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[Winter Balance Update] OST Feedback

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elchino7
18 Dec 2020, 18:59 PM
#261
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jump backJump back to quoted post18 Dec 2020, 18:34 PMGachiGasm
snip


It's not faster reserves the problem, it's the whole Soviet and general changes package that is bad atm. I got a long post in the making but i got a black out yesterday and now i'll push it later in the proper thread.

To give a short answer: this is just a nerf to T4 rush for either T3476/Katyusha which neither is strong atm. T70 is getting properly nerfed but nothing is improving it's timing nor the effectiveness of Soviets mid game transition.

The mobilize reserve is an excellent upgrade for holding ground, specially behind sandbags but not so much if you need to gain ground.


On it's own, 100mp 20f doesn't look as much. But now compare what ALL other factions are paying for equivalent tools at similar times. The medic cost reduction of 50mp is great but still they are mp inefficient across the board for the first 10 mins of the game.


Enough offtopic for me here.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.

Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.

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mrgame2
19 Dec 2020, 05:58 AM
#262
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1794

i will say sov strength is late game hold out.

the su85, mortar flare, call ins, 7man cons, katsuya. They work great in context of asymmetric armies for coh2, of course im talking 2v2 and team games.

As seen latest cast.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFNaDrCqvvw
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Katitof
19 Dec 2020, 11:05 AM
#263
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Dec 2020, 05:58 AMmrgame2
i will say sov strength is late game hold out.

the su85, mortar flare, call ins, 7man cons, katsuya. They work great in context of asymmetric armies for coh2, of course im talking 2v2 and team games.

As seen latest cast.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFNaDrCqvvw

You do realize that ALL of that is being nerfed?
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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FunPolice
20 Dec 2020, 00:51 AM
#264
avatar of FunPolice

Posts: 133

Can we get the tech changes to Ostheer from this thread? Namely the proposal A change?

https://www.coh2.org/topic/103763/ostheer-tech-restructure

TLDR is pretty much shuffling some costs and tech requirements around to create a place to include a few nondoctrinal units and give them better timings (namely Stug IIIE and Puma). It wouldn't affect anything else timing or cost wise but would be a nice QoL change in preparation to a possible future update for buffing those units in some way.
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spajn
21 Dec 2020, 06:46 AM
#265
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Posts: 927

How about making grenadiers a worthy frontline infantry? Im getting so sick of patch after patch with OST getting trivial tweaks because "they are the most complete faction in the game".

Also REMOVE THE MINE SIGNS FROM S MINES. Why should the shittiest mines in the game also have a sign?

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Katitof
21 Dec 2020, 09:47 AM
#266
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jump backJump back to quoted post21 Dec 2020, 06:46 AMspajn
How about making grenadiers a worthy frontline infantry? Im getting so sick of patch after patch with OST getting trivial tweaks because "they are the most complete faction in the game".

How about that:
Use fucking best supporting units or play actual mainline spam faction if you really want to do that.

Also REMOVE THE MINE SIGNS FROM S MINES. Why should the shittiest mines in the game also have a sign?

So shitty they just got suppression to prevent unavoidable, easy squad wipes?
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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vgfgff
21 Dec 2020, 23:30 PM
#267
avatar of vgfgff

Posts: 177

jump backJump back to quoted post21 Dec 2020, 06:46 AMspajn


Also REMOVE THE MINE SIGNS FROM S MINES. Why should the shittiest mines in the game also have a sign?


this is terrible Idea. S-mine sign already hard to recognize in some area or some situation.
they also took long time to clear it off.

For use sweeper. other MINE need 1-2 sec while mine feild need around 6 sec to clear.

Mortar shot other need 1 shot BOOM gone. minefield need 4-6 shot to clear all of them.
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CODGUY
22 Dec 2020, 01:58 AM
#268
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Posts: 888

jump backJump back to quoted post21 Dec 2020, 06:46 AMspajn
How about making grenadiers a worthy frontline infantry? Im getting so sick of patch after patch with OST getting trivial tweaks because "they are the most complete faction in the game".

Also REMOVE THE MINE SIGNS FROM S MINES. Why should the shittiest mines in the game also have a sign?


How easy should they make this faction for you?
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Descolata
22 Dec 2020, 19:07 PM
#269
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Posts: 486

Can we have Counter Barrage removed from the leFH? No built howitzer has abilities anymore, Counter Barrage is egregious.

it gives the leFH really nasty stats and decreases skill requirement.
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Sander93
22 Dec 2020, 20:15 PM
#270
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

V4 changes

Ostheer

Infanterie Kompanie and Battle Phase 1
Changes to Ostheer teching has been reverted due to how they impact strategies that do not rely on call-ins. Further adjustments will be made to focus on the commander infantry call-ins rather than the tech.
- Changes to fuel costs reverted

Osttruppen
To delay Osttruppen without impacting other strategies, we are moving them to the Tier 1 with the changes to tech being reverted. This will put the deployment time of Osttruppen on-par with Grenadiers
- Reverted changes to being being trained in the HQ with the Osttruppen Commander or being called-in via the Defense Commander
- Are now trained from the Infanterie Kompanie; 25 second build time, 200 manpower cost.
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BetterDead ThanRed
22 Dec 2020, 21:07 PM
#271
avatar of BetterDead ThanRed

Posts: 219

with the possibility of facing 3 factions that has an abundance of artillery, the few artillery left to axis needs something up its sleeve to counter this, until something else of similar value is presented to axis artillery, i think counter-arty needs to be where its at.
OST Wehraboo 4v4 main
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Widerstreit
22 Dec 2020, 22:57 PM
#272
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Posts: 1392

Still thinking you guys kill Osttruppen.
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Descolata
22 Dec 2020, 23:07 PM
#273
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Posts: 486

jump backJump back to quoted post22 Dec 2020, 21:07 PMBetterDead ThanRed
with the possibility of facing 3 factions that has an abundance of artillery, the few artillery left to axis needs something up its sleeve to counter this, until something else of similar value is presented to axis artillery, i think counter-arty needs to be where its at.


The problem is every other faction gave up its artillery ability, its just a weird dichotomy. The leFH is just a slightly tweaked ML/20, but it kept its Vet 1 skill. Just use the barrage like all other arti does, auto-firing death shells with massively increased range is a weird quirk. Doesn't make sense relative to any near-peers.
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Katitof
22 Dec 2020, 23:18 PM
#274
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post22 Dec 2020, 22:57 PMWiderstreit
Still thinking you guys kill Osttruppen.

That's the whole idea.
And if you think making them arrive 10 second later and forcing 80 more manpower(giving them also early faust in the process) makes them non viable, then great, one less osttruppen spammer!
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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KT610
22 Dec 2020, 23:43 PM
#275
avatar of KT610

Posts: 69

If Osttruppen are going to T1 then could you please remove their out of cover penalty. Their gimmick of being garbage out of cover was fine when you could get them out faster than Grens, but now they're going to need some kind of buff to make someone be willing to take them over grens.
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Katitof
22 Dec 2020, 23:48 PM
#276
avatar of Katitof

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jump backJump back to quoted post22 Dec 2020, 23:43 PMKT610
If Osttruppen are going to T1 then could you please remove their out of cover penalty. Their gimmick of being garbage out of cover was fine when you could get them out faster than Grens, but now they're going to need some kind of buff to make someone be willing to take them over grens.

Osttruppen reserves at mobile defense commander arrive at 3(4?) CP and they still have it, so timing is no argument in any way.

Also, it would make them insanely OP.

They still are 20% cheaper and don't bleed much.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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KT610
22 Dec 2020, 23:59 PM
#277
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Posts: 69

jump backJump back to quoted post22 Dec 2020, 23:48 PMKatitof

Osttruppen reserves at mobile defense commander arrive at 3(4?) CP and they still have it, so timing is no argument in any way.

Also, it would make them insanely OP.

They still are 20% cheaper and don't bleed much.


Just raise thier cost to compensate for thier improved combat ability, I wouldn't mind paying 230 to 240 for Osttruppen if it means they are decent at fighting
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Katitof
23 Dec 2020, 00:04 AM
#278
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Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post22 Dec 2020, 23:59 PMKT610


Just raise thier cost to compensate for thier improved combat ability

And miss the whole point of osttruppen in the process?

They are cheap meatshields.
They were never meant to completely replace grens in any way, but to support them.

The change brings them closer to that role.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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KT610
23 Dec 2020, 00:12 AM
#279
avatar of KT610

Posts: 69

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Dec 2020, 00:04 AMKatitof

And miss the whole point of osttruppen in the process?

They are cheap meatshields.
They were never meant to completely replace grens in any way, but to support them.

The change brings them closer to that role.


They will still be cheap meatshields, and have always been used as a replacement for grens
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TickTack
23 Dec 2020, 03:40 AM
#280
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Posts: 578

I'd consider making ostruppen build time quicker, e.g. 8-15 secs; this helps make it a panic crutch buy at T1 when you really need more boots on the ground and helps balance it's slower arrival
It's Relic's responsibility.
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