OK, stop for a second.
Click on my playercard.
Probably unlike you, I play all 4 factions.
Thus, I do not select a map based on how likely I am to win in it, but on how much I like it.
Allies ARE a bit favored on close quarters map. I still tick them off because I hate close-quarters map as a rule in every Relic game.
This has nothing to do with a L2P issue, and everything with me using the map veto feature to not play on maps I don't like. I'm not sure how much clearer I can explain that.
And for the last time, until you show your own playercard you have no business using the l2p argument on myself or, really, absolutely anyone else. Until you show it, I will assume you aren't good at the game and are as biased in your playtime as you are in these forums. As such, I'll stop wasting my time and will no longer answer you anymore, since you have absolutely nothing worthwhile to contribute.
I dont deal with the epeen of the playercard nonsense second it would be worthless as more then player is using my steam account. Third l2p you may not like urban maps but your putting yourself at a rather huge disadvantage. |
And please point me to a battle where the germans fended off a much superior enemy post battle of stalingrad. Where did
these battle hardened troops come from? Most were fresh recruits.
Bagration only destroyed army group middle. even so nearly 50% of the german soldiers managed to retreat then their where army group north and south which also had quality soldiers. |
On the contrary, Obers vs Shocks looked at on a variety of maps, game modes, faction match ups, and everything else, over a long period of time, Obers will be the more effective unit. That is not asymmetric balance.
Asymmetric balance means that some aspects of a faction is going to be more efficient then the other faction. in the case for the OKW they have superior infantry. this is to compensate for their piss poor AT gun fuel penalties and being compromised out of an army of specialist. |
Oh, that's rich, why don't you stop hiding your playercard if you're going to start the L2P arguments?
Shocks are better on urban maps (unless infrared STG44s enter the picture I suppose), which I hate and avoid like the plague. In literally every other situation, Obers are better because they don't have to waste time and men closing in to start killing stuff. Their veterancy is also much better and makes them damn near immune to small arms by vet 4, which is completely retarded.
Did you just seriously say you avoid cc map as allies? this is not a minor l2p issue its HUGE l2p issue. urban maps is where the allies practically thrive. |
Uh, So I guess it had nothing to do with bad allied intelligence, an over stretched and badly supplied combat force, paratroopers fighting armoured divisions or the good planning by Von Rundstedt and Model after all...
.
The question was had the germans an army of battle hardened soldiers on the day of the Ardennes offensive. The answer is yes and burts is talking shit. that said it was also the last veterans they had on the western front and when the army was wiped out the allies found no significant resistance any longer. And that was history for today
I dont believe obers are an issue. the only infantry that cost as much: shocks can definitely beat them. as can rifleman with upgrades.
Its also needed. despite what people are saying volks are not efficient AI. sure they stand their ground to scripts but when under pressure of any other infantry they melt. and then is the lack of a easy to get generalist and a fuel penalty and obers are in a fine spot. |
Instead of nerfing them I'd like to see a price adjustment so they cannot be spammed without having to sacrifice something. 400 MP with an LMG32 is a steal for the performance they give. I feel a cost to upgrade to an LMG32 is warranted (less munitions spent on Volks shreks now) and the reinforcement cost increased. I've seen enough tactics now where spamming Volks with Shrek's and Ober's will carry them over to a King Tiger. Meh.
are you shitting me? obers cost 50 a piece with shocktrooper protection and essentially a slightly better gren rifle. the reason they cost 50 mp is because they come pre equipped with the lmg34 otherwise they would be utterly cost ineffective. |
Except Obers do not suffer from the penalty in any way. 400 mp for OKW is the same as 400 mp for anyone else. That's why they at least needs a muni cost on their LMG from hell.
And as someone who uses both units, shocks are not in the same league; not only are they doctrinal, they are short-ranged and require the use of smoke and micro all the time to properly use against good player. Obers? against anything but a big blob or a tank, a-move and automatically win. They can't do anything to tanks, but OKW has extremely good anti-tank in all their tiers as well as shrecks on their basic squad, while Obers are all the anti-infantry firepower they will ever need.
Bullshit. The strength of obers or Shocks is completely dependant on terrain and how you use them. and you obviously use shocks the wrong way. |
I never saw Shocks suad with 70+ kills.
Neither have i but i see grne squads with 50+ but perhaps it has something to with the fact the axis field a whole lot less infantry as a whole. |
Obers are Stock units -
Other elite infantry are doctrinal.
Ober LMG has twice the DPS of the regular MG42 - anyone defend why it shouldnt have the same DPS as the lmg42, as the lmg34 also can be shot on the move?
Price never justifies performance. On the ober price/teching logic, it would be perfectly fine for the Soviets to call in the Hammer of Dawn for 300 munitions after all tiers are built, and this weapon instantly destroys every OKW player's deployed truck. But its balanced because it is expensive, right?
This elite infantry is available every game - and who is NOT going to build OKW T4? OKW T4 is the only final tier that rewards an elite infantry unit - the equivalent of 6 inches of icing on top of a cake - and obers are massively cost efficient and handle doctrinal elite infantry very well. Obers snipe models on the move and kill squads whole, paying for themselves. Half the time, an OKW plays so conservatively, that he realizes that he can field 2-3 obersoldaten to deal with everything. The simple availability of the unit is way too much to begin with...
With the muni you didnt spend on obersoldaten, you can buy panzerschrecks for your early game volks to guard your obers from tanks.
Post me a replay where you are able to hold your own against trifles or soviets elites with volks and mg's. then you realise that you are over exaggerating by a fuckton. The strenght of obers is all but mandatory. |
I didn't say they were cheap. You were implying that they are more expensive than other elite infantry. No allied units are more expensive (except the 440 call in cost for shocks, or the 120 muni upgrade for paras), yet Obers will win most engagements consistently against any other elite infantry in the game, despite being roughly equal in terms of cost.
You dont even know your stuff. shocks are 390 mp and will always beat the obers short range. and para are more expensive because their ability to drop but cost as much as a rifleman per entity and with their lmg upgrade it simply depends who gets the drop on who and if the para's have the suppression ability activated. so the elites are doing so badly.
Second part a lot of people play like idiots and believe that that 3 scripts can take on 3 obers.
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