A Molotov problem or...?
3 Jul 2015, 11:46 AM
#21
Posts: 656
Relic should just give conscripts molotov at vet 1 instead of trip wire flares and then replace the molotov tech with grenade tech. That way at vet 1 conscripts get a useful anti-garrison and cover denial ability while buying the 125MP/25fU upgrade actually gives conscripts a useful grenade ability.
3 Jul 2015, 12:03 PM
#22
Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1
Relic should just give conscripts molotov at vet 1 instead of trip wire flares and then replace the molotov tech with grenade tech. That way at vet 1 conscripts get a useful anti-garrison and cover denial ability while buying the 125MP/25fU upgrade actually gives conscripts a useful grenade ability.
Actually an interesting idea. Not sure how this would balance out, but is interesting. Side note, would shocks/guards get molotovs at vet 1 instead of trip wire flares?
3 Jul 2015, 12:19 PM
#23
Posts: 656
Actually an interesting idea. Not sure how this would balance out, but is interesting. Side note, would shocks/guards get molotovs at vet 1 instead of trip wire flares?
It would certainly be an option to give shocks/guards molotovs at vet1 instead of trip-wire flares. Pretty much anything is better than that ability.
3 Jul 2015, 13:30 PM
#24
4 Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1
Relic should just give conscripts molotov at vet 1 instead of trip wire flares and then replace the molotov tech with grenade tech. That way at vet 1 conscripts get a useful anti-garrison and cover denial ability while buying the 125MP/25fU upgrade actually gives conscripts a useful grenade ability.
Cool idea, but I rather like tripwire flares
Maybe let molotovs be like regular grenades, but only deal flat 40 dmg with a flame aftereffect that deals same damage as now?
3 Jul 2015, 13:47 PM
#25
Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7
I have idea that will taste to both of you.
Give cons grenades - something weaker than shocks grenade but it will cost only 20 muny.
All grenades will need to be researched in HQ for 200 mp 25 fuel (almost same as USA get)
Combat enginners will remain old tripwire flares.
Combat infantry (cons , shocks , guards) will get molotov in vet 1
Partisans (not at ones just those basic) and irregulars will get molotov at level 0 and get tripwire flares at level 1 veterancy
Both of them don´t get grenade.
I think this would make cons more useful + russia will still be able to build tripwires
Give cons grenades - something weaker than shocks grenade but it will cost only 20 muny.
All grenades will need to be researched in HQ for 200 mp 25 fuel (almost same as USA get)
Combat enginners will remain old tripwire flares.
Combat infantry (cons , shocks , guards) will get molotov in vet 1
Partisans (not at ones just those basic) and irregulars will get molotov at level 0 and get tripwire flares at level 1 veterancy
Both of them don´t get grenade.
I think this would make cons more useful + russia will still be able to build tripwires
3 Jul 2015, 15:34 PM
#26
Posts: 600
a "grenade" with the longest and most obvious animation that costs 125mp/25fuel to research and 15muni to throw is "dirt cheap"
How much do assault grenades cost again?
Assault nades are not what this topic is about.
But 15 ammo is pretty cheap for a faction that is usually floating munitions, really useful early game for displacing units and keeping your enemy on their toes in firefights (dislodging squads from cover ect).
3 Jul 2015, 15:52 PM
#27
Posts: 205
Can anyone confirm they've actually nerfed molotovs?
They were already average as hell.
They were already average as hell.
3 Jul 2015, 16:14 PM
#28
Posts: 824
Assault nades are not what this topic is about.
But 15 ammo is pretty cheap for a faction that is usually floating munitions, really useful early game for displacing units and keeping your enemy on their toes in firefights (dislodging squads from cover ect).
The problem is you still have to pay to unlock them and the damage they deal now is pathetic and not even worth 15 munis, add on top of that the reworking of tank snares and conscripts have become not worth the trouble. I have noticed more and more players going maxim or sniper spam, due to cons being so meh.
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3 Jul 2015, 16:23 PM
#29
Posts: 354
Can anyone confirm they've actually nerfed molotovs?
I had some tests in cheatmod, with 10 squads - 0 crits against full health, so its seems like that (or I was really unlucky), all flame based weapons were reworked.
3 Jul 2015, 16:48 PM
#30
Posts: 1355
Relic should just give conscripts molotov at vet 1 instead of trip wire flares and then replace the molotov tech with grenade tech. That way at vet 1 conscripts get a useful anti-garrison and cover denial ability while buying the 125MP/25fU upgrade actually gives conscripts a useful grenade ability.
I think Molotovs and Grenades is to much. I like the idea with the Vet 1 Molos but instead of granades tech i would say ppsh tech (but with higher cost). Leave the flares to combat engineers.
3 Jul 2015, 16:51 PM
#31
Posts: 176
Though I'm pretty sure alex will come here, preaching how molos are best nades in the game, will boast how he torches whole armies with them and will not provide a single example of the ones inside of his head.
Man, it is literally every thread with you lately, isn't it?
At this point you are just making yourself look like an idiot.
You don't understand. Alex literally ran over his parents in a Sturmtiger, then wiped all his siblings with one riflenade from beyond sight range.
On topic, I really hope they didn't nerf the molotovs, because that flame crit was the one thing that made them not-worthless. I used to throw them on squads two at a time an would even get wipes that way. Now I'll chuck like three molotovs into one building while the MG inside guns me down from within their flameproof jackets.
3 Jul 2015, 16:51 PM
#32
Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7
I think Molotovs and Grenades is to much. I like the idea with the Vet 1 Molos but instead of granades tech i would say ppsh tech (but with higher cost). Leave the flares to combat engineers.
And what will be having ppsh doctrines ? (i know thy suck but after this they´ll suck even more)
ppsh + ooorah isnt a combo that we want to see every game , also we dont want to see lennys consblobs with ppsh + later on t34/85s
Just my 2 cents
3 Jul 2015, 16:58 PM
#33
Posts: 1355
And what will be having ppsh doctrines ? (i know thy suck but after this they´ll suck even more)
ppsh + ooorah isnt a combo that we want to see every game , also we dont want to see lennys consblobs with ppsh + later on t34/85s
Just my 2 cents
We all know that the commanders need a revamp. And also, it would be a global upgrade which is another wish from the community. And you don't have to go every game ppsh, it would depend on the map and the commander choice!
3 Jul 2015, 17:14 PM
#34
Posts: 692
cons are better off drinking the booze and trying to forget how shitty their unit is
3 Jul 2015, 17:29 PM
#35
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
cons are better off drinking the booze and trying to forget how shitty their unit is
Cons in most respects outside the molotov are fine. They cheap, versatile, hard to wipe, and can easily remain useful late game with merge squad.
There are a couple of ways you could fix the molotov:
1. Thrown faster
2. Cause's tanks engines to overheat making them more useful in more situations
3. Block sight, smoke from them would obviously make it harder to see
4. Just be included in the AT grenade upgrade.
3 Jul 2015, 17:30 PM
#36
Posts: 525
On topic, I really hope they didn't nerf the molotovs, because that flame crit was the one thing that made them not-worthless. I used to throw them on squads two at a time an would even get wipes that way. Now I'll chuck like three molotovs into one building while the MG inside guns me down from within their flameproof jackets.
So true...other options besides mortars for MG's inside buildings ?
3 Jul 2015, 19:38 PM
#37
Posts: 2742
Flame is a specific damage type in CoH along with ballistics (tank shells) explosives (grenades/mortars/arty) and small arms.
Infantry entities used to have a small chance of instantly dying at even 100% health when they took any kind of flame damage. This is no longer the case.
I think because flame damage dealt small amounts of damage very rapidly (to simulate burning) it would create plenty of dicerolls that could at any moment result in instant death,. By requiring infantry to be already damaged to score those crits, the chances for sudden death is much harder to accomplish from flame damage alone.
Infantry entities used to have a small chance of instantly dying at even 100% health when they took any kind of flame damage. This is no longer the case.
I think because flame damage dealt small amounts of damage very rapidly (to simulate burning) it would create plenty of dicerolls that could at any moment result in instant death,. By requiring infantry to be already damaged to score those crits, the chances for sudden death is much harder to accomplish from flame damage alone.
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3 Jul 2015, 20:51 PM
#38
Posts: 156
Assault nades are not what this topic is about.
But 15 ammo is pretty cheap for a faction that is usually floating munitions, really useful early game for displacing units and keeping your enemy on their toes in firefights (dislodging squads from cover ect).
If any faction is floating munitions then the player is messing up. That is how RTS games work. Soviets don't float munitions.
3 Jul 2015, 20:58 PM
#39
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
If any faction is floating munitions then the player is messing up. That is how RTS games work. Soviets don't float munitions.
Soviet's just don't have as many mandatory upgrades as other factions do. Most Soviet munition dumps are just artillery and special abilities. For instance you don't need to pay for special weapons on your infantry and medics cost MP.
This doesn't justify molotovs being crap, but Soviets floatin' muni Is a Thing That Exists.
3 Jul 2015, 21:04 PM
#40
Posts: 156
Soviet's just don't have as many mandatory upgrades as other factions do. Most Soviet munition dumps are just artillery and special abilities. For instance you don't need to pay for special weapons on your infantry and medics cost MP.
This doesn't justify molotovs being crap, but Soviets floatin' muni Is a Thing That Exists.
Mines, Oorah to do the flanks the faction needs to do as Axis sits behind OP42s and LMGs, Mollies, Trip flares, flame throwers, DPs, .50 Kraut mower.
You need to get these things to keep your infantry in the game.
Also demo charges. There is never an excuse to float muni.
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