Give me a reason why KV8 is OP?

Sorry I meant 4 v 4, my bad.

and now pls stop spamming back to topic

Apparently they have no plans to change KV8 or flame overall.

Something about "its supposed to be a 100% accuracy weapon".

Dunno. Not impressed by that bit.

I noticed I am no longer the only one who adds legendary Nullist quotes to their signature. Join me in my quest, this thread is gold!

I noticed I am no longer the only one who adds legendary Nullist quotes to their signature. Join me in my quest, this thread is gold!

He hasnt added any quote of mine to his sig.

I suppose you are right. Hopefully people will give voice to my request, because there is just too much material in this thread to fill one signature!!

Apparently they have no plans to change KV8 or flame overall.

Something about "its supposed to be a 100% accuracy weapon".

Dunno. Not impressed by that bit.

Like I said few hundred pages ago Devs designed KV8 to be high risk/high gain unit and designed commander in line with that.

I read that at official forums, devs explanation.

They were never gonna make it in line with what you were proposing, unless it was breaking game balance. Since they would have to redesign commander as well (CP, costs, balance, etc)

Annoying unit? very much so, but KV8 doesn't make commander OP

^ maybe they cant fix the insta killing squads with the kv8 (doubt it since fht does quarter the damage)

BUT why in God's name cant they INCREASE THE FREAKING cost of this vehicle. Brummbar is so much more expensive is and is half as useful.

KV8's cost should be similar to the brummbar.

^ maybe they cant fix the insta killing squads with the kv8 (doubt it since fht does quarter the damage)

BUT why in God's name cant they INCREASE THE FREAKING cost of this vehicle. Brummbar is so much more expensive is and is half as useful.

KV8's cost should be similar to the brummbar.

Because Brummbar comes into well rounded German default tier, having something as powerful as KV8 in German arsenal, would make it invincible. Soviet commanders are designed around call-in troops, much easier to balance commanders.

Imagine buffed up Brummbar that kills infantry at will, combined with double shreck PG's, vs conscripts, shock and SU85's.... You would have to redesign entire Soviet Army to balance game.......

Because Brummbar comes into well rounded German default tier, having something as powerful as KV8 in German arsenal, would make it invincible. Soviet commanders are designed around call-in troops, much easier to balance commanders.

Imagine buffed up Brummbar that kills infantry at will, combined with double shreck PG's, vs conscripts, shock and SU85's.... You would have to redesign entire Soviet Army to balance game.......

Um, I'm kind of skeptical of that argument to be honest. The Brummbar seems to have less anti-infantry power, less armour and less health than the KV-8, pretty similar speed, still costs *way* more and requires you to research and build the T4 building and wait for the unit to build as well, hence requiring a ton more investment in fuel, manpower and time.

I'd say a Brummbar is a much higher risk unit than the KV-8, requires better control to get much out of it, and is much less effective. A KV-8 in German tier 4 would probably be higher-risk unit than the KV-8 as a Soviet call-in, though it would also be just monstrously powerful.

The rest of the KV-8 doctrines aren't great, but they both A) need some rebalancing on their own terms (so, shocks, for instance are a bit cheaper now, IS-2 is much improved) and B) they aren't *that* bad, tbh. It just seems like the cost of the KV-8, for the armour, and the damage, and the health, and the call-in status, should be higher and should really promote having to try hard to get your investment back. Right now, trading one for a P-IV or Ostwind is fine, killing a few infantry squads then throwing it away is normally not too bad for your situation, baserushing and killing a few things then losing it stupidly is fine if it doesn't get abandoned, since it'll force off Ostheer map control.

Brummbar is underrated imo, great tank

Like I said few hundred pages ago Devs designed KV8 to be high risk/high gain unit and designed commander in line with that.

1) STUHs, Brumbars, Flame HTs, and Panzerfwerfers are examples of high risk reward units because they die very quickly. KV8 is not a high risk unit, it has a shit ton of health. The only "risk" is if you poorly invested those resources without properly covering the other bases.

2) The thread is about whether the KV8 is OP or not, not whether the devs intended for it to be the way it is because shockingly not all dev intentions are the best e.g. Brit faction and CoH2 building mechanics. If the only thing that mattered was Relic's intentions we should just go ahead and close the feedback forums and let them do all their own testing/QA.

Um, I'm kind of skeptical of that argument to be honest. The Brummbar seems to have less anti-infantry power, less armour and less health than the KV-8, pretty similar speed, still costs *way* more and requires you to research and build the T4 building and wait for the unit to build as well, hence requiring a ton more investment in fuel, manpower and time.

I'd say a Brummbar is a much higher risk unit than the KV-8, requires better control to get much out of it, and is much less effective. A KV-8 in German tier 4 would probably be higher-risk unit than the KV-8 as a Soviet call-in, though it would also be just monstrously powerful.
.

My point was going for KV8 as Soviet commander, leaves you highly vulnerable to Armor. You still need to tech up to SU85's and shocks and conscripts aren't much of alternative. (you just spent 135 fuel with no real AT capabilities elsewhere, only counter for KV8 is armor. To me that is simple as 1+1=2 possible winners.
Do your damage with KV8 or type in GG)

Pulling something of KV8 capabilities, from German tier 4 with superb AT Double shreck PG's and supported by HMG. I can't see how else would that end up but GG............
You need SU85 as counter to brumbar (with KV8 capabilities) and SU85 has hard counter already on the field PG's. 1+1-1=1 winner only
In my opinion would just completely break balance....

You get AT guns that vet up extremely easily (at which point absolutely wreck vehicles), they have 6 man crews, and if you are ever in danger of getting it decrewed you can just merge your standard infantry to preserve the vet. And oh yeah you have cheap mines, AT nades with no interrupt range, T34s that can actually damage tanks now, and a somewhat decent main gun on the KV8. Even if you are relying on SU85 as your only AT, you can probably get one and still save enough fuel for the KV8 by the time you actually accumulate enough CPs to use it. Regardless, even if it costed 2000 fuel that does not warrant it 1-2 bursting squads almost every time. It can even get a buff to its fire AoE so it can burn a larger area, but its not acceptable to insta melt squads.

It appears that KV-8 isn't OP judging by the last patch,if it was then it would've been changed otherwise,no?

It appears that KV-8 isn't OP judging by the last patch,if it was then it would've been changed otherwise,no?

not necessarily true. they dont change everything in 1 patch. relic still knows there are things wrong with the game. it wont all get changed at the same time though. too many changes can lead to problems, plus relic needs time to make and test the changes.

just look at this latest patch. they knew the mg was broken for almost a month. pqumsieh announced the mg changes were coming on the stream in auguest. they still didnt release it at that time, even though they were actually done already.

Interesting point,I thought that if it was such an urgent matter they would do something about it...so next month until KV-8 nerf then?

Interesting point,I thought that if it was such an urgent matter they would do something about it...so next month until KV-8 nerf then?

i didnt say that either. i said just because a kv8 change wasnt made doesnt necessarily mean its balanced. i cant speak for relic as to why they didnt put out the mg changes sooner, but my guess is they wanted to keep testing it longer. i think most people are pretty happy with the changes, so i think waiting until they had a good fix was the right thing to do. if they released a rushed patch the fix the mg and broke things even more, people would have been pissed. i guess people were pissed having to wait too, but you cant make everyone happy. i know another part of the delay is they want to see how the game changed from the last patch. you cant put out balance patches too often, it would become hard to tell what youre doing to the game.

i didnt say that either. i said just because a kv8 change wasnt made doesnt necessarily mean its balanced. i cant speak for relic as to why they didnt put out the mg changes sooner, but my guess is they wanted to keep testing it longer. i think most people are pretty happy with the changes, so i think waiting until they had a good fix was the right thing to do. if they released a rushed patch the fix the mg and broke things even more, people would have been pissed. i guess people were pissed having to wait too, but you cant make everyone happy. i know another part of the delay is they want to see how the game changed from the last patch. you cant put out balance patches too often, it would become hard to tell what youre doing to the game.

+1
This makes sense

People have problems with KV-8 because they insist on countering them with Panzer Greandiers. Any tank will deal with KV-8 with ease. KV-8 literally tickles PzIV with its gun. I had a match in which I had 1 PzIV against 3 KV-8 and destroyed them all.
KV-8 killing units instantly its a flame mechanics issue, not a problem with KV-8 itself. Flame halftruck can do the same.
Even in this topic you can find replies like: " I can only take one shot on KV-8 before it melts my PG. OP unit" and that's the real issue here. You aren't supposed to come near KV-8 with infantry at all because you will be punish for that. It's a anti infantry unit and it excels in what it does. I'd say that Brumbar is more powerful with some nice anti tank potential as well.

People have problems with KV-8 because they insist on countering them with Panzer Greandiers. Any tank will deal with KV-8 with ease. KV-8 literally tickles PzIV with its gun. I had a match in which I had 1 PzIV against 3 KV-8 and destroyed them all.
KV-8 killing units instantly its a flame mechanics issue, not a problem with KV-8 itself. Flame halftruck can do the same.
Even in this topic you can find replies like: " I can only take one shot on KV-8 before it melts my PG. OP unit" and that's the real issue here. You aren't supposed to come near KV-8 with infantry at all because you will be punish for that. It's a anti infantry unit and it excels in what it does. I'd say that Brumbar is more powerful with some nice anti tank potential as well.

im going to have to disagree. flame crits certainly make the kv8 and the flame ht strong (all flamers for that matter) but the real issue is the 40 damage it does. even ignoring crits, it takes 2 seconds to kill an entity. if the squad is close together, it could kill the entire squad in 2 seconds. inf also die that fast while retreating. thats ignoring crits which can only make it faster. i agree people should not be fighting kv8s with grens or pgrens. but that doesnt change how powerful a kv8 is.

as for your game where you killed 3 with 1 p4, that just sounds like bad play by the soviet. theres no reason to build 3 kv8s. build 1 and then have 2 su85s. now your 1 p4 is competely screwed. if a soviet OR a german builds no AT, hell get beat by 1 tank. so that example is kind of irrelevant. if it really was a good game, id like to see the replay to see how it all happened.