Russians get the greatest AT & ARTY gun out of T1?
7 Jul 2013, 21:36 PM
#1
Posts: 65
The Russian AT gun is ridiculous. A tier 1 unit that has the ability to destroy vehicles AND kill any infantry, emplacements, and other AT guns is OP. Might as well put a motor on it and let it run around the field at high speed. A MAXIM with its infinite supply of crew members, a blisteringly fast reorientation speed and NO PACK UP TIME is all you need to support the BEST AT CRAWL IN THE GAME. Add SU-85s to that and its just a joke.
7 Jul 2013, 22:24 PM
#2
1 
Posts: 1006
The Russian AT gun is ridiculous. A tier 1 unit that has the ability to destroy vehicles AND kill any infantry, emplacements, and other AT guns is OP. Might as well put a motor on it and let it run around the field at high speed. A MAXIM with its infinite supply of crew members, a blisteringly fast reorientation speed and NO PACK UP TIME is all you need to support the BEST AT CRAWL IN THE GAME. Add SU-85s to that and its just a joke.
I think think the AT gun is op, the MG is though.
7 Jul 2013, 22:35 PM
#3
Posts: 419
I wouldn't mind it being so good, if the pak 40 wasn't an expensive, easy to kill not very useful piece of junk. Not only do they get an at crew with 6 men , that takes a long time to kill, they get insanely difficult to take out su 85s.
7 Jul 2013, 22:39 PM
#4
Posts: 176
I quite enjoyed stealing a Zis and artillery barraging two guards to death in two shells. SU-85s just need severely toning down, there like Fireflies on steroids. The main problem is they can fire due to there los boost and 60 range but no one can return fire.
Fyi Vet 2 SU-85 can TWO shot a Stug, so don't try that route.
Fyi Vet 2 SU-85 can TWO shot a Stug, so don't try that route.
7 Jul 2013, 23:06 PM
#5
Posts: 255
If you nerf the su-85 soviets will no viable counter to the Panther/tiger. AT guns are good vs medium tanks and lower but it rarely penetrates Panther's armour
7 Jul 2013, 23:12 PM
#6
Posts: 604
The problem isn't that the zis AT gun is too strong or versatile. The problem is that the pak is too weak and limited to a single purpose that it can't really fulfill because of its weakness.
Having an effective crew size of 2 vs. an effective crew size of 5 + artillery barrage simply isn't worth 360 MP despite the pak's faster reload time.
Having an effective crew size of 2 vs. an effective crew size of 5 + artillery barrage simply isn't worth 360 MP despite the pak's faster reload time.
7 Jul 2013, 23:25 PM
#7
Posts: 480
The PAK needs a buff, and I'd probably like to see the ZiS's normal shots be less likely to kill infantry. The barrage is expensive enough that I don't really mind but it's weird seeing a ZiS sniping approaching P-Grens quickly enough that they often have to retreat from one head-on.
7 Jul 2013, 23:29 PM
#8
Posts: 176
Fine Crells, make it so the SU-85 cannot provide it's own line of sight. Or at the very least make it a glass cannon with no armour but very high damage / penetration (Like it is now minus armour).
7 Jul 2013, 23:34 PM
#9
Posts: 60
AT guns suck for both factions. The barrage on the Zis is OK, but expensive. But the rate of fire is completely shit. Ostwind, flameHT and P4 can easily kill it within seconds while circling. Even from a forward approach, the Zis will get maybe ONE shot off before becoming flanked and useless.
Although the Soviets do have the advantage of being able to recrew with scripts. But by the time mid-late game comes around they will easily be decrewed by all the arty and pgren spam.
Although the Soviets do have the advantage of being able to recrew with scripts. But by the time mid-late game comes around they will easily be decrewed by all the arty and pgren spam.
7 Jul 2013, 23:35 PM
#10
Posts: 255
Being an assult gun makes it weaker than a panther already, i think just removing its scope ability is fine, or mayb e replace its vet 1 ability with it, or make it a muni upgrade
7 Jul 2013, 23:43 PM
#11
Posts: 2425
Permanently Banned@ Marxist: No. Just, no.
7 Jul 2013, 23:55 PM
#12
Posts: 60
7 Jul 2013, 23:57 PM
#13
Posts: 60
I quite enjoyed stealing a Zis and artillery barraging two guards to death in two shells. SU-85s just need severely toning down, there like Fireflies on steroids. The main problem is they can fire due to there los boost and 60 range but no one can return fire.
Fyi Vet 2 SU-85 can TWO shot a Stug, so don't try that route.
Shreks melt 85s. Which the soviets have no equivalent.
If you're charging head-on into 85 you just have terrible micro. Learn to flank something with no turret. Or try smoke.
8 Jul 2013, 00:01 AM
#14
Posts: 63
Shreks melt 85s. Which the soviets have no equivalent.
If you're charging head-on into 85 you just have terrible micro. Learn to flank something with no turret. Or try smoke.
That is true when you hit rear armor. Any other time you're just getting kitted. I think its accuracy or aoe needs to be severely reduced vs infantry.
8 Jul 2013, 00:09 AM
#15
Posts: 176
Marxist, I'm going to assume your trolling. Do you think he's not going to see your shrecks and backpedal with the line of sight provided by the SU-85? And as for flanking he can just mine lay his flanks with the 100s of munitions Soviets stockpile.
8 Jul 2013, 00:27 AM
#16
Posts: 2425
Permanently Banned
8 Jul 2013, 01:41 AM
#17
Posts: 60
Marxist, I'm going to assume your trolling. Do you think he's not going to see your shrecks and backpedal with the line of sight provided by the SU-85? And as for flanking he can just mine lay his flanks with the 100s of munitions Soviets stockpile.
Again, why are you attacking head on? 85 has cone vision with LOS and less accuracy while moving. And no 'get out of jail free smoke card' to play either.
Lack of creativity is your problem, not the 85. Sorry that you can't just spam panthers to win anymore. But maybe try strafing run out? All the cool kids are doing it.
8 Jul 2013, 01:45 AM
#18
Posts: 60
8 Jul 2013, 02:19 AM
#19
Posts: 176
There is a total of two hard counters to the SU-85, Elephants and Pak 43's. It takes at LEAST 5 Shreck hits in order to kill one and as such will rarely happen if the opponent has a brain / can use reverse.
8 Jul 2013, 03:40 AM
#20
Posts: 67
I wouldn't mind it being so good, if the pak 40 wasn't an expensive, easy to kill not very useful piece of junk. Not only do they get an at crew with 6 men , that takes a long time to kill, they get insanely difficult to take out su 85s.
Shreks own su-85's all day
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