I suppose the difference is you're looking at the 221 and 223 as two separate units.
I see them like Obersoldaten: they in effect cost 340 MP 90ish MU, but you only have to pay the manpower to build them.
The Obersoldaten unit without its MG34 is hardly worth 340 MP, let alone the old 400, but it's still useful. Once you've paid the rest of the cost for its MG34, it leaps up to full effectiveness. It's the same with Rangers: naked Rangers just aren't anything to write home about.
You don't build a 221 to keep as a 221: you build it to provide some helpful fire support before it turns into a 223.
You could easily have the 223 as a 300 MP 30 FU unit you can only build after upgrading an HQ, and it would end the 221 complaining. But it'd be an effective nerf to the unit.
221 is UP
223 is not more cost efficient than opel blitz, it is a tougher and it can fight back but for far less cost efficient for an "economy" units when it has a cost fuel of 30 fuel and 4 pop.
And this bring back to my point. 221 should be balanced as a counter to cars and sniper and if that interferes with 223 balance, they should simply be different units. |
Reducing shock value of these vehicles to zero?
Ost already has faust from the very start of the game specifically to keep early lights at bay and same with OKW and puppchen(like it or not, that's intended counter, I had used and had used against meeffectively puppchen as 3rd or 4th unit to counter M3).
You want to counter them, wait for 222.
Why some units should be completely irrelevant from the get go?
Why would you NOT want to rush 221 as ost in every single game, when allies have absolutely nothing to fend off or even deter from pushing non support light?
Why ost and OKW should have a vehicle that can effectively dive in and chase without any fear of AT or snare?
Are you up for giving all 3 allied factions T0 tech and vet free way to field AT or AT nades from minute zero, so the counterplay to that 221 of yours exists?
Having soft counter does not make these unit lose their shock value, and there is also the timing factor. 221 should come after these car.
Try to see at times something beyond "axis unit up, allied unit op" please.
Pls stop the personal comments.
In addiotn Pls stop projecting the problem you face on others. You are the one that is clearly allied biased and claim everything allied up and everything axis is op.
221 clearly under performs for cost no matter how much spin you want to put on it. |
|
221 should be in the game and it should actually be also available for Ostheer.
It should server as a counter to allied cars like the m3, UC, WC51 and a counter to snipers.
The 222 and 223 should be timed balanced and designed separately and if them being an upgrade to the 221 is an issues, they could/should become separate vehicles and not upgrades.
Currently the 221 is simply overpriced. |
But without the technology building (I thought this should be T1 not T2), why would I need a sapper squad? UKF have no access to mortar pit or AEC without T1.
Mines, AT grenades, smoke grenades, Forward assembly, piat carriers, repairs to UC. |
...
You seem determined to continue spamming your opinion about how broken JLI and repeating the same suggestions without actually reading and understanding what other say, I actually have better thing to do, so you can continue on your own if you want.
Merry Christmas and happy new year.
BB |
At this point you simple make no sense.
No one said that JLI should be buffed and I clearly said that they should be nerfed and their spam ability fixed.
What I have said is that your analysis and suggestions are wrong.
JLI should not replace mainline infantry or Obers.
What one actually can do is lower their DPS at close range giving them a distinctive disadvantage at certain range. Combined with counter spam changes (CP, cool-down) the units will be in much better place. |
only because you refuse to listen
Actually you refuse to listen and you keep repeating the mantra.
|
...
Once more repeating the same mantra again and again is not helpful. This is not yoga.
At CP 2 and 340 manpower an AI unit with no AT will still be obsolete.
And once more the unit needs to bring something to the table while not being spam-able.
It should not replace VG or obers but it should work with them. You comparison/analysis are flawed and so are you suggestions.
|
...
again your comparisons and suggestion are simply wrong.
Even at at CP 2 as 340 MP /45 munition unit JLI would become obsolete.
The unit should be useful but not spam-able. |
snipers are 360mp 1 man squads with 1 ability and arent useless... jagers are 4 man sniper teams with 4 abilities...
A CP 6 costing 340 and having no AT at all is useless.
i just tested it... the new jagers + G43 beat obers without MG34s while only losing one man... your argument is redundant
340 + free G43 upgrade is not only logical but necessary
jager G43 vs obers no upgrade engagement
20m cover vs cover
battle 1
jager lost 1 man all obers dead
battle 2
jager lost 1 man all obers dead
battle 3
jager lost 1 man all obers dead
@addvaluejack please make a video of this with these parameters
engagement at 2 conscript sandbags length obersoldaten and jager both fighting behind cover give jager a G43 and let obers stay stock... you will find that the engagement vs obers will be lopsided in favour of the jagers
Can you pls stop repeatedly comparing Ober and JLI, they are not meant to replace Obers and the units serve different roles.
Your argument hold little water, if assault engineer can beat them at point blank would that mean they should cost less then assault engineers?
The JLI spam needs to fixed but your suggestion are simply wrong.
|
Relic Entertainment
cblanco ★ 
Heartless Jäger 
