How to counter this 2v2 double OKW meta?

You should ask them to put their FRP at base sector

Actually I played most of my games on 2v2 AT;so maybe you should l2p try and use Dhsks or other MGs to counter the evil, evil volx Spam

Ok this is my last reply to people like you in this thread.
Just wow dude
It impresses me that you and your buddy reaching the top 300 2v2 AT axis is a valid argumentation for dshkas or other MGs being the super key vs double OKW and their indirect fire spam


very mediocre rankings, never ever played allies in his entire life, but constantly spamming smartass comments about how to counter double OKW at high ranks and how weak/balanced OKW in teamgames is atm.

nuff said.

I never ever cried for OKW nerfs in this thread, I just wanted to hear some opinions from other players.

Not much you can do vs double Prokw but roll the dice hard, if they don't give up and don't throw away units like crazy, you are gonna lose in the long run no matter what you try.

We haven't found out a bullet proof strategy yet (doubting this strategy even exists...) but double Soviets seem the way to go: One spams T34/76 (or T34/85s or M4Cs) and the other one supports with SU85s. One player uses T1 (mainly Penals who can get rid of trucks easily with Satchels) and the other one T2 (mainly Maxims for suppressing blobs; dodging Stukas shouldn't be impossible). While one player has Mark Target available to counter KT or JT the other one utilizes a doctrine that has both howitzer and 200 munitions bombing run.

Try lethal pushes as often as you can although it might seem to cause plenty of casualties. Considering the fact though how OKW late game will look like this approach is the less painful one.

Show Spoiler

We haven't found out a bullet proof strategy yet (doubting this strategy even exists...) but double Soviets seem the way to go: One spams T34/76 (or T34/85s or M4Cs) and the other one supports with SU85s. One player uses T1 (mainly Penals who can get rid of trucks easily with Satchels) and the other one T2 (mainly Maxims for suppressing blobs; dodging Stukas shouldn't be impossible). While one player has Mark Target available to counter KT or JT the other one utilizes a doctrine that has both howitzer and 200 munitions bombing run.

Try lethal pushes as often as you can although it might seem to cause plenty of casualties. Considering the fact though how OKW late game will look like this approach is the less painful one.

Show Spoiler

sounds very decent, thank you so much. Definitely gonna try that out!

I make it easier what Theodosios said

While OKW have flaless design of Marathon Volks back and forth on the filed from FRP

and Shwerer cover some imortant part of the map

You are doomed

When you remove by you actions those two - You may win

Fun to see the okw defense force back in action again.

OKW are a horribly broken faction. The win rates across all modes and skill levels show OKW at the top or very close every time. They've had their original design cut up yet retained most of the advantages of it. Fixing it isn't easy either because of the mish mash of different approaches left in the ruin of the faction.

We haven't found out a bullet proof strategy yet (doubting this strategy even exists...) but double Soviets seem the way to go: One spams T34/76 (or T34/85s or M4Cs) and the other one supports with SU85s. One player uses T1 (mainly Penals who can get rid of trucks easily with Satchels) and the other one T2 (mainly Maxims for suppressing blobs; dodging Stukas shouldn't be impossible). While one player has Mark Target available to counter KT or JT the other one utilizes a doctrine that has both howitzer and 200 munitions bombing run.

Try lethal pushes as often as you can although it might seem to cause plenty of casualties. Considering the fact though how OKW late game will look like this approach is the less painful one.

Show Spoiler

OH GOD YES, remove frp, from TOP PLAYER in 1v1 and 2v2, YOU HEARD IT! good that here is some other smart person atleast, not just these fking noobs shouting out shit and not knowing anything about the current game balance in 2s. and sadly, double soviet would work, if there wasnt this frp. So we(me,asten,talisman) got into conclusion it has to be usf/ukf with maximal abuse to win double okw vs even decent players.
Now stop spreading this allied/axis fanboi shit here, you dumb cuck like this blvak guy seems to have all his prideposts okw games, so pls dont even take part here.

Soviet mid game definetly stops okw, but eventually the veterancy and very likely frp kills you in the end. And what rank 1k players here talking about stuka dodging ? can i pls cry ? i just played yesterday vs OMG 100 ranked players in 2s and first barrage calliope making 14 kill. IMAGINE, whole army, vs 100 RANK PLAYER OMGSCOOTS. yet 1000ranked guy tells about dodgin stuka here.

Made my day to read ur spoiler theodosis, atleast somebody in this community uses brains

Peace & love

OH GOD YES, remove frp, from TOP PLAYER in 1v1 and 2v2, YOU HEARD IT! good that here is some other smart person atleast, not just these fking noobs shouting out shit and not knowing anything about the current game balance in 2s. and sadly, double soviet would work, if there wasnt this frp. So we(me,asten,talisman) got into conclusion it has to be usf/ukf with maximal abuse to win double okw vs even decent players.
Now stop spreading this allied/axis fanboi shit here, you dumb cuck like this blvak guy seems to have all his prideposts okw games, so pls dont even take part here.

Soviet mid game definetly stops okw, but eventually the veterancy and very likely frp kills you in the end. And what rank 1k players here talking about stuka dodging ? can i pls cry ? i just played yesterday vs OMG 100 ranked players in 2s and first barrage calliope making 14 kill. IMAGINE, whole army, vs 100 RANK PLAYER OMGSCOOTS. yet 1000ranked guy tells about dodgin stuka here.

Made my day to read ur spoiler theodosis, atleast somebody in this community uses brains

Peace & love

epic post, though I got the feel that certain ppl who posted in this thread before will run and go BabyRage to a mod

OH GOD YES, remove frp, from TOP PLAYER in 1v1 and 2v2, YOU HEARD IT! good that here is some other smart person atleast, not just these fking noobs shouting out shit and not knowing anything about the current game balance in 2s. and sadly, double soviet would work, if there wasnt this frp. So we(me,asten,talisman) got into conclusion it has to be usf/ukf with maximal abuse to win double okw vs even decent players.
Now stop spreading this allied/axis fanboi shit here, you dumb cuck like this blvak guy seems to have all his prideposts okw games, so pls dont even take part here.

Soviet mid game definetly stops okw, but eventually the veterancy and very likely frp kills you in the end. And what rank 1k players here talking about stuka dodging ? can i pls cry ? i just played yesterday vs OMG 100 ranked players in 2s and first barrage calliope making 14 kill. IMAGINE, whole army, vs 100 RANK PLAYER OMGSCOOTS. yet 1000ranked guy tells about dodgin stuka here.

Made my day to read ur spoiler theodosis, atleast somebody in this community uses brains

Peace & love

Well said.

How to counter the double 2v2 OKW meta?

Nerf rocket artillery so people can go OH

Seeming you do play AT I would recommend Soviets + USF or duel Soviets. Brits are too easily countered by OKW. One particular tactic that I found to be rather useful even in randoms is getting a large force of penals and having your ally or vice versa smoke their trucks and rush up and throw satchels. They can't do anything as it'll only take 3 to destroy any truck. A USF player has easier access to smoke with their T0 mortar and Riflemen. Of course this takes a concentrated push which could allow them to regain part of the map but the payoff is quite high. This also requires a decent amount of coordination too.

For Soviets + USF, Soviets go Rifle Command and basically do the standard soviet meta of penals into dshks. This provides a strong early game with the extremely powerful dshk. The USF player does the standard build however getting a mortar is very useful even essential. The USF player goes with Captain for AT and it's up to him what doctrine he goes. Calliope is always useful but Priest does have merit with constant barrages due their short cool down. Airborne allows him to go LT if he wishes or call in .50 cals and, IF well used and not needlessly bleeding, Paratroopers with LMGs shred all Axis infantry aside from Obers and even then it's a toss up. Not to mention their timed demo is useful with smoke to plant on OKW trucks. Once the OKW players start to converge on one point do a concentrated attack with smoke and support weapons. Use Penals to simply walk up and throw your charges.

Duel Soviets is basically the same expect for one goes with maxims and one or two mortars for smoke. Lend Lease is always good and even the ML-20 howitzer can be used to good effect as OKW has no cost effective counters to it.

To be honest besides the whole FRP issue OKW has the best cost effective infantry out of all factions. Volks with Stgs can trade equally with BAR Rifles until Rifles get 2 which can be dropped and is 120 munitions. Fusiliers are ridiculous with high vet and can beat BAR Rifles at long and mid range. Throw in the fact they have Obers, Jagars, etc it becomes even a bigger issue on how effective their base infantry is for their price. Only Infantry Section at Vet 3 with duel Brens and five men can reliably beat down Volks, Fusiliers, and Jagars. Same for Vet 3 Rifles with duel BAR. Penal are also more expensive and while they are definetly good AI once OKW gets to Vet 3+ their cost effectiveness is drastically reduced. Did I also mention many of OKW infantry have a good amount of utility with grenades, AT grenades, and (mostly) self healing?

Ok this is my last reply to people like you in this thread.
Just wow dude
It impresses me that you and your buddy reaching the top 300 2v2 AT axis is a valid argumentation for dshkas or other MGs being the super key vs double OKW and their indirect fire spam


very mediocre rankings, never ever played allies in his entire life, but constantly spamming smartass comments about how to counter double OKW at high ranks and how weak/balanced OKW in teamgames is atm.

nuff said.

I never ever cried for OKW nerfs in this thread, I just wanted to hear some opinions from other players.

Mods, are you allowing people to stalk others profiles as a part of posts?

Because when I did it, I got a warning.

OH GOD YES, remove frp...

down with FRPs!!

How to counter the double 2v2 OKW meta?

Nerf rocket artillery so people can go OH

and down with wipe arties...

to me, i think katty level of rockets arty should be the top - in terms of wipe chances, devastation, area denial etc etc. and adjust costs accordingly.

down with FRPs!!



and down with wipe arties...

to me, i think katty level of rockets arty should be the top - in terms of wipe chances, devastation, area denial etc etc. and adjust costs accordingly.

That would be fine with me. Although I've never really had any trouble dealing with rocket arty, even the long bitched about pre-nerf land mattress. How would you ever make Stuka like that though?

And yeah, fuck frps. That would require some cost adjustments though. And would things like okw medhq, Brit gliders, and Brit forward positions still allow reinforcing?

in terms of the forward reinforce bases, i thought doubling their health would be a good buff to motivate soft retreats and account for lost retreat abilities.

I don't think anyone really screams to keep FRPs tbh. It'll change the 4v4 meta more than I think people realize. Especially on big maps.

Since you posted this in the gameplay section, I doubt you did this to gather advice; else you should have posted this in the state office.

From my part, all I can say is that the following inconsistencies/bugs make the situation vs OKW even more desperate than what it needs to be:
- Infiltration nades costing 15 MU; on the most spammable unit. That allows you to stockpile munitions to use for..
- 60MU uncounterable, warning-free, Artillery flare. This is in the same game where EFA has to pay 80MU for AA-fodder plane
- USF/Soviet AT weapons suffering from a -40% movement penalty when crossing craters (which is what the Stukas will spawn)
- Walking stuka not suffering from the usual scatter when firing into the fog of war, unlike every other artillery piece in the game (yeah it still suffers a +25% modifier. However +25% of 0 is still 0)
- Walking stuka being pinpoint accurate regardless of range, unlike other artillery pieces (this makes those 320HP even more annoying since it can fire from max range).
- ISGs being able to use the barrage bug to double-tap
- ISG barrage bulletins making it possible for ISGs to barrage at insane-ranges non-stop
- ISG max scatter capping far too early. This means you don't get the usual quadratic penalties other indirect fire pieces get when firing further; you only get linear penalties
- Vet5 for the lulz

Finally, above all is the relative micro requirements to use any of the above abilities compared to the micro requirements counterparts the opponent has to constantly invest to dodge those units/abilities.

Can you get rid of all this nonsense? Does the scope allow it for the next patch?!

Can you get rid of all this nonsense? Does the scope allow it for the next patch?!

This

Smith please save this game. Along with cons and panthers

To be able to take FRPs out, you need to start thinking of field reinforcement options for those factions. EFA are not exactly helpless on this, as they have their non-doc halftracks. OST can also build command bunkers.

Halftrack reinforcing does require micro, but it pays dividents for it, as you can reinforce also on enemy sectors.

For USF we can probably add a speed governors upgrade (that requires tech, though) to the ambulance to make it move faster, and maybe even allow reinforcing to work outside friendly territory.

For UKF, we can always make their M5 available non-doc, and tie Vickers/PIAT dropping to the doctrine.

The big question is what happens for OKW. While I Know that T1 & T4 is cancer to take out, the faction itself lacks the tools. We can't add 251, because OKW lacks the skins for it. IRHT should probably not be available non-doc.
- Should we allow walking stuka to reinforce on-the-field?
- Should we lift the restriction on MedHQ to allow them to be built elswhere too? (but made both weaker and cheaper)?

If OKW is to be the aggressive faction they need some way to maintain field presence. FRP are a low-micro brute-force of achieving this. Being able to only reinforce near fixed locations is an enormous disadvantage.

I know that OKW behaves more than turtle-incarnate faction rather than an aggressive faction. However, this can change if they no longer trivially-win the lategame.