Sim City
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29 Feb 2016, 22:43 PM
#101
Posts: 16
Ultimately I believe what's going to happen is that they're going to release more commanders to offset this and give Osteer a V1 and OKW a Hummel and then call it even, to which we will then have a thread about how OP these 2 things are. That's the Relic way of doing things at least as of now...
1 Mar 2016, 01:16 AM
#102
Posts: 149
While mortar pit is an unique unit that is hard to balance because there is no similar unit on axis side, Bofors is a pretty straight mirror of Schwerer HQ. Both units lock down an area for infantry and light vehicles completely, in case of Schwerer some medium USF vehicles are affected too. So while having different stats and abilities (and you could discuss a lot about that) they fulfill the same role of area denial while both are not that easy to kill when supported correctly. Both are repeatetly used to lockdown important VPs or fuel points. Do be fair: If you want to address one you have to address both.
You can get your Bofors up earlier but this comes at a big disadvantage: While Schwerer HQ is your tech requirement for medium and heavy tanks, the bofors delays your tech to tanks. Use that to your advantage. Brits really need their tanks to fight enemy armor, inspite of having the best AT-Gun around. Their problem is that their infantry can't rely on a decent handheld AT-weapon like Shrek (Piat, cough...) or any kind of vehicle snare to slow axis armor down in front off 6pdr. You really can put pressure on a brit with Bofors by going for a fast tank tech.
So I still think, when something has to be changed, it is the mortar pit.
The problem is: there is not a disadvantage. Bofors cost only 30 fuel. You can spam 3 bofors without delay so much your tanks, need only one or two at guns near your simcity and tanks are stopped. Now there is a counter battery for indirect fire. So counter sim city is too long, and we must consider that probably while we are trying to take down bofors (covered by mortars) , fuel or vp are holded by them. So not a big problem for brits late game. Okw flak cost 120,a lot risky build that on aggressive position (the only problem is that everyone that lose tier 3 can go for kt anyway) and comes later. And it's only one. It seems not a big problem. Bofors spam is cheaper. 3 bofors 90 fuel + bofors fuel tech? Crazy. You lose one bofors? Np , build another one. There is no punishing for bofors spammers.
1 Mar 2016, 09:50 AM
#103
Posts: 7
If i wanted that kind of gameplay, I'd go play angry birds.
Maybe you should
then...
1 Mar 2016, 10:02 AM
#104
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
The problem is: there is not a disadvantage. Bofors cost only 30 fuel. You can spam 3 bofors without delay so much your tanks, need only one or two at guns near your simcity and tanks are stopped. Now there is a counter battery for indirect fire. So counter sim city is too long, and we must consider that probably while we are trying to take down bofors (covered by mortars) , fuel or vp are holded by them. So not a big problem for brits late game. Okw flak cost 120,a lot risky build that on aggressive position (the only problem is that everyone that lose tier 3 can go for kt anyway) and comes later. And it's only one. It seems not a big problem. Bofors spam is cheaper. 3 bofors 90 fuel + bofors fuel tech? Crazy. You lose one bofors? Np , build another one. There is no punishing for bofors spammers.
105 fuel doesn't delay tanks.
Remember this life lesson kids
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
1 Mar 2016, 11:39 AM
#105
Posts: 1216
Ironically, emplacements in this game are much easier to deal with in larger 4v4 maps, even if one side is trying to do a metropolis of an emplacement simcity. The more one side goes for emplacements, the more they risk letting the enemy sit back and arty them into oblivion before rolling in for the VP taking. More so when it's not everyone and the enemy can easily dogpile a specific area of emplacements.
I never liked how, for UKF, simicty is pretty much a practical conclusion due to how they are designed around the need for emplacements. It reminds me of how OKW worked in regards to volksblobs.
I never liked how, for UKF, simicty is pretty much a practical conclusion due to how they are designed around the need for emplacements. It reminds me of how OKW worked in regards to volksblobs.
1 Mar 2016, 12:50 PM
#106
Posts: 149
105 fuel doesn't delay tanks.
Remember this life lesson kids
"...so much" it's obvious that delay tanks, but with 3 bofors it supposed that you are holding the map. 1vs1 it's an heavy delay , but 2v2 4v4 i think bofors are too stronk for their cost.
1 Mar 2016, 16:35 PM
#107
Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1
I am also concerned about Brit SimCity. I find more and more I have to pick Jaeger armor against Brits to ensure I can deal with late game armor since mid game is basically a wash once the first mortar pit goes down. With 50 munition repair abilities and brace the Wehr struggles to deal damage fast enough to dislodge Brits. This does not mean they are balanced, it just means that gameplay is extremely static and boring.
Against OKW it feels a little more even, but even so having to get ISG's every game against Brits gets old fast.
The decision to build a commander around SimCity style gameplay only confirmed to me Relic is not serious about changing the nature of emplacements in the game.
Against OKW it feels a little more even, but even so having to get ISG's every game against Brits gets old fast.
The decision to build a commander around SimCity style gameplay only confirmed to me Relic is not serious about changing the nature of emplacements in the game.
1 Mar 2016, 16:42 PM
#108
Posts: 987
I am also concerned about Brit SimCity. I find more and more I have to pick Jaeger armor against Brits to ensure I can deal with late game armor since mid game is basically a wash once the first mortar pit goes down. With 50 munition repair abilities and brace the Wehr struggles to deal damage fast enough to dislodge Brits. This does not mean they are balanced, it just means that gameplay is extremely static and boring.
Against OKW it feels a little more even, but even so having to get ISG's every game against Brits gets old fast.
The decision to build a commander around SimCity style gameplay only confirmed to me Relic is not serious about changing the nature of emplacements in the game.
+1
Extremely static and boring. Why would anyone want this to stay in the game?
Why not give Brits different units/abilities which they need instead of static positions that promote boring gameplay?
Let's keep it constructive
1 Mar 2016, 17:13 PM
#109
2 
Posts: 1108
you guys haven't seen Hans stream yesterday, with his bofors spam 
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1 Mar 2016, 17:26 PM
#110
Posts: 149
you guys haven't seen Hans stream yesterday, with his bofors spam
I've seen.
really hard to counter. Repair repair repair.
1 Mar 2016, 17:54 PM
#111
Posts: 196
105 fuel doesn't delay tanks.
Remember this life lesson kids
Nope, because they are so obsessed with hating the emplacement, they forget it's short comings.
Let's also conveniently forget that you can bring down 400 mp worth of mortar pit with a lower MP investment. You never read this.
1 Mar 2016, 19:24 PM
#112
Posts: 1124
I am also concerned about Brit SimCity. I find more and more I have to pick Jaeger armor against Brits to ensure I can deal with late game armor since mid game is basically a wash once the first mortar pit goes down. With 50 munition repair abilities and brace the Wehr struggles to deal damage fast enough to dislodge Brits. This does not mean they are balanced, it just means that gameplay is extremely static and boring.
Against OKW it feels a little more even, but even so having to get ISG's every game against Brits gets old fast.
The decision to build a commander around SimCity style gameplay only confirmed to me Relic is not serious about changing the nature of emplacements in the game.
Thisssss rightttt hereeee..
1 Mar 2016, 19:42 PM
#113
Posts: 34
Thing is, if they are building 2-3 mortars they are SERIOUSLY lacking in map presence.
Why aren't you just capping the rest of the map and not putting your crew weapons inside the mortar range unless you have forced it to brace?
In 2v2 it works too good. Center of map is closed with 2-3 mortar pits + bofors and big AT gun. The other guy spams commets, enges and their new arty that wipes osts like crazy. Thats the new 2v2s every game atm.
1 Mar 2016, 19:54 PM
#114
Posts: 468
Thisssss rightttt hereeee..
But that's what it's been like since WFA release. ISG med HQ, flak HQ every game.
Every new faction makes it more and more static as long as there are buildings on the field.
Think chronologically. Only "buildings" on the field were bunkers from OST.
Then came Ambient building HQs with SU commander
Then came bunkers "fighting position" for USF
And super HQs for OKW
Then emplacements and HQs for UKF
Next faction will revolve around just buildings and emplacements. There won't even be any units. Just click and deploy from the air.
Magick!
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1 Mar 2016, 22:30 PM
#115
Posts: 36
Brits sucked in COH1 because they were completely reliant on mediocre static positions.
Relic decided to make Brits mediocre again by making them once again reliant on static positions. On the bright side, the emplacements are few in this game and actually do their job well (except for the 17-pounder AT gun).
You can whine about how 'boring' it is to play against Brits, but OKW came first and they are far more cancerous as a faction than UKF ever will be. Not only do they sim city with their tech buildings, they also spam mainline infantry with extremely potent handheld AT weaponry that no other faction can match. UKF doesn't even have a non-doctrinal vehicle snare barring the occasional vet 1 sniper who hasn't perished randomly to the blob.
It's far too late to redesign UKF so get used to putting up with emplacements since the faction's early and mid-game were essentially gutted to make room for them.
Relic decided to make Brits mediocre again by making them once again reliant on static positions. On the bright side, the emplacements are few in this game and actually do their job well (except for the 17-pounder AT gun).
You can whine about how 'boring' it is to play against Brits, but OKW came first and they are far more cancerous as a faction than UKF ever will be. Not only do they sim city with their tech buildings, they also spam mainline infantry with extremely potent handheld AT weaponry that no other faction can match. UKF doesn't even have a non-doctrinal vehicle snare barring the occasional vet 1 sniper who hasn't perished randomly to the blob.
It's far too late to redesign UKF so get used to putting up with emplacements since the faction's early and mid-game were essentially gutted to make room for them.
1 Mar 2016, 22:57 PM
#116
Posts: 851 | Subs: 1
"...so much" it's obvious that delay tanks, but with 3 bofors it supposed that you are holding the map. 1vs1 it's an heavy delay , but 2v2 4v4 i think bofors are too stronk for their cost.
This.
1000 x this
1 Mar 2016, 23:17 PM
#117
Posts: 919
It's far too late to redesign UKF so get used to putting up with emplacements since the faction's early and mid-game were essentially gutted to make room for them.
Yes, Imo you are right. All discussion won't change a bit. They never removed a non-doctrinal unit before, so mortar pit and bofors will stay. They can't nerf it without kicking brits out of the game, so it basically comes down to the decission if you want to play this game or not. Although playing 3vs3 and 4vs4 a lot by myself, this modes will never be balanced. Think alone about FRPs ruining the infantry combat in every 4vs4, they will never adress this either.
Edit: One more point. Because of the much higher ressource income in 4vs4 CP dependend units come much later in comparison to teching, making many units useless because their timing sucks. A problem thats not adressed for many years too.
2 Mar 2016, 01:58 AM
#118
Posts: 320
I don't get it, Axis is complaining that brit simcity makes the game boring, that they have to dedicate their time to dislodge them at all costs.
I mean, that's how it's been with fucking allies against OKW since fucking release. With MG's, AT guns, Mortars reinforcing from a static position(Talking OKW with Ostheer). Don't forget the Flak HQ shooting down planes and locking down territory. With the only artillery units to dislodge it for USF and UKF being commanders(yay pay to not deal with that crap). All the while Wermacht armies have units in their structures they can build to dislodge UKF.
UKF has a ridiculously weak early game, so they turtle an area and you bombard the crap out of them and take the map. OKW has a ridiculously good early game that they can then place trucks on the front lines to provide further pressure. If you are going to complain about simcity, complain about ALL SIMCITY'S.
I mean, that's how it's been with fucking allies against OKW since fucking release. With MG's, AT guns, Mortars reinforcing from a static position(Talking OKW with Ostheer). Don't forget the Flak HQ shooting down planes and locking down territory. With the only artillery units to dislodge it for USF and UKF being commanders(yay pay to not deal with that crap). All the while Wermacht armies have units in their structures they can build to dislodge UKF.
UKF has a ridiculously weak early game, so they turtle an area and you bombard the crap out of them and take the map. OKW has a ridiculously good early game that they can then place trucks on the front lines to provide further pressure. If you are going to complain about simcity, complain about ALL SIMCITY'S.
2 Mar 2016, 02:16 AM
#119
Posts: 1124
I don't get it, Axis is complaining that brit simcity makes the game boring, that they have to dedicate their time to dislodge them at all costs.
I mean, that's how it's been with fucking allies against OKW since fucking release. With MG's, AT guns, Mortars reinforcing from a static position(Talking OKW with Ostheer). Don't forget the Flak HQ shooting down planes and locking down territory. With the only artillery units to dislodge it for USF and UKF being commanders(yay pay to not deal with that crap). All the while Wermacht armies have units in their structures they can build to dislodge UKF.
UKF has a ridiculously weak early game, so they turtle an area and you bombard the crap out of them and take the map. OKW has a ridiculously good early game that they can then place trucks on the front lines to provide further pressure. If you are going to complain about simcity, complain about ALL SIMCITY'S.
OKW sim city doesnt happen in the first 5 min of the game
OKW sim city doesnt self repair all buildings with a simple click
OKW sim city doesnt have a brace ability that makes all attacks virtually pointless
OKW sim city doesnt vet up to have range that covers most of some maps (motor pits)
OKW trucks on the frontline often results in losing a truck therefore losing a tier.. no i dont think this is true for 2 of the 3 trucks, not to mention 2 of the 3 trucks do not provide offensive firepower
OKW can only build 1 of each building, not 2-3 motor pits, not 2 bofers and such.. i dont see any reason why an OKW player will build tier 3 (rep building) anywhere near the frontline
MG bunkers? lol no one complains about those...
try again son
2 Mar 2016, 02:32 AM
#120
Posts: 851 | Subs: 1
If you are going to complain about simcity, complain about ALL SIMCITY'S.
Good point.
See the dude's post below.
Basically sucks, because you're forced to choose an arty commander to dislodge said sim city.
That and bofors spam is getting a bit out of hand.
OKW sim city points
Plus One
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