Stormtrooper changes

+1 I think we can agree taht this game's statistics are a daunting mess lol. It does make sense to some degree that weapons perform differently in the hands of different soldiers though (but not to the extent of volks stgs vs sturm stgs vs pgren stgs obviously).

Wow I didn't know that. That's interesting. It still seems very good on pathfinders though. Do they count as elite for the purposes of the gun? I might just be seeing the effects of the sniper crit and the superior m1 carbines though.

It's probably a combination of the critical + the LMG34 is the best LMG. However I'm not sure if they get the "elite" tag. If they can fire it on the move then they're "elite".

I think the Stormtrooper changes fit Close the Pocket rather well.

I guess they work for Elite Troops? But the stun nades, the flame nades, the smoke nades... And no honest grenade?

For the Elite troops commander these Stormtroopers just seem a little out of place, especially since panzergrenadiers can get G43s as well from the doctrine AND have bundled grenades which, quite frankly, is all I ever want out of an axis infantry squad. A real goddamn grenade.

I guess they work for Elite Troops? But the stun nades, the flame nades, the smoke nades... And no honest grenade?

I like the idea of the flame nade giving 'behind enemy lines'-utility doing extra damage to caches, but I wouldn't mind seeing infiltration grenades (sharing a cooldown with the smoke grenade) for Stormtroopers alongside these flame grenades. A pure infantry harassment squad needs direct damage explosives to offset their high cost, especially a 4-men squad that will lose 25% of its firepower just closing in.

Unit could simply become cheaper if its role is harassment and re balanced.

2 G43 + 2 k98 make sense as starting weapons. Weapon upgrades if they need any could include a number of combos.

Repost from the main thread:

I want to reurge that the new stormtroopers with instant ppsh-like mp40's are very strong when deployed from an ambient building. From the few matches that I tried against players, they could really turn around a fight, with allies needing atleast 2 squads to deal with them. You can't really fight them at range because of their cloak.

If this remains unchanged, they will be by far the most effective infiltration squad. From the comparisons that I made in cheatmode (8 fights against a conscript squad at point blank range):

- Stormtroopers squads lost 1/4 of their health on average.
- Partisans lost 2/3 of their health on average.
- 3-man commando infiltration squads lost 1/2 of their health on average.
- All JLI squads died with conscripts losing 2/3 of their health on average, (which is interesting, considering grens win around 50% of the time against conscripts).

I'd advise that they either need to upgrade their mp40's for ~30 munitions or deploy with 3 models out of 4, to bring them in line with other infiltration squads, (I prefer the second option).

The flame nade doesn’t kill a cache, even if the squad is shooting at the cache with it.

The flame nade doesn’t kill a cache, even if the squad is shooting at the cache with it.

I was of the opinion that the incendiary should destroy a cache on its own, while Mirage disagreed on this. Last I checked, he's currently leaning towards ~60% damage for it, while im leaning towards 80%. I think the cache should be cleaned up by an incendiary nade + ~7 seconds of small arms fire.

Since they're based off of Brandenburgers (which made extensive use of captured weaponry), why not allow them to upgrade to captured weaponry like a 1x DP-28 or 2x PPsH? I also echo the self-healing medpacks idea.

I love that idea, but think it’s more appropriate for Osttruppen to get DP-28s instead of MG42s.

PPShs for Stormtroopers sounds good though, if they give them two PPShs and two MP-40s.

Personally I’d like to see them start with four K98ks and free ambush camoflauge (regardless of whether the commander has i)t and upgrade to either a Support Package with an MG-34 LMG and tripwire flares, Assault Package with MP-40s and PPShs plus anti infantry mines or a Panzer-Jaeger package with dual Panzershrecks plus AT mines.


Make them expensive but versatile and powerful, much like Paratroopers.

I was of the opinion that the incendiary should destroy a cache on its own, while Mirage disagreed on this. Last I checked, he's currently leaning towards ~60% damage for it, while im leaning towards 80%. I think the cache should be cleaned up by an incendiary nade + ~7 seconds of small arms fire.

Why not give Stormtroopers a timed Demo charge like paratroopers iirc? More expensive, more setup, better reward. Less fantasy grenades

Why not give Stormtroopers a timed Demo charge like paratroopers iirc? More expensive, more setup, better reward. Less fantasy grenades

Well, my first choice was satchels because theyre a mix of demolitions and the grenade that some people want. Either way, incendiary grenades won out in the end, and they admittedly serve a distinct purpose. I suppose it could be done either way still, but people don't seem to be pushing for any single option (usually the issue with feedback isn't determining whether "people like this" or "people don't like this"; it's usually more along the lines of: "people like this" or "people don't like this, but they're all proposing different solutions and all want different things, so how do we go about this?").

Well if flame nades can 80% caches on their own we can probably just completely transition into admitting volks are the be all end all for omni potent infantry. Able to clear buildings, caches and deny cover, snare, cheap, self heal, build cover, upgrade to STGs that make them good on the move, great up close, better at range... Unless we are going to make it another variant with different properties but almost certainly the same name to trip up the few new players that may stumble into trying the game.

Unless we are going to make it another variant with different properties but almost certainly the same name to trip up the few new players that may stumble into trying the game.

They did exactly that. Check the patch notes. Volks flame nade is seperate.


I'm not very concerned with this because there's tons of weapons in the game already that have the same appearance but perform differently on different units (MP40, STG44, Bren, etc.). It's beyond fixing at this point. I consider looking up this kind of knowledge about mechanics as part of mastering the game.

Well if flame nades can 80% caches on their own we can probably just completely transition into admitting volks are the be all end all for omni potent infantry. Able to clear buildings, caches and deny cover, snare, cheap, self heal, build cover, upgrade to STGs that make them good on the move, great up close, better at range... Unless we are going to make it another variant with different properties but almost certainly the same name to trip up the few new players that may stumble into trying the game.

Except Stormtrooper flame nade only get the actual bonus to make it damage cache, and that says a lot about how much you played Opie Opie volks.

Also stick to the topic.

Wouldn't a PPSh-41 like curve (cons one) buffed better fit the Stormtroopers ? The one that basically reached peak damage at 10 ms distance ?

Just to make sure the unit doesn't have to kiss the enemy while keeping the smg/infiltration focus.

it was fine with MP40
but can we please add
passive sprint at vet 3 just like lieutenant or actived sprint ability for vet 1 or 2
that will do.. to balance this remove smoke grenade (because it no longer neccesary or if it become passive still can work)


"uhhh it overlap with Assgrens" yeah because in mechanized assault we have assgrens and stromtrooper in one package coz garden allied infantry in CQB

"but stromtrooper have RA modifier to it that would be OP" ranger (good RA) and shock trooper (who even have 1.5 of armor AND smoke grenade) with 5 and 6 man in a squad with good cqb weapon (but some "degenerate" who demand shock trooper to be reworked because they cant kill MG who supposedly counter this unit cry it out loud) they get sprint because they are 4 man squad it was a asymetrical balance for this unit, allied CQB unit have 5 to 6 man in their squad

"the manpower and the ninja skillz are make it O...." shhh i said it was ability for veterancy option not straight out from the batch.. and it was justified for 340 manpower same goes for shock trooper or ranger (albeit i agree in part toned down the manpower for shocks, disagree buffed up their effective range)

"but smoke and SPRINT make it O..." i SAID in the above Smoke grenade can be removed to balance the sprint but since the sprint was vetted so the smoke grenade still be a viable option to help stromtrooper vet or become support unit just like its role

Wouldn't a PPSh-41 like curve (cons one) buffed better fit the Stormtroopers ? The one that basically reached peak damage at 10 ms distance ?

Just to make sure the unit doesn't have to kiss the enemy while keeping the smg/infiltration focus.

So you want to nerf their current curve?
Because atm they are commandos like.

So you want to nerf their current curve?
Because atm they are commandos like.

Yep, i would rather nerf their curve after 10 ms but keep actual top dps all the way up to 10 ms.

At the moment they shred in cqb anything that isn't para, shocks or rangers with paid thompsons.

The unit itself is a low number inflitration/sabotage unit, so while smg makes sense, so does making the dps curve in a way that from 0 to 10 it can fully retain its dps, rather than assault the enemy like assgrens or rangers. Additionally it will put a soft cap to the dps power storm can deal from 10 to 15-20 ms.

...Guys....just look at the numbers miragefla provided. Their mp40s already do keep maximum damage out to 10 range...

Commandos also have their close range (max damage range) at 10.

Completely missed Miragefla post