA HT/Stuart/T70)

I see your point, even so, i got more than one OKW that started with rakketten in preparation of my little jeep. 1 shooted, wasting 20 fuel (and in the early game is BAD).

Or just rushing it with a couple of sturmpioneer and killing it with rifles (i might sleeped those times).

I mean, ok, they dealed a lot of damage BUT they have very little hp (they basically goes down with just 1 panzershreck hit), compared for instance with the soviet scoutcar, and that shoot even in the back (wich is just a plus, not really a strong thing).

Btw i will try to give M3s more chances, even if i can't see why by the time i got them, they shoulnt be ready wit 1 or 2 AT for nuking them...

Being able to Garrison officers is powerful enough for the Dodge in my opinion.

There is a good thread about US late game (http://www.coh2.org/topic/20763/usa--weaksauce-late-game) and most people agree that US late game is actually pretty strong, but only if you micro for example your paperthing armor tankdestroyers really well.

And I really don't like the argument of now this commander has nothing op. ... There are so many useless commanders. I have no problem if they change a commander, but using it as justification for something op... pls no.

I see your point, even so, i got more than one OKW that started with rakketten in preparation of my little jeep. 1 shooted, wasting 20 fuel (and in the early game is BAD).

thing is, if he does start with raketen and you dont get this doctrine, its pretty much gg in a competetive game.
so okw had only bad choices, because it could have been wrong either way.
this was just stupid.
and btw, i think that it has more than enough health, it survives a pretty long time of mgfire....

Because it was too good.

Very much a justified nerf. The only reason there wasn't more of an uproar about this OP unit is because there aren't many people who got the commander.

This was too strong and too easy to execute. Anyone who played against it even once would say so therefore the change was needed and I am surprised it came so soon. GJ Relic I guess.

Dodge WC51
Damage reduced from 8 to 5
Accuracy increased from 0.22/0.35/0.54 to 0.29/0.4/0.62

I don't get it... the MG on the Dodge doesn't matter at all, you get 99% of your DPS from the rifles inside. I got to test it out, but it looks like the adjustment didn't changed a thing.

It did matter when they added up (dodge + infantry inside) hence the change.

Just tested it. Change doesn't matter at all.

And tomorrow everyone can buy this unit.....

Just tested it. Change doesn't matter at all.

well its a tricky situation for relic. im not sure how they could fix that. nerfing rifles isnt really much of an answer and they did actually do a significant nerf to the car. the cars dps has dropped by nearly 30% at near and mid range (only about 20% at far). but the car and rifles combined, the dps has only gone down about 10% at near and mid and 5% at far. so its definitely still very strong

they probably shouldve just never given a 0 cp garrisonable vehicle to the army with the strongest starting infantry

they probably shouldve just never given a 0 cp garrisonable vehicle to the army with the strongest starting infantry

Apparently one m3a1 scout car wasnt hard enough to balance.

Apparently one m3a1 scout car wasnt hard enough to balance.

Teching cost and timing vs call in

But dump that goddamn thing into Lt tech or make it like 250 HT with 3 CP.

CP0 clown car is as insane as the vet 2 Rifle call in at the first second.

they probably shouldve just never given a 0 cp garrisonable vehicle to the army with the strongest starting infantry

I can't agree. It evens the start against OKW.

As most states, or you're uberpro, or you got to win the game really early with US, because when you see tigers and stuff like that (and you don't have Easy-8's) you're kinda screwed, no metter what.

Since ok, as RANGED infantry is quite strong, nothing to say there... but believe me i see my damn infantry humiliated by both sturmpioneer and normal pioneer. (for the second ones it was quite rarer ad it was an excellent micro done by that wehrmacht player)

AND in cities, 2 sturmpioneer counters quite easily 3 infantry squad, so you need some sort of vehicle (and here it comes the WC51 in help) to micro, otherwise you basically have to retreat, leaving OKW being able to fortify his position by teching T2 and getting the flak.

Again, i can understand that WC51 is great for some other stuff, but considering all, i really doesn't find it a necessary nerf, but i will try to use it with the lieutenant (even if it's 70 fuel away from the beginning of the game.. meaning they will probably have already the rocket and soon to get puma or flak. But, again i might be too noob to appreciate the recon flight and the useless arty shoot that you get from that commander