I think it is time to give this unit a add second look and make it interesting. Maybe some support abilities that don't promote blobbing. I would like it to be added to other docs too.
First some factz
1. Come at the same time as M20. 10 more fuel 40 less manpower.
2. Loses quite badly to 2 pgren squads in CQB (tested in cheat mode just now) By comparison m20 with no skirts does much better, but still loses. With skirts wins with 1/4 hp left
3. Same armor as vanilla m20, 80 more hp, Same damage at long range, about half at close
The first thing I would change is the med drop. Let it drop 1 medkit like OKW scoutcar for 15 munis rather than 3 for 45. This will make it more accessible if you plan on getting an ambulance shortly after.
The next thing I would do is rush it in game and see what happens. Will report back on this tomorrow if I remember to try it
Edit: tried in 4v4, 2 squads inside were good flankers but if they were more prepared probably a waste, only worth it as a surprise assault vehicle with like thompson cav rifles in it tbh. Mabye ill try 1v1 tomorrow
Upon further review, it seems the M5 is better in literally every single way for about 40 more manpower(armor, dps within 35 range, upgrade to quad avaiable), it just comes a little later.
The Kuble does enough damage for a 210mp speed racer. When it catches units in the open it's more than deadly enough to inflict bleed without ever coming close to death itself. Matter of fact in an open area with no cover it will wipe all allied t0 units without dying to something like a 90% margin.
Its a harassment vehicle, not the volks of lights designed to do everything well for as cheap as possible
I think the Kubel Struggles because it does not scale like the UC does. For only 50 MP more you have 2 upgrades that offer damage as well as Utility.
A vanilla UC, WC51, Kubel are all pretty bad, but the WC51 and UC can scale with a munitions investment.
Add some kind of munitions upgrade and you would have a kubel that could be useful past minute 3 when you can have a 221 on the field
I mean, that's certainly possible, but what would stop Ostheer from going right back into the Puma meta and call them in every single match? I personally agree that it was the techless AI tank follow up that was a bigger problem than the Puma, but reverting the Puma changes now would still risk seeing MobiDef almost every game again because it was simply Ostheer's most effective way of dealing with Allied lights. And seeing the same doctrine over and over wasn't fun at all. The Puma was Ostheer's Command Panther and everyone was sick of it too back then.
Ostheer mobile defense is currently an underutilized doctrine. It was previously very popular as the "Puma Panic button" Doctrine until that unit was adjusted. A commander should be bigger than 1 unit.
It suffers distinctly from the Capping ability and osttruppen callin being quite weak. With The command tank being nerfed this patch i think that may be the final nail in the coffin unless changes are enacted. Feel free to provide feedback or your own ideas irregardless of whether you read mine
1. Fast Capping -> Mobile Defense Tactics (AKA ostheer combined arms)
2. Ostruppen reserves -> Sdfz. Pgren 250 callin
3.Puma -> Buildable from HQ w/ T2 OR BP2
4. Command tank-> Currently up for adjustment in the SPB. How do we make this unit competitive with the new ostwind +brummbar when it requires tech?
5. Panzer tactition- Necessary with Puma, whole thread discussing it please provide feedback there.
I cant complain about any of these changes but i have 2 suggestions:
Why not give the 251 a heal upgrade which makes it a ambulance instead of only healing squads garrisoned inside the halftrack?
Second, and i think a necessary change would be to make the ostheer puma in mobile def a call in again now that the command p4 is tied to tech. Otherwise the Commander will be utterly useless and nerfed out of existence. It also would offer a solid counter play to Greyhounds and the Valentine, which both are still call ins. With the all the nerfs this commander had received over the years and now the final command p4 change, this would allow the commander to stay relevant.
It used to over perform cause of the fluent transition from very good mobile at to a solid medium tank, which both were call ins back in the day. I dont think it will be OP again when only one of these vehicles is a call in, as we can see in the current meta.
I think the Half track Idea would be cool, Currently ostheer doesn't have comparable and It would make the 251 a much more attractive option considering it costs ~400(350?) mp 45 fuel to field one you rush it, justifies having a bigger impact w/o flamer. At least in teamgames it would be fair to have something comparable to usf ambulance and as long as no forward retreat point + rewards good play/soft retreating.
For mobile defense I think that call in pumas would still relegate the commander to a puma panic button. Both the Ostruppen callin and the fast capping ability add nothing to the doctrine and quite frankly don't feel like "mobile defense", I would recommend these are changed to something like a 250 halftrack callin and something to the effect of "Ostheer combined arms" Like the pgren sprint buff or USF combined arms.
For puma callin I think giving it a buildtime is fair so it doesn't totally derail a light vehicle rush instantly after you pick the commander, but as you stated that is compared to other units still callin. Making the Puma buildable from HQ after t2 OR bp2 are up could help diversify strats a bit more while still requiring build time.
What if we gave the KV-1 a smokeshell like the cromwell at vet 1 instead? Soviets do not have that many smoke dispensers. I think it would be good utility and even help with destroying flakbases.
That would be pretty fun. Counterattack, Conscript support, Guard rifle, are all about combined arms tactics and the smokeshell could do a lot to support that.
And KV-1 still a bad Churchill, just more useful now as opposed to being pointless waste of resources.
From what I saw in balance mod the Kv1's MG buffs make it a good deal better than the Churchill vs infantry, especially with the grenade to vet1 nerf. (though throwing it into hull down -15% reload may have affected that)
I think a realistic situation with the KV1 might be 1 KV1 and 1 OKW P4 and a raketen. I don't think the P4 and raketen have any chance of dislodging a Kv1 in hull down as is, that will lead to quite a few headaches and ultimately too much investment in AT from the Axis player to justify a vet 1 ability.
1. Hull down must be very strong, as you sacrifice moving or it will never be used, though in fairness this one only takes 5 seconds to activate.
2. -15% reload and 20% damage reduction is an enormous vet1 bonus, Compare to radio net -10% reload. +5 sight, or stuart +25% sight, volk 10% RA ect. Of course it does have to be strong, it's immobile.
I suggest making a passive ability such as -10% reload and +5 sight in friendly territory, not going fo this hull down ability. This is simply because the tank already has damage resistance, If it were another tank this ability might be great, but the KV1 is already a good damage sponge, allow vet1 to give some utility instead. I think friendly territory passive is something we don't really have and might be a neat new addition, whatever the stats or numbers if hull down is too hard to balance (mostly b/c we only get so many tries to go live with the quarterly patches)
I do think making hull down function like this with perhaps reduced bonuses could make it good on ostheer tanks and less of a meme if the #'s get balanced.
Been testing out the IS-2. Fragmentation does nothing to garrison units, not sure if intended.
More importantly, Im abit worried that the changes will push the kv2 back into obscurity. While the kv2 has massive aeo, the new is-2 does enough damage allowing the mg to pick infantry off like flies which is a problem because the kv2 is really only good against infantry.
The kv2 only real advantage is range (as it improves with vet 2).
IS2 vet is similar to the Kv-2 but it seems to be better overall. I don't really feel the tanks perform equally at the moment especially considering the fuel cost is equal. You see Is2 all the time and the Kv2 is not nearly as popular.
KV2 Vet 2
+50% weapon rotation speed, +25% direct fire range, +14.3% indirect fire
Partysan Boobytraps-
15 munis, 15 second plant time, ~5 second stun time
They seem okay, but to use the ~5 second stun (with minor damage) you need to spend the time planting the trap and then waiting to ambush someone. It seems easier to just plant a mine, which would work just as well to suppress someone and you don't NEED to wait and combo with it. Cheaper than a mine though. It has potential though for sure since it's more of a cool ambush tactic rather than just blowing up a squad with a normal boobytrap.
The ambush bonus also seems interesting combo with it, but if you want to advance during that 5 seconds of stun less so.
Does anybody else have thoughts on the boobytraps/partisans?
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