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Thread: USF Mortar Halftrack & M1 Pack Howitzer Need Nerf14 Jun 2019, 07:02 AM Jump back to quoted post13 Jun 2019, 23:17 PMelchino7 What about the following changes. -Swap the Scott with the Pack Howitzer. Rework both units. Pack: -Loses it's auto attack, but improves it's barrage mode converting itself in a mini mobile Howitzer. This will give USF it's late game artillery unit. -Depending how good it is the barrage, increase mp cost and/or give it a fuel cost. Scott: -Reduce AA range from 60 to 40. -Reduce lethal AoE on AA. -Reduce penetration on barrage to match it's AA. -Remove concealing smoke at vet 1. -Swap barrage recharge from vet2 to vet 1. -Give it delayed fused charges/white phosphorous at vet2 (you could then rework either ability for the MHT as well) And why would you build it for then? That's a 100% nerf for USF faction. You believe that the 120 fuel to tech major are compensating all of that and what you're not mentioning? -Forced to tech T2 to get it. -Forced to spend 70 fuel early on to get what you had for only 340 mp before -Rending PakHowi almost useless unless you make it a sort of clone of Lefh/Ml20 (which are doctrinal. can't wait for the 10x shitposts about how it is OP USF has a stock arty if your idea is released) Not to mention that you're only at 5 range from gren pfaut, less with the appropriate bulletin and in range of pak40. And probably more. I mean, what is it not understandable with the fact that the scott is as deadly as the pzwerfer or stuka are? Why aren't the people complaining about the Scott not complaining when they see a squad or more than one being vaporized in one go from one of those units? because in game that the exact same shit but with different flavors. Scott is more like a long term bleeder will Pzwefer and Stuka or Katy are one shot hard smashers. But if people want to see the scott removed from USF T3, here is the best option: swap it with the Calliope. Make the Calliope a clone of Katy and let's see how people are getting happy with that. And then we do the same with the Brumbar... Oh wait Ostheer already have a Scott on steroid AND pwerfer on the same tier and no one is complaing!!!! In: COH2 Balance
Thread: M36 Jackson11 Jun 2019, 17:27 PM Jump back to quoted post11 Jun 2019, 16:42 PMdistrofio But why then fireflies and SU85 do have a specific weakness than? What if jacksons had a weakness and it was gone? M36 use to cost a lot less and still have paper armor and big target size, those are the weaknesses. Now if by weakness you mean being super RNG dependent, yeah this one has been removed. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: M36 Jackson8 Jun 2019, 11:13 AM Jump back to quoted post8 Jun 2019, 10:46 AMVipper Glide shot is technique used to avoid moving penalty, it result in slower moving speed and increases micro. It is not "bad or crippling" else people would not used it. Do you have a similar technique to increase Pen shot for the Sherman? No you don't. So I don't know what you're talking about here, there is a technique usable by the vast majority of players for all factions that strongly reduce the penalty of moving accuracy. It is not like Sherman had 100% moving accuracy so you also need to stop before firing with a sherman cuz 65% is not 100%. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: M36 Jackson8 Jun 2019, 09:42 AM Jump back to quoted post8 Jun 2019, 09:31 AMAarotron Do people also realize that panthers are not meant to sit at max range of jackson and try to snipe it? Its meant to dive close with its superior health pool, which can be equally frustrating for allied player when 860 hp tank rushes your tank and you cant make enpugh meaningful damage to scare it away. Its way its designed to work and there are tools to counter that as well. In fact sitting at max range, Panther wins completely vs Jackson in a vacuum unless strong RNG deviance happened. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: M36 Jackson8 Jun 2019, 09:22 AM Jump back to quoted post8 Jun 2019, 00:42 AMthedarkarmadillo Its not terribly unreasonavlble either given the price points. Thebost p4 is slightly more expensive and also has a slight edge in tank combat. That said all the other allied mediums have advantages that manage to balance that out with a slight micro requirement. Sherman has its great moving modifier, cromwell is zippy as fuck, T34 is cheap.... Its not like the p4 wins by a huge margin. It's got an edge and that can be overcome by a better allied player. Seems reasonable. Who said its terrible? Who said Sherman should be cheaper and better than Pz4? Pz4 is better than Sherman in AT and Moving Accuracy Argument is a noob trap for noob players, past a certain level of experience players know to stop their tank before firing, a non-moving Pz4 has better accuracy than a moving sherman. And again, I'm not saying that the current situation is bad, I'm just stating what's the current situation. Now some people want the Jackson to be nerfed and from this there 3 possible outcomes: 1- useless nerf to make happy some players, like increasing 10 fuel or 50 manpower. It is not going to change anything. 2- Strong nerf and we can say again bye bye to USF for some time. 3- Intelligent redesign of USF late game options including some nerf and UP for different units so the faction is more viable and less frustrating to play against. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: M36 Jackson7 Jun 2019, 22:39 PM Jump back to quoted post7 Jun 2019, 20:42 PMStug life in order 160 180 160 150 So yes if we look at the Ostheer Pz4, unless you can reach close range with your sherman where you're still losing by a close margin but have a chance to win thanks to your superior moving accuracy, 80% of fights which are occurring at mid and long range are at your disadvantage. That's the problem and reason you rarely see more than one sherman on the field and much more Jacksons. And its become even worst vs OKW pz4. And don't get me wrong, I'm not calling for nerf or whatsoever, just stating a fact. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: M36 Jackson7 Jun 2019, 20:21 PM Jump back to quoted post7 Jun 2019, 18:13 PMelchino7 That's not the case. Sherman: 140-120-100 PIV: 125-115-110 Cromwell: 135-120-105 T34-76: 120-100-80 Things that could be touched on the Jackson: moving accuracy and cost. What about armor? In: COH2 Balance
Thread: M36 Jackson6 Jun 2019, 14:50 PM Jump back to quoted post6 Jun 2019, 13:01 PMLago Like what? The Jackson, by necessity, is a cost efficient nondoctrinal counter to every enemy vehicle. It beats both Panzer IVs unless they can get in close without being hit, in which case it's a fair fight. All things considered it's a fair fight against the more expensive Panther. The StuG can only attack frontally and has 50 range. A vetted Jackson three-shots it. And all those assume the Jackson has no support to fall back to. That only really leaves the JPIV. Maybe that's the answer? Leave the Jackson be and buff the range on the StuG? Even the SU-76 has 60 range. That way both OKW and OST have a unit that can trade efficiently with a Jackson at range, but both those units are casemates that can be circlestrafed and outmaneuvered up close? Like pzshreck and pak40 that always pen jacksons. (or almost) I mean it is not like USF had could fight so easily the panther with zooks and ATG without spending a shitone of munition in the balance. In my opinion, you'r taking the Jackson's design from the wrong side, Jackson isn't the cause but the consequence of Axis medium tanks powercreep. The jackson would be fine to be only good at countering panthers and KT/T/ST (and being more expensive) if the sherman was able to counter both Pz4. In my opinion there is a design flaw with USF and Axis faction. Both axis factions have access to medium tank destroyers to counter medium tanks but still both Pz4 are superior in duel with the Sherman. So nobody really build more than 1 sherman and exclusively for AI, then nobody build medium TD but only Pz4 and since USF only has the Jackson... well you end up only building Jacksons for your late game because sherman suck hard in AT even vs Pz4. My solution is that the food chain should be the contrary between the sherman and Pz4s first, then Medium TDs counter the sherman and then making Jacksons only good vs Panther and heavy tanks. So in conclusion you have Medium fight = Axis TD > Sherman > Both Pz4s Heavy fight = Panther/heavy tanks = Jacksons With the sherman superior to Pz4 and Jacksons only good vs Panther, the USF players would use much more their sherman and Axis their medium TDs. So less Jacksons and also less Panther on the field. Everyone is happy! In: COH2 Balance
Thread: M36 Jackson6 Jun 2019, 12:48 PM Jump back to quoted post6 Jun 2019, 12:33 PMLago Would you? If mediums or heavies countered the Jackson, then yes, but lights? USF has plenty of stuff to fight lights with. OKW and Ostheer also have plenty of stuff to counter Jacksons, even more stuff if we includes mines and medium TDs. So what? In: COH2 Balance
Thread: M36 Jackson6 Jun 2019, 11:59 AM Jump back to quoted post6 Jun 2019, 11:42 AMLago And on that note, what do you think about making the Jackson's armour awful? Would making Pumas and 222s a cost efficient counter open up any more strategies, or is that sort of light vehicle simply too brittle in teamgames? Then you'll just need to get 2 or 3 Luch/PUMA to completely shutdown USF entire late game. In: COH2 Balance