Why ZiS get a slow debuff?

Who had the amazing idea to give worst AT a slow movement penalty?

And probably affects turnrate too...

seriously relic...

Who had the amazing idea to give worst AT a slow movement penalty?

And probably affects turnrate too...

seriously relic...

Are you referring to the commander ability that makes it cloak? This ability has remained unchanged from launch as far as I know. The debuffs should come off once the gun fires to help users, but this was never implemented.

No I'm talking about the goddamn slow when you go over ANY obstacle that only slow the zis down, all other ats don't have that shit.

It's so bad that I gave up on using it again.

The effect that you are talking about was identified on m-42 only right now and is fixed there in WBP. If you claim that zis-3 has same bug, send a replay to WBP crew.

just go into cheat mode and use a katuysa to make a lot of craters then move the zis over it, you will see that it get massive slow as soon it enter the yellow cover and move normally when it leaves. It's like it is moving on deep snow or something.

Like I said, I don't know if the turn rate also get slowed.

also, if this is a bug, it's been around for years. I can't believe nobody get annoyed by it.

Post a replay if you want the community modders to look into it.

I always had the same feeling, that the ZIS was moving slower but a said to my self that this is just in my head.
If this is true then please fix it ASAP.

Yeah we know of this inconsistency. Soviet and USF guns get a -40% speed debuff in crater cover. Probably just so that it's easier to wipe them with artillery, again and again. (Other guns don't get any speed debuffs of any kind).

Unfortunately, addressing this inconsistency was deemed out of scope.

I kinda understand, that in soft, rough ground chewed by artillery a one ton gun can be a bit hard to move around, even with a crew. So that makes sense. If it affected 75mm PaK too it should be ok.

Then the 45mm russian at gun, and raketenwerfer shoud not be affected by soft mud, as they're pretty lightweight.

Unfortunately, addressing this inconsistency was deemed out of scope.

xD

SKOP

I kinda understand, that in soft, rough ground chewed by artillery a one ton gun can be a bit hard to move around, even with a crew. So that makes sense. If it affected 75mm PaK too it should be ok.

Then the 45mm russian at gun, and raketenwerfer shoud not be affected by soft mud, as they're pretty lightweight.

That could be a nice idea to let raketenwerfer/m42 have a niche advantage over other AT guns. However, I wouldn't make the speed debuff more than 10-20%. There is -no- way you can dodge an incoming stuka barrage under these conditions (and those barrages will spawn even more craters).

To get a feel of how massive a 10-20% debuff to speed is, try out the following vehicles:
- M20 -> 20% speed debuff on craters
- Greyhound -> 20% speed debuff on craters
- Stuart -> 10% debuff on craters

PS: The Soviet AT ambush ability imparts a -75% movement speed penalty, which is why it is so useless.

Unfortunately, addressing this inconsistency was deemed out of scope.

The Soviet AT ambush ability imparts a -75% movement speed penalty, which is why it is so useless.

No, the Ambush ability is fucking useless, because it only appears in absolute rubbish commanders. The Raketenwerfer's cloak also comes with a massive movement penalty, yet nobody claims that this makes the ability useless (and that's on an AT gun that's even worse than the ZiS-3).

No, the Ambush ability is fucking useless, because it only appears in absolute rubbish commanders. The Raketenwerfer's cloak also comes with a massive movement penalty, yet nobody claims that this makes the ability useless (and that's on an AT gun that's even worse than the ZiS-3).

The movement penalty you are referring to is:
- 50% at Vet0
- 0% at Vet1 and thereafter

The same ability also infers some accuracy/penetration bonuses starting from Vet3. With Soviet AT Ambush you get nothing.

The movement penalty you are referring to is:
- 50% at Vet0
- 0% at Vet1 and thereafter

The same ability also infers some accuracy/penetration bonuses starting from Vet3. With Soviet AT Ambush you get nothing.

Yeah, good luck keeping that Raketenwerfer alive at that point, when a single shot from the exact units it is meant to fight are extremely likely to instantly kill it - the ZiS doesn't suffer from that problem. And considering that the ZiS-3 is significantly superior to the Raketenwerfer (even with the cloak buffs the Raketenwerfer has), Ambush cloak doesn't seem that bad a deal anymore.

The problem, as I wrote above, is that Ambush cloak comes on shitty commanders. It's on Mechanised Support Tactics and Combined Arms Army. Perhaps one of the other abilities has any actual usefulness to it, the rest is complete and utter wank, not worth the time Relic needed to create them. That's why you don't see it being used, not because the cloak itself is shit. Back when the ISU-152 was worthwhile, you'd regularly see people use Mechanised Support Tactics, because it had the glorious ISU in combination with Mark Target and a bombing run. That also meant you'd see loads of cloaked AT guns, because that became a viable strategy. Weirdly enough, all that stopped when the ISU was nerfed into oblivion... Hm, I wonder why that might be?

Yeah, good luck keeping that Raketenwerfer alive at that point

Raketen is the most survivable AT, it's pretty easy to vet them to at least vet1(3 shots) and that is all you need.

Yeah, good luck keeping that Raketenwerfer alive at that point, when a single shot from the exact units it is meant to fight are extremely likely to instantly kill it - the ZiS doesn't suffer from that problem. And considering that the ZiS-3 is significantly superior to the Raketenwerfer (even with the cloak buffs the Raketenwerfer has), Ambush cloak doesn't seem that bad a deal anymore.

The problem, as I wrote above, is that Ambush cloak comes on shitty commanders. It's on Mechanised Support Tactics and Combined Arms Army. Perhaps one of the other abilities has any actual usefulness to it, the rest is complete and utter wank, not worth the time Relic needed to create them. That's why you don't see it being used, not because the cloak itself is shit. Back when the ISU-152 was worthwhile, you'd regularly see people use Mechanised Support Tactics, because it had the glorious ISU in combination with Mark Target and a bombing run. That also meant you'd see loads of cloaked AT guns, because that became a viable strategy. Weirdly enough, all that stopped when the ISU was nerfed into oblivion... Hm, I wonder why that might be?

Shock Rifle (IS2) commander ?

russian AT is horrible to use, historical accurate DatSheffy