KV2 Indirect Fire Mode

I think we can agree this unit is hardly ever seen these days.
I think it's an overall decent unit but I think it could use one small change to its indirect fire mode:

Take away pack up time from indirect fire mode.

This will help increase its survivability since it will be able to retreat when it needs to. Its indirect fire mode would function similar to the OKW flakHT. Takes long to set up but can easily back away if it needs to.

Thoughts? Would this make it too difficult to kill?

it has a huge range...put it behind a shot blocker...and u can bomb all the time...it is better than a ST...since it hase fast reload and shot alone all the time. trust me...it will kill more than a ST in a game, when in good position.

But when your opponent success flank it with massive AT(hello sucide StuGs spam), it will be gardening up .
At least ST vet 1 have smoke ...

The kv2 problem is that their are far more useful commanders and units than it as well as being heavily map dependent therefore isnt the best option 99% of the time.

The only thing its good at is shooting over shot blockers granted that they arnt higher than the gun. 300/180 armor and absolutely lackluster vet (wish it gained some reload vet for roaming considering its 11.13 sec).

The outstanding factor for the KV2 is when its placed on sloop or on a cliff, the shots will always fall short like a limp dick ( I posted a video a long time ago showing this).

But when your opponent success flank it with massive AT(hello sucide StuGs spam), it will be gardening up .
At least ST vet 1 have smoke ...

Are you referring to the NahrW at vet 1? isn't that an anti-infantry defensive grenade?

Use well supported, it's a wipe machine.

The problem is is that allies are used to picking commanders as axis react to the commander picked/allied gameplay. So when I see that commander being used, I'll go elephant or arty do to the atrocious amount of repair stations that are built. So it's something that is being planned on countering as the game is loading up and the commander is seen.

So basically I see it as the problem being the kv2 is never really a surprise or a shock unit. It's not a commander choosen to react to an axis commander or strategy

Changes to Kv-2 should include:
CP 13 or CP 12
Price should be significantly lower IS-2 to 630/200 or 550/240
Remove minimum range from siege mod
Remove sight penalty in siege mod
Remove Target seize penalty during changing modes
New vet 1 ability.
New vet 3 bonuses

I like the idea of a indirect fire KV2 as it is creative and sounds like fun.
But honestly I think we currently have way too much problems with the current indirect fire.

I like the idea of a indirect fire KV2 as it is creative and sounds like fun.
But honestly I think we currently have way too much problems with the current indirect fire.

yeah ..its really fun to play as okw, and get every minute rockets from a LM, Stalinorgel, caliOP, priests and 150/203mm artis on your trucks....

pls more Indirect fire/ arties/ callins on allie side..

yeah ..its really fun to play as okw, and get every minute rockets from a LM, Stalinorgel, caliOP, priests and 150/203mm artis on your trucks....


pls more Indirect fire/ arties/ callins on allie side..

Why axis people always complain about alied rocket arty ? Axis rape usf since launch with multiple rockets arty without counter and after that tiger say hello but yeah that was normal becouse OP rifles and now still as usf u need to chose caliope commander when okw get stuka at 5min or 10 min KT with wehrmaht fuel drop (my point of view is 4vs4) .

For me all rocket arty should be doctrinal and be like katiuszza
dunno why okw need only tier to get one

Why axis people always complain about alied rocket arty ? Axis rape usf since launch with multiple rockets arty without counter and after that tiger say hello

Ye because building T4,getting a panzerwerfer and after that getting a tiger is a bit...questionable in a serious game

The KV2 feels quite solid frankly. I don't remember the price, but if it costs around IS-2, then it's OK. The unit, quite frankly, murders infantry if used properly. What makes it weak is that it can easily get hardcountered by dirt-cheap stuff.

The only mechanics change I would dream about changing is fixing scatter offset for all mobile mini-howitzer vehicles (e.g., Brummbar, etc), so that their shots are centered around the actual target, rather than behind it.

For KV2 this is even more important as it's the thing that would allow the unit to hit incoming tanks.

On the other hand, what really kills the unit are:
- Soviet late-game scaling; you're in a doctrine with no elite infantry (guards, shocks, dshk)
- OKW late-game scaling
- TWP abilities that have 1000 penetration and deal full damage, plus crits, with no tradeoffs
- Raketenwerfer veterancy
- Stug penetration (for that ROF and price, it's murder)

Basically, all of the above have been cranked so hard to be able counter heavy-tank call-ins in 1v1 (e.g., IS-2, Crocodile), at the expense of manking every other allied tank with moderately high armour (e.g., Bulldozer) completely unviable.

Once you fix call-ins, there's no need to keep penetration values for dirt-cheap units too high.

Then, once you fix the dirt-cheap hardcounters, KV2 etc will have the breathing space they need to perform.

The KV2 feels quite solid frankly. I don't remember the price, but if it costs around IS-2, then it's OK. The unit, quite frankly, murders infantry if used properly. What makes it weak is that it can easily get hardcountered by dirt-cheap stuff.

The only mechanics change I would dream about changing is fixing scatter offset for all mobile mini-howitzer vehicles (e.g., Brummbar, etc), so that their shots are centered around the actual target, rather than behind it.

For KV2 this is even more important as it's the thing that would allow the unit to hit incoming tanks.

On the other hand, what really kills the unit are:
- Soviet late-game scaling; you're in a doctrine with no elite infantry (guards, shocks, dshk)
- OKW late-game scaling
- TWP abilities that have 1000 penetration and deal full damage, plus crits, with no tradeoffs
- Raketenwerfer veterancy
- Stug penetration (for that ROF and price, it's murder)

Basically, all of the above have been cranked so hard to be able counter heavy-tank call-ins in 1v1 (e.g., IS-2, Crocodile), at the expense of manking every other allied tank with moderately high armour (e.g., Bulldozer) completely unviable.

Once you fix call-ins, there's no need to keep penetration values for dirt-cheap units too high.

Then, once you fix the dirt-cheap hardcounters, KV2 etc will have the breathing space they need to perform.

The minimum range has to be removed. The minimum range was sort of okay before the reduction in max range but currently the area the unit will fire is very small. CP should also be equal or lower then IS-2.

Why axis people always complain about alied rocket arty ? Axis rape usf since launch with multiple rockets arty without counter and after that tiger say hello but yeah that was normal becouse OP rifles and now still as usf u need to chose caliope commander when okw get stuka at 5min or 10 min KT with wehrmaht fuel drop (my point of view is 4vs4) .

dunno why okw need only tier to get one

true

nobody complain about walking stuka wiped line of defensive team weapon (mg,at,mortar) in a single barrage
but they crying about calliOP sure it's hard to kill but it's commander unit, cost of medium tank and atleast you'll guarantee not to facing with pershing or easy8 while the other side worried about the god damn king tiger after they teared my defensive line

sometime in large team game (3v3,4v4) you will met with these perfect combination forces
OKW guy with 105 artillery , bunker spam end up with KT
OKW with scout flare end up with command panther
Osteer with elephant + stuka divebomb
Osteer with Ju op antitank staff
which is instant GG in lategame

Can we get back to KV-2?

The KV2 feels quite solid frankly. I don't remember the price, but if it costs around IS-2, then it's OK. The unit, quite frankly, murders infantry if used properly. What makes it weak is that it can easily get hardcountered by dirt-cheap stuff.

The only mechanics change I would dream about changing is fixing scatter offset for all mobile mini-howitzer vehicles (e.g., Brummbar, etc), so that their shots are centered around the actual target, rather than behind it.

For KV2 this is even more important as it's the thing that would allow the unit to hit incoming tanks.

On the other hand, what really kills the unit are:
- Soviet late-game scaling; you're in a doctrine with no elite infantry (guards, shocks, dshk)
- OKW late-game scaling
- TWP abilities that have 1000 penetration and deal full damage, plus crits, with no tradeoffs
- Raketenwerfer veterancy
- Stug penetration (for that ROF and price, it's murder)

Basically, all of the above have been cranked so hard to be able counter heavy-tank call-ins in 1v1 (e.g., IS-2, Crocodile), at the expense of manking every other allied tank with moderately high armour (e.g., Bulldozer) completely unviable.

Once you fix call-ins, there's no need to keep penetration values for dirt-cheap units too high.

Then, once you fix the dirt-cheap hardcounters, KV2 etc will have the breathing space they need to perform.

I think you still have PTSD from that match on camping in the woods

It really doesn't need such a long teardown. It's already defenseless like a baby bird against tanks from being super slow, having no sight, and a minimum range. Adding in a 5? second timer where it cant move or shoot or see when it tries to retreat is incredibly frustrating.

I think all it needs is a vet rework. Like give siege mode a 3 round barrage with like arty range at vet 1 or something, maybe some deflection crits when in siege mode too?

All I wanna see are different commanders with more diverse strategies. Things like Sexton's, camo upgrade for ostheer, KV2, kv1, ISU, shocks, assgrens, valentine, bulldozer, Paratroopers, stormtroopers, hull down ostwind, flamehetzer, etc. Things outside the meta that shack things up a bit and make your opponent think about changing their Strategy and adapting to yours. I wouldn't mind seeing minor buffs to all units out of the meta even if it does make them slightly over perform.

Most of these units I mentioned are found in non-meta commanders or found in only one commander. If they are gonna be picking a non-meta commander I think the units it provides should be worth going for.

The KV2 feels quite solid frankly. I don't remember the price, but if it costs around IS-2, then it's OK. The unit, quite frankly, murders infantry if used properly. What makes it weak is that it can easily get hardcountered by dirt-cheap stuff.

The only mechanics change I would dream about changing is fixing scatter offset for all mobile mini-howitzer vehicles (e.g., Brummbar, etc), so that their shots are centered around the actual target, rather than behind it.

For KV2 this is even more important as it's the thing that would allow the unit to hit incoming tanks.

On the other hand, what really kills the unit are:
- Soviet late-game scaling; you're in a doctrine with no elite infantry (guards, shocks, dshk)
- OKW late-game scaling
- TWP abilities that have 1000 penetration and deal full damage, plus crits, with no tradeoffs
- Raketenwerfer veterancy
- Stug penetration (for that ROF and price, it's murder)

Basically, all of the above have been cranked so hard to be able counter heavy-tank call-ins in 1v1 (e.g., IS-2, Crocodile), at the expense of manking every other allied tank with moderately high armour (e.g., Bulldozer) completely unviable.

Once you fix call-ins, there's no need to keep penetration values for dirt-cheap units too high.

Then, once you fix the dirt-cheap hardcounters, KV2 etc will have the breathing space they need to perform.

The KV2 is 230 fuel and 630mp so yah, same as IS2. It has same front armor as Tiger but with 40 more rear armor. Its pen is 180 which is pretty low but has same range as elephant in indirect mode and can shoot over shot blockers and wipe infantry and has turret.

In terms of its potency I agree it's in a good spot.

In terms of its drawbacks:
- I agree OKW scaling (specifically on its high armor tanks) is a problem (due to KV2 low pen)
-how does a twp ability make that much of a difference against this unit if it's already behind a shot blocker, has super long reload anyways, and has a long pick up time so it can't retreat? I don't think this unit suffers too much from twp. Feel free to debate my opinion however.
- high vet racketens? I'm trying to figure out how and why an OKW player is gonna sneak his high vet vulnerable AT gun behind the enemy lines to hit the KV2 which will likely be behind a shot blocker (although if it's in direct fire mode these could be nasty indeed). However I don't think KV2 struggles against easy to wipe racketens.
- I agree a stug or two could murder a KV2 one on one without much problems. However I don't think this is the problem kv2s have since they can shoot over shot blockers and have excellent range so they don't need to be near the front in range of stugs.

What I do think the KV2 struggles with, is when a lone p4 or even puma drives up behind his shot blocker and shoots it to death with its better ROF. The frustrating part is that this unit can't retreat in time because it's pack up time. I wouldn't mind seeing its pack up time removed to allow for the user to retreat it when he wants to. Thoughts?

I think we can agree this unit is hardly ever seen these days.
I think it's an overall decent unit but I think it could use one small change to its indirect fire mode:

Take away pack up time from indirect fire mode.

This will help increase its survivability since it will be able to retreat when it needs to. Its indirect fire mode would function similar to the OKW flakHT. Takes long to set up but can easily back away if it needs to.

Thoughts? Would this make it too difficult to kill?

Nobody would use this commander anyway. A mobile howitzer that costs 630/230/19 but has a range that is 10 less than a standard mortar is already a questionable choice, but when paired with a commander that has a bunch of other nearly worthless abilities makes it a bad choice. The cost is almost the same as two Katy's for something that is a lot less usable.

Why should the soviet supply drop be highly vulnerable, while OST supply drops are invulnerable?

PS - Setup and teardown time make it vulnerable to wonder Stuka and repair stations also get wiped by Stuka.