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MARCH 28th UPDATE

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23 Mar 2017, 18:33 PM
#101
avatar of Luoppis

Posts: 37

I'm very happy to see so many bug/feature fixes made by community members included in the actual patch. I salute you for the extra effort!

Im also very pleased with how camo will be changed. No more instant phase-shifting squads rushing your units but instead you actually have to play for ambushes. And people will also have to better manage their snipers.

Of course a lot of broken stuff still remains in the game. But atleast we can hope that they could be next in scope :hyper:
23 Mar 2017, 18:37 PM
#102
avatar of Tobis
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4


snibbety snab


I read everything you wrote, and it seems you pretty much ignore anything you don't like.

Other counters to light tanks besides the 222 work. It was difficult for Ostheer, so they were all toned down significantly. All things considered Ostheer will come out ahead with this patch. They will still be having issues, especially against brits, but most of the main problems facing them have been adjusted. More changes would have been better but they are not in the scope of the patch. This is a stepping stone necessary to deal with, you said it yourself that the 222 was underpriced.

If you want people to take you seriously please post some actual facts or replays to give your arguments some legitimacy. Prove to me that the 222 should be buffed more.
23 Mar 2017, 18:51 PM
#103
avatar of vasa1719

Posts: 2635 | Subs: 4

Permanently Banned


Guards (with coming nerfs) are hardly elite when compere to Obers, Paras, Rangers or even PzGrens.

Personally, for me it's more obvious to give them a buff but increase call-in cost and reinforce to make them powerful, expensive and elite to encourge to use Penals/Cons instead of making them semi-main line infantry.

+1
23 Mar 2017, 19:41 PM
#104
avatar of Hon3ynuts

Posts: 818

Honestly everything in this patch sounds great! except mabye the penal thing, the role makes sense but the svts and ptrs's are a weird combo so we'll see how it works out

Can someone explain to me what these 222 scout car changes are doing for the damage though? It seems like the same thing as the t70(more mg damage less aoe) but i don't see it clearly there.
23 Mar 2017, 20:05 PM
#105
avatar of ZombiFrancis

Posts: 2742

The idea with the 222 is that it can now deal more damage to infantry in the short window it can fight infantry that is not in cover. Their staying power is unchanged and they will cost a whole lot more, enough so ostheer is pretty much going all-in with their fuel investment for 222s.

Considering 222s had to more or less make sacrificial dives to be worth it, this means the 222 won't be able to perform that same role.

The 222 is kind of like the flakht for okw now: too expensive, poorly timed, highly situational, and ineffective in its role.

222 has been an issue since day 1. The dang thing is supposed to be closer to a kubel than the 234 puma it's pretending to be.
23 Mar 2017, 20:32 PM
#106
avatar of Ducati
Benefactor 115

Posts: 164



Guards (with coming nerfs) are hardly elite when compere to Obers, Paras, Rangers or even PzGrens.


Why would you compare Para's and Rangers to Guards?

Maybe the soviets have a different tool (or set of tools) to fill the rolls that these other units fill?

Comparing 2 units in a vacuum ignores way too many aspects of the game.
23 Mar 2017, 20:44 PM
#107
avatar of Australian Magic

Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Mar 2017, 20:32 PMDucati


Why would you compare Para's and Rangers to Guards?

Maybe the soviets have a different tool (or set of tools) to fill the rolls that these other units fill?

Comparing 2 units in a vacuum ignores way too many aspects of the game.


Becasue they are supposed to be elite, like Rangers or Pars, not main line infnatry (maybe not in terms of raw power but you should feel "elitness")
With cheaper (and weaker) Guards, maxim spam into Guards with Motor Guard will be a thing for 99% games (unless you want to stay fancy and use Cons but why would you?)
24 Mar 2017, 00:37 AM
#108
avatar of Grumpy

Posts: 1954



Guards, DSHK.

Also Maxims too, until they get eventually nerfed.


I appreciate all of the work that you and the rest of the balance team have done, but, comments like this make most of us think that you're pretty biased towards axis factions.

The win rate right now is the most balanced that it has ever been. It will be interesting to see what it is after the patch.
24 Mar 2017, 02:48 AM
#109
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Mar 2017, 00:37 AMGrumpy


I appreciate all of the work that you and the rest of the balance team have done, but, comments like this make most of us think that you're pretty biased towards axis factions.

The win rate right now is the most balanced that it has ever been. It will be interesting to see what it is after the patch.


You won't find a single top player or non biased one which would tell you that maxims A move strats aren't TOO GOOD for whatever input they require.
There's an (unfortunate) reason why maxims are mainline infantry and conscripts are supports.
24 Mar 2017, 03:32 AM
#110
avatar of Grumpy

Posts: 1954



You won't find a single top player or non biased one which would tell you that maxims A move strats aren't TOO GOOD for whatever input they require.
There's an (unfortunate) reason why maxims are mainline infantry and conscripts are supports.


I wouldn't argue that point but, at the same time, show me one of those players who uses conscripts as their main infantry throughout the game.
24 Mar 2017, 03:47 AM
#111
avatar of aomsinzana

Posts: 284 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Mar 2017, 03:32 AMGrumpy


I wouldn't argue that point but, at the same time, show me one of those players who uses conscripts as their main infantry throughout the game.

You can ask VonIvan :romeoMug:
24 Mar 2017, 06:36 AM
#114
avatar of mackz

Posts: 5

Thanks for the patch, much appreciated!
24 Mar 2017, 07:29 AM
#115
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1



Becasue they are supposed to be elite, like Rangers or Pars, not main line infnatry (maybe not in terms of raw power but you should feel "elitness")
With cheaper (and weaker) Guards, maxim spam into Guards with Motor Guard will be a thing for 99% games (unless you want to stay fancy and use Cons but why would you?)


They are pretty commonly see on the battlefield to be elite right now.
24 Mar 2017, 09:13 AM
#116
avatar of Highfiveeeee

Posts: 1740

The idea with the 222 is that it can now deal more damage to infantry in the short window it can fight infantry that is not in cover. Their staying power is unchanged and they will cost a whole lot more, enough so ostheer is pretty much going all-in with their fuel investment for 222s.

Considering 222s had to more or less make sacrificial dives to be worth it, this means the 222 won't be able to perform that same role.

The 222 is kind of like the flakht for okw now: too expensive, poorly timed, highly situational, and ineffective in its role.

222 has been an issue since day 1. The dang thing is supposed to be closer to a kubel than the 234 puma it's pretending to be.



What as good as most players don't know about the 222 is that it deals insane damage if it targets enemies IN FRONT of cover.

so just a quick sketch:

X = The 222
O = The enemy units
| = Cover


In this case, the 222 will do almost zero damage:

|
X | O
|


But if you manage to get the enemy in front of the cover:

              |
X O |
|


It will deal as much damage as an Ostwind because the projectiles will stop directly behind the enemy troops, dealing splash damage almost exactly near the target.
24 Mar 2017, 13:07 PM
#117
avatar of BIH_kirov_QC

Posts: 367



You won't find a single top player or non biased one which would tell you that maxims A move strats aren't TOO GOOD for whatever input they require.
There's an (unfortunate) reason why maxims are mainline infantry and conscripts are supports.


If Maximim get nerfed. conscripts need some love and shocks.
24 Mar 2017, 15:28 PM
#118
avatar of Australian Magic

Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Mar 2017, 07:29 AMEsxile


They are pretty commonly see on the battlefield to be elite right now.


And that's the thing. They are already common so why make them even more common? Why would you ever use Penals or Cons if you can spam maxims and then spam guards?
24 Mar 2017, 18:52 PM
#119
avatar of Luoppis

Posts: 37

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Mar 2017, 00:37 AMGrumpy
The win rate right now is the most balanced that it has ever been. It will be interesting to see what it is after the patch.


This current set of "balance" has been around for such a long time that active players have learned to work around certain things. In my opinion its some of the most ridiculous things like British artillery cover or moments of RNG blessings that stand out as things that can unnecessarily turn the tide of some matches rather than any blatant balance issues. But changes are still welcome and needed.
24 Mar 2017, 21:55 PM
#120
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066



And that's the thing. They are already common so why make them even more common? Why would you ever use Penals or Cons if you can spam maxims and then spam guards?


Because cons don't deserve buffs FeelsBadMan :foreveralone:

I remember one patch in 2014 where they buffed cons to be superior or equal to grens. The amount of rage it produced was sad. I like conscript strats, it is just that conscripts strats usually don't work :(

FeelsBadMan
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