USF Rangers

3cp at the earliest imo.

One useful approach might be to look at what Rangers are "famous for" in WW2, and build abilities on that theme. I can't find much info, but one page I just found mentions surprise night attacks and living off the land. From that it's possible to suggest things like camouflage in cover, and healing when out of combat.

(I'm not gonna propose prices and CP's etc. as I will leave that to people who know better)

One useful approach might be to look at what Rangers are "famous for" in WW2, and build abilities on that theme. I can't find much info, but one page I just found mentions surprise night attacks and living off the land. From that it's possible to suggest things like camouflage in cover, and healing when out of combat.

I definitely don't want them to be another ol' 1337 pewpewpewers.

Personally, I think faster decapping ability would be an interesting trait for "light infantry" sort of units. No infantry unit has something like that yet, which I feel is a bit of a missed opportunity.

WutFace, I thought Sturmpio's did more damage then shocks at medium range. When they stand still they do great burst damage.

They really don't. It's negligible at best. Besides, Shocks have a lot of armor, they can shrug it off.

The maximum damage dealing range is set at the maximum distance of 3, when it used to be like 8 or something like that.

Shocktroops with the PPSh, M3 Grease Guns, and Thompsons were adjusted to have a max damage dealing distance set at 10.

Essentially, Relic made it so that units armed with SMG's would be in max damage dealing range at a greater distance than what Sturmpioneers armed with Assault Rifles could reach.

So Sturmpioneers are effectively stuck in doing perpetually minimum to moderate damage because their max damage dealing range is punching distance of 3. They are literally outranged by SMG's. It's kinda sad and kinda funny at the same time.

They really don't. It's negligible at best. Besides, Shocks have a lot of armor, they can shrug it off.

The maximum damage dealing range is set at the maximum distance of 3, when it used to be like 8 or something like that.

Shocktroops with the PPSh, M3 Grease Guns, and Thompsons were adjusted to have a max damage dealing distance set at 10.

Essentially, Relic made it so that units armed with SMG's would be in max damage dealing range at a greater distance than what Sturmpioneers armed with Assault Rifles could reach.

So Sturmpioneers are effectively stuck in doing perpetually minimum to moderate damage because their max damage dealing range is punching distance of 3. They are literally outranged by SMG's. It's kinda sad and kinda funny at the same time.

Why di you consider only range of 10? It's not like we have only 10 range in game. SP outclass them at mid range.

For example 20 range. 19>6>4. I prefer unit with lower DPS at close range but with linear damage so unit is useful at all ranges over hug-range units. They are more universal.

Why di you consider only range of 10? It's not like we have only 10 range in game. SP outclass them at mid range.

For example 20 range. 19>6>4. I prefer unit with lower DPS at close range but with linear damage so unit is useful at all ranges over hug-range units. They are more universal.

Because Sturmpioneers are outfitted with Assault rifles and it makes no sense that their maximum damage dealing range is 3 times shorter than the average SMG's maximum damage dealing range.

Also as I said, their mid and far range damages are negligible and easily shrugged off by almost all units, especially shocktroops with their armor stat.

It may be due to the fact that SMGs are very good at their intended range, but drop-off considerably versus Assault Rifles? Why should the STG 44 have every advantage in the game over SMGs when it already deals at least decent DPS past 10m? You probably don't remember the time where Shock SMGs were essentially melee weapons, though, a short period after WFA was released. Shock SMGs currently only deal 4 more DPS at 10m than a Sturmpioneer AR but drops over by 3 for every single in-game meter.

Balance/gameplay > Realism

Back onto Rangers, and what some have suggested it would be interesting if they could capture faster, but what about maybe making them move slightly faster than basic infantry? Give them M1 Garands that are better at long-range, but worse at short versus those of a Rifleman and you'd have an interesting skirmisher unit. Camouflage stock or part of vet would make them pretty unique troops. We actually don't have any infantry that is really got at hit-and-run aside from Shrecks firing and then backpedaling from tanks and Jeagar Light Infantry.

They really don't. It's negligible at best. Besides, Shocks have a lot of armor, they can shrug it off.

I'm going to have to disagree that 4.26 times as much damage at range 16 is a difference not worth noting.

Back onto Rangers, and what some have suggested it would be interesting if they could capture faster, but what about maybe making them move slightly faster than basic infantry? Give them M1 Garands that are better at long-range, but worse at short versus those of a Rifleman and you'd have an interesting skirmisher unit. Camouflage stock or part of vet would make them pretty unique troops. We actually don't have any infantry that is really got at hit-and-run aside from Shrecks firing and then backpedaling from tanks and Jeagar Light Infantry.

That also struck me as a neat idea, but I'd imagine it'd be more likely Relic would just give them out-of-combat sprint if they were thinking about making them generally move faster in any way. I'd imagine there's a very good reason for making literally ever infantry unit exactly the same speed outside of abilities throughout the series - probably to not make any particular infantry unit not automatically screw over AT guns that can't retreat.

This is my 2 cents on how rangers should be implemented:

2CP Rangers 380MP: 5 man squad with 15% received accuracy buff. They have sprint, cooked grenades. They are all armed with Garands. Unit has unique option to pick up to 3 weapons instead of the normal 2. Vet 1 bonus is sticky bombs - AT 'grenade' that does little damage but higher potential for more severe snares.
2CP Thompson SMG: Adds Thompson to weapon rack 1x for 30MU OR 2x thopmsons cost 60 MU and only take up 1 weapon slot. In that case Rangers would only have 2 weapon slots available.

Bad idea, Rangers would be just Veteran Riflemen 2.0, and Weapon Racks make every other infantry clone Shocks. Not to mention both unlock at the same time. And for 30 munitions each? lol get real.

I do think the passive sprint idea would be nice, but I'd think it might be too powerful if it was a vet0 thing, maybe a vet1 unlock?

How about M1 carbines that work in a similar way to the G43s the Axis have? I do love the sound of those...

M1 carbines, plus 2 weapon slots, ability to camouflage, and possibly some kind of other specialist ability (demo charge/trap anyone!?) would make quite a nice elite unit for the USF.

I am enjoying this idea of Rangers becoming a behind the lines type of unit. It would be a interesting layer to USF as the only unit that is similar are Paratroopers. This should be reflected in their stats like maybe Falls. High damage but fragile unit that relies on a camo to ambush enemies to reduce damage taken. Forcing them to avoid direct combat (4-man squad? Low recieved accuracy?). Thompsons would be a delightful to have but regardless they could move slightly faster as to ambush one unit before pulling back and waiting for their next target. This could be countered with veterancy benefiting around this concept. Healing out of combat, quicker cool down of abilities out of combat, etc. Maybe even throw in slightly higher decap or cap rate. Of course weakness as mention above would be lake of durability and anti-tank options.

By giving Paras both the options of going either close or long range oriented they kind of eliminated the need of having any other elite infantry; thing is it forces you to go airborne if you want your infantry not to suck ass late game (sorry Rifle's vet bonus is meh).

I would love seeing them as a middle ground between rifles and paras and available with the Major tier building. 5-6 man squad; garands,sprint and focus fire would do the trick.

Just make Rangers anti-everything infantry.

Just make Rangers anti-everything infantry.

And make them all resemble Chuck Norris.

That is what we want to avoid with Rangers, basically becoming Riflemen 2.0. Every unit should have its place and be effective, not entirely replacing another unit. Case and point was Dawn of War Dark Crusade where Imperial Guardsmen were replaced by Kasrkin late game as they could do anything Guardsmen could do but much more effectively.

Don't see how CP 3 Rangers having 3 thompsons and two zooks would make them Riflemen 2.0.

400 MP, 5 men (45 reinforce) with received ac comparable to Pzgrens.

Has cooked frag grenade, Fire Up!, and vet 1 sticky bomb.

Very expensive shock unit with a clear CQC anti-everything role.

Don't see how CP 3 Rangers having 3 thompsons and two zooks would make them Riflemen 2.0.

400 MP, 5 men (45 reinforce) with received ac comparable to Pzgrens.

Has cooked frag grenade, Fire Up!, and vet 1 sticky bomb.

Very expensive shock unit with a clear CQC anti-everything role.

Like it! Was thinking in the same direction. Especially the fire up!/Oooraaah-like ability gives them a genuine characteristic and helps US with fighting MGs. It'll be fun if they could get bangalores to blow up emplacements and stuff

What are the Rangers in Ardennes Assault like? Havent played that yet.

Don't see how CP 3 Rangers having 3 thompsons and two zooks would make them Riflemen 2.0.

400 MP, 5 men (45 reinforce) with received ac comparable to Pzgrens.

Has cooked frag grenade, Fire Up!, and vet 1 sticky bomb.

Very expensive shock unit with a clear CQC anti-everything role.

I was personally quite happy with Fire Up!'s removal in 2. The suppression changes made for the second game were clearly made to make HMGs more usable later in the game, and I'd favour Fire Up! not returning to keep things that way.

I would like fireup, but I think they should get a small received acc penalty while active. You know, break suppression at the cost of taking more damage. So you can only use it in situations vs mgs with little support or when ur caught at the edge of an arc and avoid damage.

Not so good where you can blast through and mg and be completely fine.

If Rangers had Fire Up it should be like Oraah! Sprinting but no suppression resistance. I could maybe see Fire Up getting better with veterancy as they hit Vet 2 they receive less suppression from other units or something along those lines. (Not saying it should but again something around that) Seeing Rangers as a shock unit could work but I wish it be more interesting than a anti-everything squad. (Not really with Bazookas being soft counters to medium tanks and up) I mean LT is practically the same as Rangers with the exception of bazooka and sticky bomb. (LT with Thompson and 2 BARs is scary anti-infantry not to mention the two received accuracy bonuses LT gets with Veterancy) However, seeing UKF with Commandos being a behind enemy line units, I doubt Rangers will be like that now.