Winter Balance Preview Changelog

okay, i tried to search for that, but missed it

Let the Partisan cheese continue

Reminder that this is a preview, and i hope this time, people end up playing it and giving feedback while in return Relic applies changes (the whole point of doing a PTR/preview)

Snip

UKF vs OKW is also a match up with sniper vs non sniper faction.

"When firing a shot or using an offensive ability when not camouflaged, the unit will be unable to return to camouflage for 10 seconds"
I do feel like this part is okay (no longer you can fire from out of cover and camouflage instantly)

"Snipers cannot cloak until out of combat for 3 seconds"
This part i'm not sure of. You'll get your first shot out of cammo but following ones not? Can someone explain how long combat status is applied in case you are not been fired?

If i understand it correctly, i don't think the 2nd nerf should apply. I still think there are camouflage issues with SU sniper and in case OKW is having problems against snipers, you can always improve the Kubels/Puma (?) detection and anti sniper capabilities.


Edit: comments regarding rest of changelog comming soon (still have to digest all of this).
PD: "No big balance patch coming soon" and this thread comes to flip the table

PD2:


The biggest shitstorm of this year

Great stuff but for the love of all that is holy please implement VP's and CP's no longer obstructing vehicle pathing!!! It's in Machine and Mirage's mods and it's the most important QoL change this game needs.

Reminder that this is a preview, and i hope this time, people end up playing it and giving feedback while in return Relic applies changes (the whole point of doing a PTR/preview)


UKF vs OKW is also a match up with sniper vs non sniper faction.

"When firing a shot or using an offensive ability when not camouflaged, the unit will be unable to return to camouflage for 10 seconds"
I do feel like this part is okay (no longer you can fire from out of cover and camouflage instantly)

"Snipers cannot cloak until out of combat for 3 seconds"
This part i'm not sure of. You'll get your first shot out of cammo but following ones not? Can someone explain how long combat status is applied in case you are not been fired?

If i understand it correctly, i don't think the 2nd nerf should apply. I still think there are camouflage issues with SU sniper and in case OKW is having problems against snipers, you can always improve the Kubels/Puma (?) detection and anti sniper capabilities.

You remain in-combat as long as somebody is firing at you. We realise that this seems a bit harsh, but that's the most extreme we wanted to go with the stealth mechanic. Since it's a preview mod, it makes sense to trial this.

3 seconds was chosen as a reasonable compromise, to also accommodate bolt-action infantry models to keep the sniper flagged.

Do note, though, that with the light vehicles getting nerfed, snipers would become even more dominant

On the other hand, this change could make Snipers ridiculously easy to dispose of with infiltration units.

Note that the Soviet sniper has the lowest revert time of all snipers (which affects how much time it takes for them to recloak after firing from camo). Soviet snipers: 4 seconds. Other snipers; 6 seconds.

The guaranteed 10-second penalty for firing from out-of-camo will make it so that the other snipers cannot cheese back into stealth instantly. This means that the revert time will actually hold some real weight in the game.

Let the Partisan cheese continue

Not enough people voted for this one. Our hands were tied.

Holy shit pioneers are actually not useless vs inf now.Big +1

You remain in-combat as long as somebody is firing at you. We realise that this seems a bit harsh, but that's the most extreme we wanted to go with the stealth mechanic. Since it's a preview mod, it makes sense to trial this.

Do note, though, that with the light vehicles getting nerfed, snipers would become even more dominant

On the other hand, this could make Snipers ridiculously easy to dispose of with infiltration units.



Not enough people voted for this one. Our hands were tied.

Are there any other changes that you wanted that didn't make it in?

I should also include that all of these changes have been tested internally with high level players in 1v1. It's of course always hard to tell in small sample sizes which is why launching it public is necessary, but from what we have played we are happy with the severity of the changes, even when they seem extreme.

If you are going to play them mod. Please post replays for casting and so we can get objective impressions on how things are performing.

Can you say who are them ? To get feedback from them ?

Reminder that this is a preview, and i hope this time, people end up playing it and giving feedback while in return Relic applies changes (the whole point of doing a PTR/preview)


UKF vs OKW is also a match up with sniper vs non sniper faction.

ukf/soviet vs okw is the one thing: ukf sniper is so slow, so slow, its not as effective as lets say ostheer sniper in the game. so, when basic build for okw in 1v1-2v2 is 3-5 volks, you can simply overrun ukf sniper, and ESPECIALLY now after this camourflage is really fucked. Also soviet sniper gets melted by infantry fast. So the real reason for this nerf is ostheer sniper. Everything else is pretty much BS. Now, you can also see 30 fuel increased on 222, and mp nerf on m20 into 240. So, here, creators of this decision are CLEARLY trying to make USF war against ostheer sniper, no doubt. Okay, i find m20 buff cool, can maybe get 1 rifle more before building that, but on all this, the camourflage change. This is like way too much. Its strange that everytime we get these balance patches, always the biggest problem is TOO MUCH. When its nerfed into ground, when its buffed into rediculous limits. Why cant you just make either of these changes ? I dont get it, i really dont. But what ever

Show Spoiler

Can you say who are them ? To get feedback from them ?

Big thanks to Findeed, Talisman, SturmPanther, Kpen and Zarok for internal testing to help us smooth it out to where it is now.

Commando duration has a limited duration, and the passive sprint can sometimes work against you (since Commandos can't fire while sprinting).

To the last man is active all the time, passively. The only visual indication that you need for it is the number of models alive, and you already have it.

Is so difficult to add passive button on left bar, which say "this unit has 1 vet ability "To the last man", which give some bonuses for each dead vodel in the squad?
Please, add it! Other passive abilities (espeacially brits units) have passive button, which give information about them.

You remain in-combat as long as somebody is firing at you. We realise that this seems a bit harsh, but that's the most extreme we wanted to go with the stealth mechanic. Since it's a preview mod, it makes sense to trial this.

3 seconds was chosen as a reasonable compromise, to also accommodate bolt-action infantry models to keep the sniper flagged.

Do note, though, that with the light vehicles getting nerfed, snipers would become even more dominant

On the other hand, this change could make Snipers ridiculously easy to dispose of with infiltration units.

As the first part of my post says, i hope there are tweaks coming out of this preview and it's understandable to try this at first.

Regarding this, i don't think snipers would be as prevalent and a big of an issue. I think every faction with the exception of OKW has enough tools to deal with snipers (USF after getting a mortar + M20 change, specially paired with the 222 changes). OKW while not having the same tools as OH, it has a base 5 man model infantry against lower RoF snipers (SU not been quite as used). This is why i said Kubel/Puma (specially after losing aimed shot) could see it's detection/anti sniper capabilities further improved.
Not gonna desviate from this units for other solutions as it seems it's out of the scope of the current mod.

I think it's correct to nerf camo when firing and not using cover. Not sure about applying this while actually using cover to shoot.

snip

Check my response to Smith cause i think we are on the same boat although my posture is not as extreme.

reading it now but i just wanna say thanks to kyle, mr. smith, miragefla, GG and any other involved relicans .

Did any of the involved parties receive compensation for their contribution to the game?

They've at least received a notification in writing that they'll all inevitably get yelled at for the results of the patch not being perfect

They've at least received a notification in writing that they'll all inevitably get yelled at for the results of the patch not being perfect

The mods we've made earlier have prepared us for this

When are they officially going to implement these changes? I can finally play as Axis!!

Please give the Panzer IV some love, too. I also dont appreciate the changes made to the cloak mechanic in regards to püppchens. This will only further nerf the püppchen, which is not in a good position as of now. I like the changes made to the JP4 though. Please consider buffing up the armor on the Puma aswell, if you buff it on the AEC, otherwise this will be another powercreep to OKW. Thanks for your work.

Edit: Please also buff UP the healing rate of OKW Medics after making them pricey
Edit2: If you nerf the JP4 Cloak, it would be nice if a Hold Fire ability was added

I must say I like most of the changes. Especially the bugfixes. It's much better than I thought it's going to be. Keep up the good work guys.