Does anyone else think the Comet is bullshit?

I would rate Comet as unit most in need of balance right now, especially after balance patch.

The unit is deadly to infantry because at any time it could snipe them from its main gun or destroy them with a cheap WP round which recharges so quickly it can hit the AT gun again before it can fire if it moves. On top of that the extreme damage against tanks in such an AI platform is unacceptable. It has no trouble dealing with all of T3, T4 has nothing of interest to stop it for Wehr. To make matters worse it has cheap gimmicky vet, which makes it even less likely you can use anything but tank based AT. Its war speed would normally be fine, but combined with a tank that already deals with all targets with ease it just means that high vet comets cannot be killed and so inflict massive bleed.

The comet needs a nerf in one of its roles, and it should be done soon, since its play is not terribly uncommon. At higher teams games this unit can be easily abused, much as the Panther was in yesteryear.

It is a general consensus that it needs reworked along with many other tanks so here are my suggestion. Each tank should execl at something but not at all.

-Centaur is the anti Infantry and AA. Could use a minor mobility buff in its current state.
-Cromwell is the Main Battle tank. Needs a anti crush measure. Reduce turn rate?
-Firefly is long range anti tank. Largely balance I say.
-Churchill is infantry support. The Churchill it actually really good just overshadowed. I would change the smoke to remove the speed penalty and change the grenade for a pintle mount. The grenade for both the Comet and Churchill is a bit to easy to kill AT gun's crew.

-To make the Comet more unique in this line up tanks a panther style tank hunter is a good option, not just an better version of a Main battle tank. Additionally, removing white phosphorous smoke and the grenade is needed. The regular smoke shells I am fine with since it is utility and the limited available of mortar pit smoke makes it a good alternative.

-I would like to see more armor penetration at close range also with some tanks. Making so cheap swarms of tanks and low pen units can more reliably engage heavier armor at dangerous close range. Something minor say plus 10 to 15 armor with in 10 meters. T34/76, Churchills, and Panzer 4s.

This would allow panthers and comets to be fought against with the previous tier of tanks to a more reasonable degree while panthers and comets still take them on from on at any range.

...
You don't bring PV in order to counter Jackson, FF or Su85s. If they are not effective at range, then you would just make PV to boom rush them.
...

No you do not use the Panther to counter the M-36, the FF or Su-85, but then again you do not built them to counter anything, only to support other units.

It is too expensive and fires too slow to fight mediums that can swarm it and it is moderate against heavy tanks like the IS-2, Pershing even the Comet.

On the Other hand units like the M-36 the firefly and Su-85 can counter most allied tanks.

A vet 3 firefly can one shoot a kubel at range 60 with 100% accuracy (the thing has accuracy at range 45 similar to the accuracy smgs have at 35).

Does anyone remember when they were going to nerf the comets health down to 720? I mean in my own opinion the comet should swap armor values with the Churchill and maybe have it's accuracy reduces slightly.

White phosphorus needs a change too.

I think the problem is one of imbalances within the German tankforce (I know this thread is about the Comet, but the Comet is also affected by this). While the TDs overperform (or at least are very cost efficient), like the cheap stug, the incredibly op jp4 on vet or the long-range monsters elefant and JT, the medium tanks are udnerwhelming at best; the medium tanks on allies side are very good on the other hand, especially in terms of ai capabilities. The Germans lack at capabilities and they are weak versus infantry, something that the axis (especially OST) needs desperately. This often leads to TD-use since they are the only ones to effectively stop Comets, unlike medium tanks.

This imbalance between German TDs and medium tanks leads to some frustration on both sides, I reckon, where allies tanks get sniped down by German super-efficient TDs whereas medium tanks usually fail the axis player. The Comet is just the cherry on the top as it is extremely cost-efficient with its at and ai capabilities, plus his op abilities. Generalist tanks should not be as strong as the Comet.

Yes, please nerf the Comet, because every game should end like this one, only faster.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSozJRYKjgY

(For those that don't want to take the time to watch, Comets & Arty Cover were great early, JT & vet5 Panther uber alles)

The other ones are a no-brainer. However, out of curiosity, what part of Ostheer sniper you consider bullshit (that hasn't been fixed by WBP stealth nerfs)?

Ost sucks compared to other factions right now so therefore the sniper is overall fine but against the brits and usf especially the sniper bleeds them disproportionately because it has a rate of fire meant to kill 20mp conscripts or 15mp (opieop) maxim crewmen, but is shooting at 28mp core infantry and weapon teams vs. brits and usf.

No you do not use the Panther to counter the M-36, the FF or Su-85, but then again you do not built them to counter anything, only to support other units.

It is too expensive and fires too slow to fight mediums that can swarm it and it is moderate against heavy tanks like the IS-2, Pershing even the Comet.

On the Other hand units like the M-36 the firefly and Su-85 can counter most allied tanks.

A vet 3 firefly can one shoot a kubel at range 60 with 100% accuracy (the thing has accuracy at range 45 similar to the accuracy smgs have at 35).

Mediums shouldn't be able to swarm a panther (unless there's a disproportionate amount of them) because panther has fast reverse speed, very good frontal armor, a good (if slow and inaccurate) main gun and fausts out the ass on its supporting infantry.

I would rate Comet as unit most in need of balance right now, especially after balance patch.

The unit is deadly to infantry because at any time it could snipe them from its main gun or destroy them with a cheap WP round which recharges so quickly it can hit the AT gun again before it can fire if it moves. On top of that the extreme damage against tanks in such an AI platform is unacceptable. It has no trouble dealing with all of T3, T4 has nothing of interest to stop it for Wehr. To make matters worse it has cheap gimmicky vet, which makes it even less likely you can use anything but tank based AT. Its war speed would normally be fine, but combined with a tank that already deals with all targets with ease it just means that high vet comets cannot be killed and so inflict massive bleed.

The comet needs a nerf in one of its roles, and it should be done soon, since its play is not terribly uncommon. At higher teams games this unit can be easily abused, much as the Panther was in yesteryear.

I vote panther main gun for it and either give it a panther level pintle and better vet and take out the grenade and wp shell or increase wp cool down to like 20-30 (I like the second option because otherwise it's just a panther).

Comet WP range to 40 from current 70 range op state.

Change Comet AI to match cromwell/OKW p4 level (not counting crush ofc).


Remove churchill smoke speed debuff to make it more useful.

Let's see how things work this way.

And please do not compare Comet to panther, we all know Ost panther is weak even against balanced mediums and needs a buff (preferably long range accuracy and on-move accuracy buff - a 75% on move accuracy not current 50%. And buff pintle hmg to match OKW panther )

Comet WP range to 40 from current 70 range op state.

Change Comet AI to match cromwell/OKW p4 level (not counting crush ofc).


Remove churchill smoke speed debuff to make it more useful.

Let's see how things work this way.

And please do not compare Comet to panther, we all know Ost panther is weak even against balanced mediums and needs a buff (preferably long range accuracy and on-move accuracy buff - a 75% on move accuracy not current 50%. And buff pintle hmg to match OKW panther )

And remove the WP's ability to kill. Agree with the rest. Churchill is also too expensive if you ask me.

Making the Churchhill more attractive and nerfing the Comets AI seems the like obvious answers here.

the main problem is the armor and health. with it's mobility you can already drive it around like a gokart.

but seeing a comet driving DIRECTLY AT a wall of paks/raketen/stugs and seeing 2/3 of hits bounce off is undescribable

get it to not bounce all the time and the cheeser can still have fun with driving it around while good preparation against comet attacks actually matters

Mediums shouldn't be able to swarm a panther (unless there's a disproportionate amount of them) because panther has fast reverse speed, very good frontal armor, a good (if slow and inaccurate) main gun and fausts out the ass on its supporting infantry.

Simply calculate how many mediums allies can have before an Ostheer Panther appears.

Unless you kill a whole bunch of infantry (like say a Centaur or Ostwind), the experience gained from infantry is almost negligible. And the OKW Panther being "decent" against infantry is simply not true, all Panthers are varyingly (we're talking about less than 10% difference in effective DPS) atrocious against infantry - and they should be.

The problem of the Panther is certainly not its lack of anti-infantry prowess, that part doesn't and shouldn't be played around with. On the other hand, the Comet needs to put into a single category, it can't be good at everything when it is around the same cost of the Panthers, combined with cheaper and faster Brit teching. Not to mention that the ridiculous 0.75 movement accuracy modifier for Brit tanks has to go, they are well armoured and armed enough to not have to rely on flanking - that was the very reason why the Sherman and Jackson got those modifiers, and even the Sherman is scratching at that argument's limit with all the buffs it received over the past two years.

Once the Comet is put in its place, we could then take a look at whether the Panther still underperforms, and if that is the case, its strengths should be enhanced further. Nobody gains anything if the Panther is turned into a second Comet.

Actually forcing off inf is pretty important when you need to cover the flanks. Comet + 6-pounder is pretty decent while the same cannot be said with Panther + Pak40 or Panther + Raketen. Problem with Panther is that the unit is just not cost-effective compared to its peer. OH Panther arrives way too late which means better save that fuel + Mp for Tiger and for OKW Jadgpanzer can do everything better at cheaper price.

The other ones are a no-brainer. However, out of curiosity, what part of Ostheer sniper you consider bullshit (that hasn't been fixed by WBP stealth nerfs)?

Well, even if you manage to pull off a good flank with cons/rifles, he has so many HP and that you can't kill him at mid range, although you deserved it with your maneuvre. he just survives by retreating (which is another example of good tactics countered by 1-click stuff)


I think he should not get that good received accuracy bonus on retreat, as countering sniper with infantry micro is much harder than the other way around.

So I was a bit bored today and watched Hans' 2v2 replay. At one moment he had 3 Comets, 3 Engis, Mattress and 6 pounder.

It reminded me of good old times when triple Tiger + triple engis were the meta

Not to mention that he was spamming Comets like crazy and guess what, it worked.
On the other side, when was the last time you saw triple Panther?

2 weeeks ago i stop with 2 panthers m10 spam and buldozers at market map .

And buff pintle hmg to match OKW panther

But they're already the same...

Is it possible that some bulletin causes the Comet to overperform? We had this before with other units (formula for calculating damage was wrong). Even though I have to admit that the video above clearly shows Panther as the winner, I often see the Comet winning in "real" matches.

Is it possible that some bulletin causes the Comet to overperform? We had this before with other units (formula for calculating damage was wrong). Even though I have to admit that the video above clearly shows Panther as the winner, I often see the Comet winning in "real" matches.

That video is dumb because it's a type of matchup that never happens, both tanks parked, shooting at each other. The comet is usually on the move, trying to flank. To avoid getting outflanked, the Panther must move. The panther can't hit shit compared to the majority of tanks, while moving. Add in that the Comet can also destroy infantry with profoundly more ease than a Panther, and the Comet is clearly the better tank.

I've pretty much quit making Panthers in my matchups, for sheer tank killing power, the StuG is the go to weapon IMO, you can get 2 StuG's for the same popcap as 1 panther, and 2 stugs will kill enemy tanks much faster, than a single Panther ever could.

Actually for the cost of teching+1 Panther, you could build like 3 StuG's.

I dunno what I would build a Panther for, you sacrifice a significant amount of AT ability compared to two StuGs, for some additional mg's, oh and I suppose some health, armor, and a turret.

Panther really doesn't become beastly until it hits vet 2, and that's actually pretty difficult due to it being a lategame tank, and of high cost.