AVRE reloads faster, way better acceleration/deceleration, more armor, more health, faster rotation rate, reloads automatically and on the move and isn't vulnerable while reloading...
All these things are tradeoffs when comparing it with the sturmtiger. Both are excellent. Sturm tiger is more lethal while the avre has better SURVIVABILITY and mobility.
what good is that when it does shit dmg and the aoe is small so you have to be pretty precise you would have to be brain dead to get hit by an avre shell. especially a vehicle. yeah it can rotate but they can see the turrent moving? which just warns them ok its turning to fire this way.. move..? i guess it can hit okw trucks? but that would take 3 shells with them not repairing or defending it? The trade offs are terrible and nobody is going to reload the sturm until it is behind enemy lines? Its not even good at hitting fn at guns really other than big pak others can just move or retreat before it fires most the time. |
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They should never of received incendiary nades to begin with when they can have shreks. Makes them too versatile and promotes blobbing. Okw fans themselves asked for them on sturms not volks. There vet needs looked at on all there units with relic "overhauling" okw and buffing volks a couple patches in a row before fixing the vet. |
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I cannot remmeber how many axis tears ranting on the forum avre first came out. It could almost one shot panthers and half hp heavies!!!! Not fair even though it couldnt even do it out of fog of war. So they nerf it into the useless piece of shit it is today but some how it is perfectly fine for the sturmtiger to be able to almost one shot 3 comets it can one shot them as well on a direct hit (might as well be one shotted because they even get crew shocked on top of it! Leaving them easy shrek clean up or panther one hit left and shocked). Can fire from fog of war. This is fine though i am sure i see almost every other game now.
"Working as intended"
A bunch of fn bullshit sturmtigers Aoe is Way too huge and does wayyyy too much dmg especially if it crew shocks after wards and fire from fog of war
Avre piece of shit takes longer to fire small aoe does shit dmg, cant fire from fog of war. Useless.
Something needs to change to one or both. |
Really bad patch. No proper balance changes, no attempts to change meta, and the worst of all the pathfinding reverse thingy is still there. The whole community is against it, so why keep it?
AGREED REVERT PATHING BACK TO HOW IT WAS!!! they only want to drive in reverse |
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Well your right but anyways agreed AEC needs moved back in timing as well as the luchs just a tad and if relic could figure out how to make a p3 and make it come out in suitable timing great. If they move the AEC back in timing though do you think ost really will need the p3 considering they have the best support weapons as mentioned before every faction kind of has there holes?
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I would like to start by saying yes, i am a known usf fanboy. No, this thread isnt troll.
Ostheer and brits are my favorite factions after usf, i love these two because of theyre AMAZING combined arms design, their abilities and units, etc.
But thats not the point. I would like to bring up the question as to why ostheer cant be more like brits.
Not with more emplacements, dont get it twisted.
but with other things.
Ostheer and brits play very similarly, obviously not including emplacements, but there are key aspects missing in ostheers favor:
- Light vehicles
The brits have the AEC, why can't ostheer have a panzer 3 that can self spot for all these suppport weapons and give recon or something? Why cant the 222's 20mm cannon at least scare an AEC or stuart away? Why does the 222 lose to a 3 man half health rifle squad with one AT nade? Does a luchs lose to one conscript? Does a stuart lose to one grenadier? Does the AEC lose to one volksgrenadier? Why is 222 getting rekt like this? 
Is the Panzer III model is bugged or something and thats why It hasnt been released? Can the puma come at 3CP? DO SOMETHING ABOUT THEIR VEHICLES, i think I heard ostheer's heart rate slowing as i type this.
good lord, ostheer fails like boiled shit when light vehicles roll out and alot of it is because theyure just missing a counter play vehicle. Grens are fine, mg42 is fine, sniper is fine, mortar is fine, the paks great, the 250 is awesome, and the 222 gives great sight and utility.
but holy shit, I cant use any of this when I have to worry about that ugly ass AEC/m20/stuart coming in and ruining it all in one go. This wasnt a problem when the stuart had 320 hp, or when the aEC was a piece of shiet. Do something about it. I can hear ostheers breath getting softer and softer. Listen to me relic.
and Inb4 some nerd comes in here and tells me to plant a teller. Guess what, nerd, if I plant a teller and hes not an idjit, and he's top 50 and buys sweepers, then what? What if I finish the teller and an AEC comes flying out of nowhere and shoots my pioneers on top of the teller a second after I place it? Stfu. Mines dont counter shit.
- Unit and commander abilities
The cromwell seems really strong vs ostheer armor, everything. I think because of the commander upgrade ability which allows you to literally attack move any target and get the first shot in because of the extended sight. If the Germans were known for their amazing tank commanders and coordination, why dont they have a tank commander upgrade that does a similar thing too? This would be a huge buff to the P4 vs sherman/cromwell matchup. The sherman has the penetration advantage and the cromwell has the first AND more accurate shot(s). So let the P4 have something. Right now its a piece of shit and a joke. And its really funny when it fights against comets and stuff, its like a T34-76 fighting an Abrams tank.
the panther, why the fuck does the comet raep infantry the way it does, from 50 range and with phosphorus (AND THE COMMANDER UPGRADE  ?) Meanwhile, the panther is basically ignored by infantry? give it some anti infantry ability please, this isnt 2013 anymore. The allies have stuff to kill panthers now.
The panther is literally not shit now and its sad. It was funny at brit release but now its just said. Buff the panther.
The tiger, reduce its range back to 40. that was a dumb idea. Just make it slow, give it actual armor, take blitzkrieg away and replace with KT spearhead abilty.(btw still not an OKW thread but fix that fucking ability on the KT its still worse than the main attack for some reason)
My other gripe and final gripe, Brits get artilery cover+forward HQ anti infantry strafe+a recon ability(try it if you have the munitions), ok fine, why is sector artillery or stuka loiterSO SHIT in comparison? (this thread still isnt about OKW, but buff zeroing artillery too)
I love these stalemate back-breaker abilities, they create awesome visuals and moments late game and, well break stalemates...but lets make them all equal, or nerf them all. whatever, but do something about it.
Right now, ostheer is truly on life support(the panzerwerfer) and I think theyre about to die. So can we please do something and help ostheer out. I cant play them, and no one else will play them. And its a shame because I like them alot, theyre design is great, and so is there concept overall. Fix the power creep and buff them to be like brits please.
endrant and thx
Dude cookie your one of my favorite posters and I highly respect you but
I don't know how often you use the comet (i do ALL the time multiples of them) but it does not rape infantry. It has a lucky shot every now and then but it is inaccurate as fuck on the move and even standing still it feels buggy and for as much as it cost it should do some AI dmg with it's shot. I mean I know KT and ost T cost more but they are god damn AI wipe machines with huge at power. Comet has crap pen vs a panther and does not do a good job flanking cause it misses on the move like 60 or 70% of the time. As for the white phosphorous it is bugged and dosen't work right most of the time and has led me to losing comets before, also I use it to blind AT guns and as I said blind because thats all it really seems to do it never wipes them and hardly does any dmg never decrews them.
Sector arty well timed can be really effective and way better than brits hq arty that stuff is shit and misses 80% of the time to hit any thing other than maybe a okw truck but its not going to do much dmg.
The panther is not crap it is probably the most rounded AT tank in the game. It has the best frontal armor. I mean honestly how many videos should I post of how many times that thing has been able to defy death when if it was any allied tank no contest would of been dead with superior axis all around AT in general. Like i mean the piat that always misses made the panther shit now or the comet that can't hardly pen its front armor?
MG42 best mg in the game. Ost mortar best basic mortar in the game. Pak best basic at gun in the game. You play USF a lot also my favorite faction and if i can decrew it or ost mortar or at gun I ALWAYS steal it because its the best mg in the game and the best regular mortar/at gun in the game. Just the other day in 2v2 I stole one of there 42's (only had 3 crew members) put it in a house on there fuel in road to kharkov. It must of took them like 10 minutes to counter it because it pins faster than any other mg and unlike any other mg it will pen 5 squads in the arc at once as well as it turns on a dime in buildings it seems. especially vetted AND has super bullets that rape infantry and light vehicles.
I agree AEC timing needs moved back now that it was buffed. I guess thats why your comparing the 222 a super light vehicles like the m20 to a medium light vehicle like the luchs ( which i think still comes out a bit early) or the stuart or t70. However a new addition to give them a medium light might be alright.
I am not going to pretend to that I play ost but against good players I find them a highly effective faction. Maybe the p4 needs a bit of a buff but most of the time i just find that eventually they always over commit there panther or tiger the toughest opponets never do that. I find that both axis factions do best on camping VPs in order to win and force allies into a bad position to run there gauntlet and allies are mostly intense micro and if they let you build to critical mass (especially usf) you find the right time to strike and break there back but then you hit mines and pak walls which can turn that upside down on you. |
Keep the FRP, just make any side that has a FRP, they have to arm their squads from the main base.
It's BS OKW can have an FRP with med, and instantaneously get arms in the field, while USF has to go all the way back. OKW can and does just apply constant pressure with the blob since they can arm anywhere and quickly get back to the fight.
+1
In other thoughts because of soviet and ost early access to mgs and mortars I feel like they don't need the FRP as much as they have tools to hold the line. Also USF really has to wait until major is unlocked anyway to have a actual retreat something I have always though gives okw the benefit on constant pressure because theirs comes so much earlier than others as well as not having to go back to base. UKF possibly can get theirs at the same time and can equip weapons at it but because of the way they are designed I feel its almost impossible to blob with them and they just do not having the offensive push.
either way I feel like the FRP's can be used against the enemy as much as they can be use full with a well timed call in or rocket arty, however the way the rocket arty is now it can really punish soviet and ost for going heavy support weapon builds.
I don't know most the time with USF I feel I have no options late game but to blob because that is what the enemy is going to do and 1 rifle squad simply does not beat 2 volk squads or 1 gren squad with lmg imo or what have you and the .50 cal comes out too late as well as USF has no mortar to counter indirect fire so .50cal is not going to be around very long with incediary grenades and rifle nades on top of that why build it when I can just build another rifle squad that will probably last most the game.
Moral of the story I don't think FRP is the issue, I think its shreks on volks (take shreks away implement the 4 man tank buster squad that will have bad AI) and give USF a different starting option (non-doct mortar where .50cal is now and move .50cal to tier 0 or vice versa. |
Calli is clearly OP. But, what's wrong with pzwerfer ?
LMAO how is the calli op but not the werfer?? what a joke the cali dosent instantly fire all its missles at once and does no GUARANTEE a wipe the werfer pretty much GAURANTEES a wipe its the hardest of all of them to hear and the time it takes for its barrage to land is the shortest |
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I think if you give okw faust then you need to give brits an AT disable (the sniper one isn't that viable).
I would really rather not see this though for either one it would make vehicle play kind of annoying especially for allies with there lighter armor designed for flanking. Panthers are still relatively fast when crited and have great armor to survive and tigers and kt's the HP to survive.
Unless you can smoke your tank and emergency repair with usf anything crited is most likely dead and the same with any other allies armor other than maybe the IS2 with its armor or the church that can soak some of the dmg although its slow as f*** crited. But then again it is all the shrek blobs that = death for crited allied armor. |
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Rifles need duel wield to be effective late game, they wouldn't stand a chance against vet 5 volks and lmg grens blobs without them.
You want to stop volk blobs and rifle blobs? easy take shreks away from volks and make shrek squads a 4 man dedicated AT squad with crap AI and fix the gib dmg shreks do to infantry. Give volks an AI upgrade to be on par with rifles and equivalent infantry, the dmg and vet would probably need to be adjusted to not over power them. (what Johnnyb suggested and others that I rarely agree with)
Give USF .50cal at tier 0 and replace .50cal under lieut with a mortar. So USF have a different opening other than rifles. |
United States
Relic Entertainment
