Thread: IR Ht3 Aug 2019, 17:50 PM
the unit is barely used, even in team games i don't see it that often. Price is cheap but its just not worth the pop cap it seems. |
It also did 240 dmg back then, and could 3 shot medium tanks which it had no trouble penetrating
That's also not the reason for the moving acc multiplier. A) a the various Shermans have it too, it's a USF thing not the Jackson.
B) heavy tanks have massive target sizes so they're hard to miss, the moving accuracy had little to do with that
what are u on about, your purposely missing the point. Even if Jackson had no trouble missing heavies its all pointless if they couldn't pen it from the front, which is why they had 0.75 acc to encourage flanking however, against decent players this was difficult to rely on. Yes, all usf vehicles had 0.75 acc because back then all axis heavies had much better armour and usf tanks couldn't reliably pen from the front whilse axis could do at ease, so they had to flank. As soon as a panther, tiger or KT hit the field it was game over for usf.
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He didn't make an argument he made a statement of fact. Most vehicles go up in range increments of 10, the ones that don't are things like Tigers and Comets not TDs
Range is not the way to nerf the Jackson, there's a reason that change got reverted
Maybe .65 like panther, but i see no reason for going straight down to standard tank moving accuracy
Tanks are being standardised to have 0.5 moving accuracy, why should the Jackson be exempt from it? in the past it couldnt pen certain tanks reliability from the front thus they needed the move acc to flank heavy tanks but with the buffs in penetration and hp over the years, ther is no justification for it to have 0.75 acc on the move. |
Stay on topic lads
Do you have a specific suggestion? I think its current performance is needed for US to compete late-game. Just not expensive enough
The price cant have "nothing to do with it", that doesnt make any sense. If you think its overperforming, then its too strong for its cost...
Moving acc from 0.75 to 0.50 for now. Out of all the factions, if any changes is going to be made for jackson they need to modify the way they did with JLI because of how reliant USF is on the Jackson, so small adjustments at a time. |
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10-15 fuel increase is barely a deserving nerf, the Jackson is blatantly OP and has nothing to do with the price, its the performance which needs to be looked at |
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whether you retreat ur blob or a single squad, with a FRP you can get ur units back into the field faster, regardless dont know what katifof is crying about. Both Ostheer and soviets deserve FRP, its not going to break balance so i don't see the problem.
In team games on large maps, factions with FRP have a massive advantage, and in 1v1's it wont really make any difference so i don't see why they don't implement these changes for ostheer and soviets |
if you are fighting a opponent with skill usually its the first volley of AT that hits before the tank pulls away so that makes the high burst damage of the Pshreck alot more useful especially against weaker allied armor. Also I think its quite nonsensical to say that 2 zooks on riflemen or rears is anywhere near the same level as Pfusiliers with 2 shreck. As the shreck has more damage and pen. Also you could easily get units like Obers to cover all you AI needs while 1 or 2 squads of Pfusiliers beat away all allied mediums. meanwhile as the USF you are limited to only rifles if you didnt pick an elite inf commander
Thats if the shrek hits and after the damage its was a longer reload giving you time to react. Also they haven't got snares allowing you to escape easily and would allow ur meds to do crushing since thers no snares. Point i'm trying to make is both units have pro's and con's and which is better is situational. |
I'm pretty sure that is just a bug, and one that I thought was already patched out.
TBH I'd be fine with them having all they have right now, except for them getting double shreks for 280mp/100mun. A single Pfusilier squad with double shreks means the end of allied light vehicle play, as two shreks will do 240 damage a volley, enough to instantly kill all of the lighter vehicles. Light tanks, the SU-76M and the AEC, assuming no other damage, would survive at or just under half health, and the halftracks and upgraded m20 would have only a sliver of health remaining.
This high damage combined with great penetration stats make them a credible threat into the lategame, unlike the generally equally priced bazookas, PIATs, etc.
To clarify, a single Panzerfusilier squad with double shreks is more potent than a Raketenwerfer in every manner but range and max range accuracy. (160 damage vs 240 damage).
Further comparison:
Double shreks (240 damage) (pen 160,170,180)
Double elite bazookas (200 damage) (pen 140,150,160)
Double normal bazookas (160 damage) (pen 110,120,130)
Double PIAT (200 damage) (pen 110,116,130)
Double PTRS-41 (80 damage) (pen 70,85,100)
This may be acceptable with the panzergrenadiers since their cost generally prohibits their use as AT infantry (although this is not to say that they cannot be extremely effective in this role...), but with Panzerfusiliers it's a no-brainer. Generally speaking it would be preferable if Panzershrek upgrades were all dropped down to 1 shrek / 60mun or something of that nature. They're the best handheld AT in the game, and might as well cost like it.
if Pfussies could get 1 shrek, people will just blob them as they would become AI +AT, but with double shrek, ther AI is a very bad. Your AT comparison takes no account of rate of fire and accuracy. Finally, according to you double PZshrek on pfussie is OP because it comes on a 280mp unit while u say its balanced on a 340mp unit. But its okay when a 200mp unit like rear echelon can equip zooks and become an AT squad or even a RM squad at 280mp can not only become an AT squad but also has a snare. |
Protip:
This graph does literally nothing for your argument, because it doesn't show what you're trying to say.
yes you are right my bad, but people here are acting like USF is a terrible faction, whilst its the opposite way round. They are the only faction to receive straight buffs in the last patches, whilst every other faction that got buffs also received corresponding nerfs |
Actually the price of units isn't the root issue but timing for the first officer.
Whenever you decide to go 2xRM or 3xRM, the building time of the first officer is too long. USF is actually always outnumbered until it hits the field.
I don't know if the problem is on USF build or simply powercreep made through the last patches (from which USF has been excluded) but yes the sensation of expensive units is mostly due to being so much on the backfoot early game vs OKW since long and now vs Ostheer with their new BO.
Another parameter vs Ostheer is also how easy it is now for Ostheer to skip tier and get get their Ostwind or Pz4 faster than you can have the proper counter.
And about the powercreep, something I've noted especially on USF vs OKW match-up is how impossible it is for USF to win the attrition war vs OKW. The match has to be really unbalanced on USF favor to beginning to see it otherwise there is effectively the feeling that your opponent always has the manpower available to replace, rebuild and get more unit than you do.
your over exaggerating OKW performance vs USF, if what you say is true and it is impossible for USF, then OKW would be dominating USF in 1v1 which they dont, USF has the highest win rate
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