Login

russian armor
COH2.ORG » Forums » Parlor Room » COH2 Central » COH2 Balance » State of Heavies

State of Heavies

PAGES (7)down
New topic New topic     Upload replay New Reply
LoopDloop
11 Jan 2020, 19:00 PM
#21
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 3053

jump backJump back to quoted post10 Jan 2020, 21:17 PMblvckdream
The balance team wanted to make them more reliable but less able to randomly wipe. They didn't achieve this at all, now they wipe even more while still being very RNG depended. It's still very hit or miss especially with the KT.

Locking them behind T4 was the right choice. But the CP requirements need to go up 2 CP. Right now they arrive too early.

The IS2 has too much armour, it needs to go down to around 330 IMO. Right now it's too hard to penetrate even for Tigers, Panthers and Kingtigers. JP4 is basically useless against it unless you have good RNG.

I think the heavy tank AOE profiles need to be slightly reduced for all heavies apart from the KT, which is still not that great overall IMO.

OKW meta is so boring now because Grand Offensive is the only viable doctrine in 1v1 and 2v2. Then again all their other doctrines are mediocre so it's not just a Grand Offensive problem. And even Grand Offensive is just good because of the Tiger.

+1

Luftwaffe is good as okw too though. 2cp elite infantry that are good at all ranges with camo plz. And whatever commander you go you can still get KT so that's not really a factor.
Playercard of LoopDloop

1v1: P2v2: P3v3: P4v4: P
1v1: P2v2: P3v3: P4v4: P
1v1: P2v2: P3v3: P4v4: P
1v1: P2v2: P3v3: P4v4: P


Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
thedarkarmadillo
11 Jan 2020, 20:51 PM
#22
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279

Yea as far as the is-2 goes... Now that it's finally reliable cannon I think it's other traits are over performing. The armour and range combined with the reliable gun makes it a bit much.

Lowering its armour slightly (350? 325?) and changing its vet around so it actually has to USE its armour would be nice. In exchange maybe making its cannon more unique--modifiers vs structures and vehicles as it vets so it stands out a bit without being too op against infantry perhaps?
#stalinwept
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Stug life
12 Jan 2020, 00:09 AM
#23
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

jump backJump back to quoted post11 Jan 2020, 18:30 PMSkysTheLimit


Oh yeah cause those 2 tanks are clearly struggling so much right now...

sky can u read please, i said that is 2 would only have a 5 rnage difference from stug at vet 0 with the changes as as all the other have said to me, 5 range is not enough to out range

while tiger would still be 15 range difference from su 85 or su 76

leaving again ost in the dust

just remove 5 range from vet bonus

or even better chance is 2 vet and nerf base armor

armor to 320-330
vet range bonus removed , added 10% more armor with vet (like panther)
katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
SkysTheLimit
12 Jan 2020, 05:52 AM
#24
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2020, 00:09 AMStug life
sky can u read please, i said that is 2 would only have a 5 rnage difference from stug at vet 0 with the changes as as all the other have said to me, 5 range is not enough to out range


The stug isn't even supposed to counter heavy tanks? Idk why you think it should

If you want to increase it's range it should probably lose damage, just like su76
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Stug life
12 Jan 2020, 11:57 AM
#25
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2020, 05:52 AMSkysTheLimit


The stug isn't even supposed to counter heavy tanks? Idk why you think it should

If you want to increase it's range it should probably lose damage, just like su76
I already did propose it but balance

Well same would be for panther as it has 50 range Vs the is 2 50 range at vet 2

Stug could use some changes tho maybe vet 1 ?
katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Fire and Terror
12 Jan 2020, 12:31 PM
#26
avatar of Fire and Terror

Posts: 306

vet 1 from the stug could certainly do full dmg, it sucks now , i would be carefull with range buffs
FIRE AND TERROR PLAYERCARD https://www.coh2.org/ladders/playercard/steamid/76561198321057937
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Widerstreit
12 Jan 2020, 13:54 PM
#27
avatar of Widerstreit

Posts: 1392

StuG could lose the Vet1 ability, but gets a stationary range buff as ability to get 62,5 range (as hull-down) so it can't be trolled. Can only rotate. Like in CoH1 MarderIII.

Edit: then change hull-down effect, so it only gets armor-buff and no range-buff. Maybe could bring back a reload advantage for StuG then.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Alphrum
12 Jan 2020, 13:56 PM
#28
avatar of Alphrum

Posts: 808

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2020, 11:57 AMStug life
I already did propose it but balance

Well same would be for panther as it has 50 range Vs the is 2 50 range at vet 2

Stug could use some changes tho maybe vet 1 ?


maybe stug can have an upgrade option that costs either munitions or MP and Fuel, that buffs its main gun Pen and range while nerfing its ROF
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Crecer13
12 Jan 2020, 14:01 PM
#29
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 2184 | Subs: 2

Current state of Heavy Tanks better than before the change. Before the changes, Heavy tanks were unnecessary - they arrived late, right at the end of the game, their characteristics were not worth their price. And even if you have resources for a heavy tank, then it is simply unnecessary for you because Heavy tanks come late and the limit of units is already full.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
SkysTheLimit
12 Jan 2020, 16:23 PM
#30
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2020, 11:57 AMStug life

Stug could use some changes tho maybe vet 1 ?


For sure could use some changes. I think made a thread about giving it a health buff with vet, there were some other good ideas in there too

I think Vipper came up with a Target size reduction idea that I liked. I think making it slightly less easy to kill is preferable to increasing it's killing power if that makes sense
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
aaa
12 Jan 2020, 18:08 PM
#31
avatar of aaa

Posts: 1487

heavies are in and obnoxious state. They all should be nerfed to pre-patch level or to level of kv2 = better than mediums but not many times better.












Playercard of eqdw

1v1: None2v2: None3v3: None4v4: None
1v1: None2v2: None3v3: None4v4: None
1v1: 1452v2: 4433v3: None4v4: P
1v1: P2v2: P3v3: None4v4: P



SteamId is set to private for user id aaa. Set it to public if you want to link to your playercard via your user id.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Esxile
12 Jan 2020, 18:13 PM
#32
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1

At the moment they give too much for their cost. You can have a heavy with a decent army size around while your opponent need to cut 30+ popcap only to counter them.

Not all heavy are problematic thought, only the generalists that are too good vs anything. Pershing IS2 and tigers (all variants) should have weaknesses and if people don't want to see their stats nerfed, then nerf their popcap, reduce the size of the supportive army around them.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
thedarkarmadillo
12 Jan 2020, 18:23 PM
#33
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279

I really don't want to see pop cap nerfs. Imo they are already too high and it puts a lot of weight on them HAVING to be obnoxious. I think I'd rather them start weaker and scale more dramatically. This would also help fix the awful team game float where taking loses knocking out a heavy tank that's just replaced instantly and it being a terror if you lost anything knocking it out.
#stalinwept
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Esxile
12 Jan 2020, 18:35 PM
#34
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1

Then they'll be too expansive for their price and people will stop using them. People will also complain that their vet is unreachable etc...

Imo Heavy should have never been more that a better version of premium medium tank as the pershing is.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Mazianni
12 Jan 2020, 18:43 PM
#35
avatar of Mazianni

Posts: 785

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2020, 18:35 PMEsxile
Then they'll be too expansive for their price and people will stop using them. People will also complain that their vet is unreachable etc...

Imo Heavy should have never been more that a better version of premium medium tank as the pershing is.


Could be interesting to make the Tiger into a Super Panther with 60 range and some better AOE besides the obvious hp and armor advantage. But then the Elefant would be even less desirable.

That or round switches for all these units a la the M4A3.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
thedarkarmadillo
12 Jan 2020, 18:44 PM
#36
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2020, 18:35 PMEsxile
Then they'll be too expansive for their price and people will stop using them. People will also complain that their vet is unreachable etc...

Imo Heavy should have never been more that a better version of premium medium tank as the pershing is.

Well I mean, if we are overhauling them and reworking their vet we could (bear with me on this) rework their vet REQUIREMENTS too! If more power is gated behind vet their true potential would come from scaling and preserving them so they could be cheaper and hit a bit sooner. If we're talking about a rework any aspect can be reworked. Trying to fit performance to a fixed price point is where many balance issues reside.
#stalinwept
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
aaa
12 Jan 2020, 18:45 PM
#37
avatar of aaa

Posts: 1487

they should not
1. be no skill win button as now

2. nulify noob play early mid game. As now when it arrives it just sits in the center behind building for the rest of the game. with no way to get it out of there

they were fine pre patch btw
Playercard of eqdw

1v1: None2v2: None3v3: None4v4: None
1v1: None2v2: None3v3: None4v4: None
1v1: 1452v2: 4433v3: None4v4: P
1v1: P2v2: P3v3: None4v4: P



SteamId is set to private for user id aaa. Set it to public if you want to link to your playercard via your user id.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
aerafield
12 Jan 2020, 19:00 PM
#38
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 3032 | Subs: 3

I just wish their anti infantry capability would return to pre-patch levels :s

Or what about turning them into tank destroyers by nerfing their anti inf hard but buffing armor and/or penetration


Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
Katitof
12 Jan 2020, 19:04 PM
#39
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2020, 19:00 PMaerafield
I just wish their anti infantry capability would return to pre-patch levels :s

Or what about turning them into tank destroyers by nerfing their anti inf hard but buffing armor and/or penetration




Allies already have TDs that can tackle everything except super heavy TDs, axis already have super heavy TDs and panthers exist.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
aerafield
12 Jan 2020, 19:11 PM
#40
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 3032 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jan 2020, 19:04 PMKatitof


Allies already have TDs that can tackle everything except super heavy TDs, axis already have super heavy TDs and panthers exist.


yeah I guess they would be somewhere between panther and elefant/ISU level
Reply Reply Multi Quote Reply Reply
PAGES (7)down
New topic New topic     Upload replay New Reply
0 user is browsing this thread:
COH2.ORG » Forums » Parlor Room » COH2 Central » COH2 Balance » State of Heavies

Ladders Top 10

UKF
USF
OKW
SOV
OST
1v1
2v2
3v3
4v4
  • #
    Steam Alias
    W
    L
    %
    Streak
Data provided by Relic Relic Entertainment

Replay highlight

Top Tier Teams
VS
  • U.S. Forces flag cblanco ★
  • The British Forces flag 보드카 중대
  • Oberkommando West flag VonManteuffel
  • Ostheer flag Heartless Jäger
Einhoven Country
Einhoven Country Honor
Honor it
10
 Download
Download
1243
uploaded by XXxxHeartlessxxXX

Board Info

526 users are online: 2 members and 524 guests
villagetalkies, PatFenis
0 post in the last 24h
2 posts in the last week
28 posts in the last month
Registered members: 49388
Welcome our newest member, KETTA
Most online: 2043 users on 29 Oct 2023, 01:04 AM