Relic Winter Balance Preview v1.1 Update

Give them snare then. And possibly better/cheaper grenades so they are occasionally used. They are not that good to be nerfed even more right now.

Good idea. Didn't think of that. That way I can finally merge both of my ideas, by giving them a 3rd upgrade containing a snare.

To sum up, it would look like this:
1. Only one bren for tommies available.
2. Healing upgrade time from 30 to 40 seconds allowing full heal.
3. Base artillery AoE increase.
4. 3rd upgrade for tommies - the snare, maybe also with ability to mine.

Actually I think in such situation they get a buff rather than a nerf, since double bren on vet3 IS is mostly just giving axis more lmgs. But I'm ok with it becouse the way their abilities are currently not doing their job to full potential is quite frustrating.

Good idea. Didn't think of that. That way I can finally merge both of my ideas, by giving them a 3rd upgrade containing a snare.

To sum up, it would look like this:
1. Only one bren for tommies available.
2. Healing upgrade time from 30 to 40 seconds allowing full heal.
3. Base artillery AoE increase.
4. 3rd upgrade for tommies - the snare, maybe also with ability to mine.

Actually I think in such situation they get a buff rather than a nerf, since double bren on vet3 IS is mostly just giving axis more lmgs. But I'm ok with it becouse the way their abilities are currently not doing their job to full potential is quite frustrating.

You say that IS should get either healing or snare ? Or I don´t understand your idea right.

I think giving AT snare into IS grenade upgrade will make it far more appealing

Banning the UC from command vehicle? I don't like this. Unlike all other command vehicles in the game (from what I know of) applying this ability to a unit makes it fire and move awfully slow, that's why people put it on a UC.

Putting it on a UKF tank would be a huge waste of a tank, OKW can at least still have a front line Panther, OST have a snub P4 that good VS AI and can stand a chance to get out of an engagement. UKF will near HAVE to go AEC to save popcap and costs which is limiting play by removing bofors as an option.

Can't you just increase the cost of the ability and make it cost 50+ fuel? That way you don't limit the entire roster of UKF by using that ability, forcing AEC tech.

That or remove the speed reduction that comes with the ability...

Banning the UC from command vehicle? I don't like this. Unlike all other command vehicles in the game (from what I know of) applying this ability to a unit makes it fire and move awfully slow, that's why people put it on a UC.

Putting it on a UKF tank would be a huge waste of a tank, OKW can at least still have a front line Panther, OST have a snub P4 that good VS AI and can stand a chance to get out of an engagement. UKF will near HAVE to go AEC to save popcap and costs which is limiting play by removing bofors as an option.

Can't you just increase the cost of the ability and make it cost 50+ fuel? That way you don't limit the entire roster of UKF by using that ability, forcing AEC tech.

That or remove the speed reduction that comes with the ability...

something for something, command veh gives great boost to units in the area, to all if im not mistaken, while command veh itself gets some worse, easier to kill, that's why UC was best choice cuz in late game its useless and can stay away from combat

You say that IS should get either healing or snare ? Or I don´t understand your idea right.

I think giving AT snare into IS grenade upgrade will make it far more appealing

I just think that giving snare to all base squads of all factions is as much of a boring construct as it is possible. The whole idea of having more than two factions is to change your strategy depending on the faction your opponent is using. Before OKW got their snare, it was clearly visible that you could use different strategies against okw and ostheer in early game. Now, when they both have it, your early game build against both of these factions won't ever differ too much, making meta even thinner than it was. The same will happen to axis strategies, if all allied factions will have access to snare on all of their basic infantry squads. That is why I belive there should be at least one faction on both sides that doesn't have access to snare unless using specific doctrine or visible munition upgrade.

Banning the UC from command vehicle? I don't like this. Unlike all other command vehicles in the game (from what I know of) applying this ability to a unit makes it fire and move awfully slow, that's why people put it on a UC.

Putting CV on UEC was incredibly cancerous - just sign and put bren deep in your base = free recon which means easy counter for sniper. That's the reason of nerfing this and I agree with relic on 100%. Idea was rather to create 1st line support vehicle (something like Churchill) for amazing bonuses in small area. Not the easy counter for snipers

I just think that giving snare to all base squads of all factions is as much of a boring construct as it is possible. The whole idea of having more than two factions is to change your strategy depending on the faction your opponent is using. Before OKW got their snare, it was clearly visible that you could use different strategies against okw and ostheer in early game. Now, when they both have it, your early game build against both of these factions won't ever differ too much, making meta even thinner than it was. The same will happen to axis strategies, if all allied factions will have access to snare on all of their basic infantry squads. That is why I belive there should be at least one faction on both sides that doesn't have access to snare unless using specific doctrine or visible munition upgrade.

So you say that factions should have core features to be different ?

Snare is core feature that gives player tool to punish overextending tanks apart from random mines. I think all factions deserve snare otherwise they have problem countering vehicles without getting vehicle on their own.

And yes british snare can cost 35 munnition like okw one, to make it less spammable

@Mr.Smith: I may not agree on many of those changes, but it is good to see you explaining them so thoroughly. Compared to how Relic acted like (even in their forum) this is a significant step forwards. Thank you.

Here lies the problem

I truly belive it can be done in 5 minutes by anyone at Relic's.

Snare for tommies would be horrible. They are the only inf in game with such small Received Accuracy, and when they are behind green cover, you need to flank them with tanks in order to force a retreat.


Giving them snares would neutralize their only counters, tanks.

Putting CV on UEC was incredibly cancerous - just sign and put bren deep in your base = free recon which means easy counter for sniper. That's the reason of nerfing this and I agree with relic on 100%. Idea was rather to create 1st line support vehicle (something like Churchill) for amazing bonuses in small area. Not the easy counter for snipers

They aren't nerfing it though, they are just limiting the vehicles it can go on and killing variety(no more bofors). People will just put an AEC their base if they wanted to. And that's harder to kill than a UC.

Hence my fuel cost suggestion, same punishment for losing it, more variety, easier to counter UC < all other vehicles

So you say that factions should have core features to be different ?

Snare is core feature that gives player tool to punish overextending tanks apart from random mines. I think all factions deserve snare otherwise they have problem countering vehicles without getting vehicle on their own.

And yes british snare can cost 35 munnition like okw one, to make it less spammable

Well, if it is a core feature is discussable, it was never aimed to be one, neither in coh1 nor in coh2. Even if it is going to be thought of as a core feature, to differ factions between each other, even the core features can be implemented in many different ways, like suppresion is right now for example. Some factions should have access to them early on, some later. Some can pay less, some more. At the very last, some can have them on basic, spammable squads, and some only on specialist squad or upgrade. The only thing that should differ a core feature is that is should be available to the player in every match if he wants to use it - so it shouldn't be locked inside a commander or inside an excluding tech upgrade. In that sense in current live version of the game the snare is not thought of as a core feature (locked in commander) just like light tank / armoured car is not (AEC locked in exclusive tech upgrade). With the change I proposed in last post the snare would become a core feature, just becouse you can build a unit that has it in every single game. It doesn't have to mean that it is common among all your squads.

Btw, 10 muni more expensive snare changes nothing, snare is more of a threat measure than a weapon. It's enough to have it on your squads to matter on the field, even if it is never used, it still creates a no-go zone for many vehicles.

I truly belive it can be done in 5 minutes by anyone at Relic's.

But all relic employees are working on DoW3 ...

Btw, 10 muni more expensive snare changes nothing, snare is more of a threat measure than a weapon. It's enough to have it on your squads to matter on the field, even if it is never used, it still creates a no-go zone for many vehicles.

I don´t know about what no go zone are you talking. If you are at least litlle competent you can kite infantry with snare forever.

Snare is there to stop recless vehicle pushes on weak targets EG base rape or AT guns, simply 1 AT cannot hold light tank on its own even if it faces right direction

I don´t know about what no go zone are you talking. If you are at least litlle competent you can kite infantry with snare forever.

Snare is there to stop recless vehicle pushes on weak targets EG base rape or AT guns, simply 1 AT cannot hold light tank on its own even if it faces right direction

I'm not talking about kiting. I'm talking about driving into the zone to kill something other than the infantry squad with a snare. If your snared troops are covering the whole area it is not possible. This creates a static situation where you have to slowly push and kite squads or wait for opponent to make a mistake. And this is completely fine, especially against factions like ostheer whose aim is to create such situation. But, in my opinion, it shouldn't be the only possible scenario in coh2 match. Different factions should play differently against each other. Thats about it.

Fix the Calliope, it still rapes

I'm not talking about kiting. I'm talking about driving into the zone to kill something other than the infantry squad with a snare. If your snared troops are covering the whole area it is not possible. This creates a static situation where you have to slowly push and kite squads or wait for opponent to make a mistake. And this is completely fine, especially against factions like ostheer whose aim is to create such situation. But, in my opinion, it shouldn't be the only possible scenario in coh2 match. Different factions should play differently against each other. Thats about it.

are we talking about same game ? For me 1v1 match looks completely different than you describe it and snare is there mostly for at gun coverage and last option to save squads from light vehicles

are we talking about same game ? For me 1v1 match looks completely different than you describe it and snare is there mostly for at gun coverage and last option to save squads from light vehicles

I think we are but it is possible that we perceive it differently. I'm more of an aggressive player. Still, what you say prooves that 10 muni difference changes nothing, everybody kites the squad just like he would with a 25 muni snare and still he gets engine damage every time he fails to do it.

I think we are but it is possible that we perceive it differently. I'm more of an aggressive player. Still, what you say prooves that 10 muni difference changes nothing, everybody kites the squad just like he would with a 25 muni snare and still he gets engine damage every time he fails to do it.

But engine damage is nothing if you can escape. Hovewer if you make more mistakes in row you should be punished

1st is getting snared
2nd is lacking any support aroun vehicle to protect it
3rd being near AT gun without knowing it or letting enemy get near your tank with infantry that have some kind of AT.


Only problem that can happen is IS with snare and PIAT. I think once they get snare, they should get locked piats

But engine damage is nothing if you can escape. Hovewer if you make more mistakes in row you should be punished

1st is getting snared
2nd is lacking any support aroun vehicle to protect it
3rd being near AT gun without knowing it or letting enemy get near your tank with infantry that have some kind of AT.


Only problem that can happen is IS with snare and PIAT. I think once they get snare, they should get locked piats

You sure can escape, but you can't attack any further. And you loose quite a lot of precious time repairing and maintaining a damaged vehicle that did nothing.

Mind that I'm not saying that kiting or snares are bad. Just that having a faction that doesn't have to be kited so much would widen the meta.