ARVE is better then sturmtiger? Just ARVI is available at 9 CP. And the Sturmtiger is 8 CP.
Sturmtiger and ARVE
22 Apr 2020, 18:20 PM
#1
Posts: 268
Driver, let's get this show on the road.
22 Apr 2020, 18:25 PM
#2
Posts: 960
The AVRE has a turret, the shell flies in a higher arc (doesn't land short), and auto-reloads with no movement penalty. I'd say that's a lot better.
In general, you don't "rush" an AVRE or ST, so the 1 point difference isn't that important, imo.
In general, you don't "rush" an AVRE or ST, so the 1 point difference isn't that important, imo.
Opinions reflect all team modes (not 1v1)
I often edit my posts several times after posting
I often edit my posts several times after posting
22 Apr 2020, 18:33 PM
#3
Posts: 268
The AVRE has a turret, the shell flies in a higher arc (doesn't land short), and auto-reloads with no movement penalty. I'd say that's a lot better.
In general, you don't "rush" an AVRE or ST, so the 1 point difference isn't that important, imo.
It would be more correct to say about the advantages of the stormtiger now.
Driver, let's get this show on the road.
22 Apr 2020, 18:46 PM
#4
Posts: 960
It would be more correct to say about the advantages of the stormtiger now.
What advantages does the ST have, though? It comes one point earlier, has a grenade vet ability, and (I THINK) the rocket can stun tanks.
Again, you're almost never going to rush an AVRE or ST, so the point difference isn't really important. The grenade vet ability is nice, but nothing incredible. The vehicle stun is also nice, but again, you're probably not going to use it in that way.
Both are generally used against infantry or fortifications, where accuracy and speed are key. The AVRE having a turret means that it can fire quicker (the entire tank doesn't need to turn to face the enemy), and the higher arc means it doesn't land short nearly as often (like the ST). Both of those are, imo, fairly large advantages.
Either way, both are incredibly off-meta, so the 5% or 10% difference in "power level" really isn't that important.
Opinions reflect all team modes (not 1v1)
I often edit my posts several times after posting
I often edit my posts several times after posting
22 Apr 2020, 18:46 PM
#5
Posts: 956
It would be more correct to say about the advantages of the stormtiger now.
It has 200 more hp (1280 vs 1040), but less armor (220 vs 290), slightly smaller and faster but has a longer delay before firing iirc. Does 580 vs 440 damage \o/
Has a very nice auto-targeting grenade launcher at vet I.
EDIT: Posted at the same time as Mr.Doom. I'm inclined to agree with him that the AVRE has better advantages overall, slightly outweighed by its 1cp later arrival.
For Italy! We have outfoxed the enemy once more!
22 Apr 2020, 18:50 PM
#6
Posts: 132
Sturmtiger is clearly the superior.
Sturmtiger - AVRE
Range: 40 - 35
Damage: 580 - 440
Vet0 HP: 1280 - 1080
Max vet HP: 1440 - 1080
Armor: 220/110 - 290/180
Max vet Armor: 242/121 - 290/180
So clearly sturmtiger is better since it can almost 1 shot an allied tank. Also it has auto nade ability and as for the reload with vet the sturmtiger reloads on the move too. Given the option of 221 in the commander, it needs to be nerfed since now you can spawn a sturm and KT easily all you have to do is make 2*221.
Sturmtiger - AVRE
Range: 40 - 35
Damage: 580 - 440
Vet0 HP: 1280 - 1080
Max vet HP: 1440 - 1080
Armor: 220/110 - 290/180
Max vet Armor: 242/121 - 290/180
So clearly sturmtiger is better since it can almost 1 shot an allied tank. Also it has auto nade ability and as for the reload with vet the sturmtiger reloads on the move too. Given the option of 221 in the commander, it needs to be nerfed since now you can spawn a sturm and KT easily all you have to do is make 2*221.
22 Apr 2020, 18:52 PM
#7
Posts: 785
>Sturmtiger has less armor than Pz IV J
Wait what
Was it always this way?
Wait what
Was it always this way?
22 Apr 2020, 18:56 PM
#8
Posts: 1614 | Subs: 3
AVRE has a bigger OHK radius against infantry outside of green cover than the Sturmtiger.
22 Apr 2020, 18:59 PM
#9
Posts: 268
Sturmtiger is clearly the superior.
Sturmtiger - AVRE
Range: 40 - 35
Damage: 580 - 440
Vet0 HP: 1280 - 1080
Max vet HP: 1440 - 1080
Armor: 220/110 - 290/180
Max vet Armor: 242/121 - 290/180
So clearly sturmtiger is better since it can almost 1 shot an allied tank. Also it has auto nade ability and as for the reload with vet the sturmtiger reloads on the move too. Given the option of 221 in the commander, it needs to be nerfed since now you can spawn a sturm and KT easily all you have to do is make 2*221.
Still need to consider AOE radius and reload speed. I also like ARVI more, but I don’t understand why it comes at 9 CP.
Driver, let's get this show on the road.
22 Apr 2020, 19:11 PM
#10
Posts: 773
I would say the AVRE wins out based on its turret and reload mechanics, but, doesnt the ST come in a doctrine that gives HEAT rounds and faster resourses via a vehicle, whereas the AVRE gives you command vehicle and flame mortars off map and is locked behind a fairly meh commander.
22 Apr 2020, 19:27 PM
#11
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
Damage alone does not mean much without the AOE profile.
I personally find AVRE better than ST because of it responsiveness.
It high acceleration rotation and turret allow it move in and fire allot faster than ST.
Finally allied TDs are more cost efficient than Axis.
I personally find AVRE better than ST because of it responsiveness.
It high acceleration rotation and turret allow it move in and fire allot faster than ST.
Finally allied TDs are more cost efficient than Axis.
22 Apr 2020, 19:29 PM
#12
Posts: 833
They are both skillshot units compared to traditional heavies. You need to be pretty good at predicting retreat paths or vehicle pathing to hit reliably.
I feel like they could both use a minor reload buff honestly, commander KT and croc both do the support weapon killing better
I feel like they could both use a minor reload buff honestly, commander KT and croc both do the support weapon killing better
Let's unite the CoH2 community and make sure racism is
22 Apr 2020, 19:56 PM
#13
Posts: 2358
Are we really complaining about ST?
To begin with don't compare between units to demand buffs. Second both units are far from the hot spot of meta and imbalance.
Edited. Missread the op name
To begin with don't compare between units to demand buffs. Second both units are far from the hot spot of meta and imbalance.
Edited. Missread the op name
22 Apr 2020, 20:07 PM
#14
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
What advantages does the ST have, though?
Being able to field it with fucking KT would be one.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
22 Apr 2020, 20:16 PM
#15
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
AVRE is better than ST because it doesn't have such along aim time/wind up or whatever determines how fast they shoot after receiving the order. The AVRE also has a more reliable arc so it doesn't collide with terrain as often. It also reloads on the move which is very good compared to the clunky Sturmtiger.
22 Apr 2020, 20:18 PM
#16
Posts: 268
Being able to field it with fucking KT would be one.
That is not a real upside, since you will very rarly see them both on the field. If you do, the enemy is beaten by then anyway or it is a 4v4 slugfest in which case any form of balance is basically not existing.
22 Apr 2020, 20:27 PM
#17
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
AVRE is better than ST because it doesn't have such along aim time/wind up or whatever determines how fast they shoot after receiving the order. The AVRE also has a more reliable arc so it doesn't collide with terrain as often. It also reloads on the move which is very good compared to the clunky Sturmtiger.
Sturmtiger reloads on the move now... It slows down as Doom said first (misread).
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
22 Apr 2020, 20:38 PM
#18
Posts: 1954
I hardly ever see the Avre, but don't know if that it because of the AVRE or the commander being mediocre.
I see the Sturmtiger sometimes. When people try it on something like Redball, it usually isn't that great as it is easy to counter if you have good vision on it, even with it's huge HP pool. It does seem odd that it has low armor and such a high HP. It seems like the armor should be a lot more and the HP maybe less.
I see the Sturmtiger sometimes. When people try it on something like Redball, it usually isn't that great as it is easy to counter if you have good vision on it, even with it's huge HP pool. It does seem odd that it has low armor and such a high HP. It seems like the armor should be a lot more and the HP maybe less.
22 Apr 2020, 20:50 PM
#19
Posts: 1954
AVRE is better than ST because it doesn't have such along aim time/wind up or whatever determines how fast they shoot after receiving the order. The AVRE also has a more reliable arc so it doesn't collide with terrain as often. It also reloads on the move which is very good compared to the clunky Sturmtiger.
I just watched a replay of mine where a teammate got both a ST and a KT. In about 10 minutes, he got six kills with the ST. That number would zoom up to about 10 if you included friendlies, as one of his shots collided with a pole or something and got one of his squads. Watched on 8x speed, the whole thing looked like a Monty Python movie.
When he got the KT, he dove them both into 3x FF and a Churchill, losing both while inflicting no losses. Maybe the ST is great for good players but for bad players it can be comically bad. At the end of the game, the player that got both did about half of the damage of anyone else on the team.
22 Apr 2020, 21:38 PM
#20
Posts: 5279
Are is miles ahead of the Sturm tiger imo. The Sturm is so akward to use with the casemate design and LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOIOOOOOOOOOOOONG wind up before shooting. Combine with the lovely feature where it doesn't always hit where you aim unless the thing you meant to aim at was the fence post 1/4 of the way between yuu and the enemy that is.
On top of that the avre has more health and way cooler vet.
There are exactly zero scenarios where given the option I would ever pick a Sturm tiger over an AVRE. In fact the Sturm tiger has gone from THE reason I picked elite armour the the only item in the commander I nearly never use and ALWAYS regret putting resources into the few times I do stupidly pick it. It's just trash plain and simple. Get more out of slapping HEAT onto the p4 for both AI and AT than what you put into an ST
On top of that the avre has more health and way cooler vet.
There are exactly zero scenarios where given the option I would ever pick a Sturm tiger over an AVRE. In fact the Sturm tiger has gone from THE reason I picked elite armour the the only item in the commander I nearly never use and ALWAYS regret putting resources into the few times I do stupidly pick it. It's just trash plain and simple. Get more out of slapping HEAT onto the p4 for both AI and AT than what you put into an ST
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