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russian armor

soviet defensive commander MG

25 Nov 2013, 13:02 PM
#101
avatar of Nullist

Posts: 2425

Permanently Banned

It's been over two weeks. I wouldn't really call anything they do at this point quick.


bCs been testing them in streamed ladder matches.

People poopooed him for using what are community-wise considered broken and OP Commanders vs the general populace, but my viewing of the matches indicated to me he had a deliberate purpose.

He wasnt leveraging the Commanders for wins, he was almost deliberately losing units and setting up engsgements testing purposes.

Say what you will of bC, but he is a VERY good player. He could have easily steamrolled, especially with these Commanders, but he didnt. He was clearly testing how things play out in specific scenarios as related to these Commanders in a live population setting vs random players rather than just the beta crew, pros or staff.
25 Nov 2013, 13:49 PM
#102
avatar of rofltehcat

Posts: 604

Which stream are we talking about? Is there a recording?
Because I can't remember which one that is, so I either didn't watch it closely enough or haven't seen it at all.
25 Nov 2013, 14:17 PM
#103
avatar of Nullist

Posts: 2425

Permanently Banned
Which stream are we talking about? Is there a recording?
Because I can't remember which one that is, so I either didn't watch it closely enough or haven't seen it at all.


Here, this one:
http://www.twitch.tv/relicentertainment/b/481877923

Id be very interested to hear your perspective on it.
25 Nov 2013, 19:16 PM
#104
avatar of griezell

Posts: 125

maby have supresion a lesser penalty like it holds you in place but they can stil shoot back maby 20% less good and fast as normal and have supression realy fuck up the unit abillatie to do anyting
27 Nov 2013, 00:59 AM
#105
avatar of link0

Posts: 337

I still don't understand why this unit is ever an issue. Ostheer can build mortars and snipers out of T1, both of which are hard counters to the DHSK.

The DHSK has 2x the DPS of a maxim but the same HP and 150% the price. It's a situational unit, at best.

It's hard to see how anyone might find this mediocre unit too powerful as a Soviet unit. If the Ostheer had it, then I could see why it would be OP since soviet teching is more rigid.

Few, if any, of the "pro" soviet players are using this unit. If something is OP, they would be all over it.
27 Nov 2013, 02:01 AM
#106
avatar of OZtheWiZARD

Posts: 1439

I can confirm that mortars work well against Dshkas.
Tried yesterday and today and didn't have any problems with countering this unit either by using Mortars (even when enemy got 120mm out, all you have to do is to keep re position your mortar after few salvos), rifle nades, scout cars or the most simple and the most successful - flanking.
If I ever lost a game it was to this bloody Soviet Industry commander although Stugs work semi good against it but that's different topic.
27 Nov 2013, 12:48 PM
#107
avatar of Brick Top

Posts: 1162

The power of the unit is that you can spam out cons and DSHKA at tier 0.


Cons on their own are already good, but when you throw in MGs as well, off the bat.. it can take time for germans to try dig you off their cut off

Cons and Maxims are already powerful together, and you have to build slow T2 for that. Now, take away that building, buff the Maxim (into a DSHKA), and rush a T70 and T34 out before German can do that much.

Its certainlly frustrating and powerful.
27 Nov 2013, 13:09 PM
#108
avatar of tuvok
Benefactor 115

Posts: 786

yes I can confirm I had great success countering it with mortars, but still, it catches the Ost player completely off at the first engagement and will be left uncontested at its fuel point for a while. cons/m3 will chase off your mortars/snipers
27 Nov 2013, 19:11 PM
#109
avatar of link0

Posts: 337

Build a sniper. German snipers are pretty much uncounterable except by lucky mortar shots.
27 Nov 2013, 19:33 PM
#110
avatar of VindicareX
Patrion 14

Posts: 312

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2013, 19:11 PMlink0
Build a sniper. German snipers are pretty much uncounterable except by lucky mortar shots.


I agree.
28 Nov 2013, 00:59 AM
#111
avatar of OZtheWiZARD

Posts: 1439

Another game against Deshka and the same tactic worked. Flanking or mortar fire and I even managed to capture one.
28 Nov 2013, 07:07 AM
#112
avatar of GustavGans

Posts: 747

I'm not sure, but to me it seems that the DShK crew dies a lot faster compared to the maxim crew.
I've also had a match where one riflenade destroyed the full health mg thus killing the whole unit.
28 Nov 2013, 15:30 PM
#113
avatar of tuvok
Benefactor 115

Posts: 786

yesterday I lost an mg42 full crew/health to a dshk, in the time it took for the mg to pack up it was gone.
anyway, has this thing got some kind of extra range or los? my sniper at max range with attack move was being shot and suppressed by it (even when ungarrisoned)
28 Nov 2013, 23:43 PM
#114
avatar of OZtheWiZARD

Posts: 1439

Range and arc of fire are the same as Maxims. Not sure about LoS though.
28 Nov 2013, 23:49 PM
#115
avatar of VonMecha

Posts: 419

From what i noticed early with trying to counter maxim spam, is snipers tend to get a few steps closer to targets at the edge of their range circle.Those few steps kept putting the sniper in range of mgs.
28 Nov 2013, 23:52 PM
#116
avatar of VonMecha

Posts: 419

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2013, 19:11 PMlink0
Build a sniper. German snipers are pretty much uncounterable except by lucky mortar shots.
lucky mortars or.......anything, even small puppies.
28 Nov 2013, 23:53 PM
#117
avatar of VonMecha

Posts: 419



I agree.



Which would mean, everyone who builds a german sniper wins 100 percent of the time?
29 Nov 2013, 00:57 AM
#118
avatar of Aerohank

Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post28 Nov 2013, 15:30 PMtuvok
yesterday I lost an mg42 full crew/health to a dshk, in the time it took for the mg to pack up it was gone.
anyway, has this thing got some kind of extra range or los? my sniper at max range with attack move was being shot and suppressed by it (even when ungarrisoned)


Units that shoot at you can be shot back even when in the fog of war. Your sniper probably did the stupid little cover-seek dance which brought it closer to the dshk; you should be able to out-range it normally.
29 Nov 2013, 02:25 AM
#119
avatar of tuvok
Benefactor 115

Posts: 786

ye, also if you attack moved further away the sniper does a couple steps towards an mg while it's being recrewed
29 Nov 2013, 02:31 AM
#120
avatar of jeesuspietari

Posts: 168

From what i noticed early with trying to counter maxim spam, is snipers tend to get a few steps closer to targets at the edge of their range circle.Those few steps kept putting the sniper in range of mgs.


Attack move moves your snipers too close so use the stop command when you're at max range
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