I domt wang it as a call in, just a buildable option in the hq once unlocked.i agree that the combo is great value, but i want 2 squads of them im shelling out far too much.
How do Shock Troops fall short? |
There aren't really any half track call ins that are really worth the slot
You've got maybe the UKF and USF for the meatchopper, but it's no luch or T70. Then you've got the ost 250, all these are OK.
Then you've got stuff like the UKF resupply half-track that nobody uses because you have to research bren tech before it can drop piats or lmgs defeating the purpose. And also stuff like the guards half-track that is pointless when soviets already have non doc access to the same half-track. Tacking it on just defeats the purpose of calling in cqb squads on usually tiny maps where mobile reinforcing is kind of pointless.
It would be nice to see a rework of half-tracks so they are made more viable. At the moment they are kind of ignored and unwanted in favor of light tanks. Maybe if they had some sort of timed AP ability for the MGs on front so they're not dead weight as soon as a light tank shows up, but this ability would be lost if upgrading to flamer or quad.
Timing.
The USF meat chopper costs 240 MP in a faction that usually pays about 350 for an AAHT. It's also available early regardless of your tech path.
The Soviet M5 call-in hits at CP3, which is much earlier than its usual T3 timing. Don't underestimate its shock value, especially against Ostheer.
The UKF meat chopper arrives at CP2. With the changes to Assault Sections, it may well be outright overpowered now. |
If the truck is to stay, it should provide something unique.
Again, that call-in is a leftover from the prehistoric times, when soviets were allowed to put down only 2 tiers and it was supplementing T4 builds.
Nowadays, HT serves no purpose in the call-in.
It hits at a much earlier timing than T3 in 1v1.
It was a joke when it was at CP5, but it got moved to CP3 a couple of patches ago.
Raising their proce wouldn't dissuade their use, as it is if you want 2 squads of them you are out a heap of fuel so a bit more MP wouldnt hurt that much.
But then you've just got another CQC call-in. If you want a CQC call in, pick a Shock doc. There are loads to choose from.
The M5/Assault Guard bundle's an interesting mechanic: you get an early M5 (but only one) and a dirt cheap CQC squad (but only one). If you get the timing right, you can pull a big power spike. There's no need whatsoever to get rid of it to make way for yet another generic CQC call-in. |
A 50 manpower discount on grenades saves you... nothing because no one techs grenades anyway. Speaking more seriously, ~80-90% of the time the buff will do literally nothing. In the times where it does make a difference, it'll save you less than 1% of the manpower you already accrued.
The grenade tech would be more important if there weren't so many ways to sidestep it. It only really affects nondoctrinal infantry, so going any sort of doctrinal unit even further discourages it.
Perhaps it'd be worthwhile locking a few more grenades behind the sidetech? The USF cooked grenades and the UKF light gammon bombs (given the Assault Officer) in particular ought to require the tech, else you'd just use those instead.
Otherwise, you might as well scrap the grenade tech entirely and throw its cost on the weapon racks. |
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Assault Guards are great. They're a dirt cheap triple Thompson squad, and that very low price (270 MP!) is enabled by the M5 bundle: you can't spam them.
If you removed the M5, you'd have to raise their price, and then you'd just have yet another call-in CQC combat squad. There are already loads of better doctrines that do that. |
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I love this bundle. Dirt cheap Assault Guards (seriously, when you subtract the halftrack the value on that squad is insane) and a Meat Chopper way earlier than Soviet usually gets it.
If you want assault infantry as individual call-ins, there are loads of Soviet doctrines that do it already. There's really no need to homogenise the one doctrine that does things a bit differently. |
Could we add this Battlephase reshuffle to the poll?
https://www.coh2.org/topic/103763/ostheer-tech-restructure
It doesn't change nondoctrinal timings, but lets you put the Puma and StuG/e between T2 and T3 where it belongs. |
I think we should wait and see until after the aim time correction before talking about buffing or reworking the Stuart. You have to remember the Stuart actually has very decent scatter stats, and good per-shot damage. Maybe all it needs is to not have an aim time 12x longer than every one of its opponents.
I posted in another thread the Greyhound also has this issue, and I should note that it is very strange to me nobody talks about the Greyhound when IMO the unit is even worse then the Stuart with absolutely pathetic anti-vehicle capability after the last nerf, and anti-infantry ability mostly through it's canister ability, which is probably the crutch of the unit.
The Greyhound, when you stick the pintle on it, is a USF Luchs. It's really good at AI.
The Stuart is lackluster at both. |
The Puma is super squishy you got to take that into account.
Against anything with more than 80 penetration, the Stuart is equally squishy. |
I don't hate it. Just because it's the most challenging doesn't mean I hate it.
You don't seem to be familiar with how the matchmaker works. |
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