Hardly "dirt cheap" at 240mp.
Tbh cons wouldn't seem so trash if volks couldn't do nearly everything they can, but better for nothing but an extra 10mp and thr desire to get tanks.
Comparing cons to volks you end up paying almost the same, for less. The you dump extra resources into sidegrades that preform worse.
Cons should be cheaper if they are to remain as an unbundled squad plain and simple. They are supposed to be a choice for early map control... One that is matched by both enemy factions base squads (both of whom out fight and out scale cons) their costs simply don't reflect their performance. Oorah doesn't offset STGs.
Perhaps swapping oorah into the ppsh doctrines and making hit the dirt cons vet 1 could make them a bit more attractive by making iy so they maybe at some point CAN hold ground by out lasting the enemy instead of bleeding mp by dying in mass while killing nothing?
I'm more talking about the 20 mp reinforce cost.
In general, I find cons to be great if supported by elite infantry. They don't do a lot of damage but they're cheap to reinforce and get pretty tough with vet and have good utility. Team weapons work too, but the maxim kinda sucks so 
I think volks are able to do too much tbh. Not sure how I'd change that, but I don't think that they should be able to have as much utility as they do and still be able to go toe to toe with more expensive allied infantry. Although cons do have an extra man and can sprint, so that's the one thing they have over volks. |
Don't know why you keep bringing this up, there are tons of weapons in the game that have multiple versions or types because the game is only historically flavoured and chooses gameplay over reality. Different mechanisms are used for either variety or different gameplay purposes.
There are three different types of the 88mm L/71 gun, Tommies Bren and UC Bren, 3 different types of MG 42 (with up to 7 different versions), 3 different types of G43, two different versions of the 75mm L/70, almost all standard issue rifles having up to three or more different versions, do I need to go on?
My favorite is the 3 vastly different types of stgs in the game rn.
222 is the outlier here if anything, not the greyhound. Consider that even an AT vehicle like AEC gets killed by double 222 if it has no AT support. Usf at least can go for a stuart if they feel the need to.
You can't really think of 222 as if it was m3. It is a higher tier vehicle, but its price has been reduced to m3 level for some weird reasons.
Yeah I think you're right. AEC also has rather low armor that makes it really easy for 222s to pen tho, and doesn't have that much dps. Same deal with the greyhound I guess, but the latter point is accentuated. |
All of which arnt late game units. Sturms arnt even strong past the first five minutes.
Not like other portions of the game have an impact on the lategame /s.
Also, pgrens aren't a lategame unit and are therefore irrelevant then so are riflemen. |
I think I now agree that its dps probably shouldn't go up. I think my issue with it might be that it seems to die so fast to other vehicles. Haven't had a ton of matchups against with vehicles against it yet but that's my guess. I'm open to the possibility that it might just be something I have to adjust to, but again, it is 60 fuel. If a luchs died that easily to like, 2 clown cars it'd be an issue too, even though it's an AI vehicle as well.
M8 Greyhound
222 is dedicated LV hunter what did u expect ? are u saying the 222 should have no AI and AT ?
Compare using the 222 on infantry to using the puma or AEC (which are both over double the fuel price) and you'll see how an actual dedicated LV hunter does against infantry. Granted, the puma and AEC both do much better against vehicles as designed. |
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IMO its pretty much fine how it is. Conscripts should have to unlock their utilities if only because they're already a dirt cheap squad with 6 men and sprint, and get really tough with vet. Sure, their utilities are what keeps them in the game, but I never found the sidetech to be too much of an issue with soviets for whatever reason. |
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In situations where it works, I find battlegroup to be a lot more dependable. I love the luchs and puma and they're both great units, but its almost impossible to lose ISGs and having healing for your infantry is great, and if you feel like you need a vehicle, you have the flaktrack, and if not, then your first tank is out significantly sooner than when you go mech.
Going mech with some falls is one of my favorite things to do as as okw though. Not much in the midgame that can stand up to that combo (if you back it with proper AT support ofc). |
Its not like USF infantry is superior to all others or anything though /s
Its not like other factions have way more options or anything though /s
If you want examples wehr has sniper, mg, and mortar available to them within like 30 seconds, okw has sturms as starting unit as well as a t0 light (light light light) vehicle and at gun and mg regardless of tech choice, and both have nondoc elite infantry (pgrens and obers). And usf doesn't have one vehicle in their entire nondoc lineup that doesn't die in 4 at gun shots or less, and not one bit of nondoc flames in their entire arsenal except for WP on the pack howie (which isn't really the same thing). Brits and soviets tend to have them beat in all those departments too. |
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Unrelated, but it also seems to hit pretty much every object in the way of it. I had it shoot a stone wall in front of an mg garrison instead of the mg in the building on kholodny so many times that it broke the wall, and didn't hit the building once until the wall was broken. |
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Title. I mean, I understand that it's not really supposed to be a stuart or anything but the fact that it only sorta kinda beats a 222 and just has crazy low anti vehicle dps in general, but is also super squishy, seems kind of odd for such an expensive vehicle. It's over double the fuel cost of a 222, so it should at least solidly win that matchup IMO. |
A unit that has to be massed to be effective isn't good balance *cough maxim* and a unit being like that out of fear of it being massed, yet forced to be is just plain stupid
+1
Big fax. |
Bleb Feesh
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