The imbalance between Allied and Axis Infantry Anti-tank

T-34/76 front plate: 45 mm/60° = 90 mm effective armour
Sherman M4A3 front plate: 51 mm/56° = 91,2 mm effective armour
PzKpfw IV Ausf. H front plate: 80 mm/9° = 81 mm effective armour

Relic logic:
T-34/76 front armour 150
Sherman front armour 160
PzKpfw IV front armour 180

No, not biased at all...

T-34/76 front plate: 45 mm/60° = 90 mm effective armour
Sherman M4A3 front plate: 51 mm/56° = 91,2 mm effective armour
PzKpfw IV Ausf. H front plate: 80 mm/9° = 81 mm effective armour

Relic logic:
T-34/76 front armour 150
Sherman front armour 160
PzKpfw IV front armour 180

No, not biased at all...

Krupp Steel is above all.

Meanwhile StuG III Ausf E front plate 50 mm in reality, 150 armour value in game.

Apparently Relic have no idea what slopped armor is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sloped_armour

"Sloped armour is armour that is neither in a vertical nor a horizontal position. Such "angled" armour is often mounted on tanks and other armoured fighting vehicles (AFVs). Sloping an armour plate makes it harder to penetrate for antitank-weapons, such as armour-piercing shells (kinetic energy penetrators) and rockets, if they take a more or less horizontal path to their target, as is often the case. The better protection is caused by three main effects."

I know it's only an arcade game not a simulator but in my opinion in CoH2 T-34s and Shermans are to fragile in comparision to PzIV + there is imbalance with AT infatry weapon.

Also I don't know if they changed it but grens Panzerfaust was autoctit for the engine while cons AT greanade had only a chance to damage the engine.

yeah plus there is no side armor so shooting the sides of a tnak sometimes registers as a front armor hit

No, not biased at all...

I think you should read description of soviet bulletins.

basically the t34/76 should be a little better lol

Slightly better armour, the Panzer IV Ausf. F2 and up had a better gun though, until the 85 models came out. After the Panzer IV Ausf. H and the T-34/85, it didn't matter so much and depended more on crew skill and who shot first.

My last words on the allied and axis tanks before going back to the main topic. The Panzer4 is a little bit more expensive than the T34 but is a lot better in he AT department and after the MG upgrade, does a lot better in the AI department. T34/76 is so blehhh. The main gun is so rng dependent.


ANyways back on the main topic. THe fact that VOlks get great vet bonuses and can carry schrecks is over the top. It is difficult to counter a mass of schreck volks with a balanced combined arms force. Unless you get a lucky mortar strike or have shock troopers, pushing back the schreck volk horde is going to be hard.

I wouldn't even call it combined arms, it's just a blob of Volks and Obers, that cannot be directly countered by tanks or infantry.

The only decent way to fix it would be huge penalties for blobbing, or remove Panzerschrecks from Volks.

I wouldn't even call it combined arms, it's just a blob of Volks and Obers, that cannot be directly countered by tanks or infantry.

The only decent way to fix it would be huge penalties for blobbing, or remove Panzerschrecks from Volks.

Im saying i am the user of combined arms. I have couple mgs, mrotars, and infantry, but those OKW death blobs run through me

Im saying i am the user of combined arms. I have couple mgs, mrotars, and infantry, but those OKW death blobs run through me

Oh I misunderstood what you meant. I agree though, obervolk blobs > combined arms. Your tanks get shredded by mass Panzerschrecks and your infantry get shreaded by mass rifles + Ober LMG's. The blob will inflict more losses on you than it takes before it's forced to retreat. And Thanks to 5 levels of veterancy, smashing a blob face-first into your defenses only makes them stronger, until finally it does break through.

IRL soviet tanks T-34 were better armoured, but still they were lost in huge numbers and Soviet won the war through pure determinition and manpower.

German were the best trained army of the time, but this is difficult to implement in a game.

German tanks also had good chance of detroying enemy tanks at a further range than allies tanks were efficient, also difficult to represent in the game.

German had a doctrine were lower officers had much to work with and initiatives were encouraged (not talking about hitler handcuffing his generals). Soviet forces were much more top-down, in early years of the war making it sluggish and inflexible.

Fact is that germans man per man very more efficient than the soviet forces.

Leadership etc is impossible to implement in the game, I mean the player is the commander, cant really gimp your ability to control soviet troops can we, Therefore the only way to show this and make the game more realistic is to make german forces stronger one to one.....

German tanks also has a reputation for being great and there is no denying that Tiger sounds impressive and the k/d ratios were at some point incredible, this reputation translates to other tanks to, I mean who want to play 5 t34 vs one panzer IV ?? If everything should be realistic

Since it cannot be modeled with American air power or soviet industry German units one for one should not be better. It should be asymmetrical to mean equal but different. If the German side gets stronger AT then USF should have better AI for example. I.e Rifemen to Ober level. But that wouldn't be fun. Right now OKW has everything just plain better then USF.

I think they should try to model soviet industry by commanders or upgrades giving wovietw cheaper units in the late game. And USF should have more commanderabilities representing airpower and artillery IMO.agree that OKW seem a bit strong, not really tanks, mostly vet volks with shreks discussed here, think toning down vetbonuses for volks would go a long way.

toning down vetbonuses for volks would go a long way

Exactly. Veterancy is a large part of the problem here. Actually, toning down vet bonuses for all units is the right way to do it, and would improve many things.

It would also help to even out the survivability edge heavy tanks have over medium tanks, making them much easier to accumulate veterancy on.

Sigh... OKW gets King Tigers and Jagdtigers, powerful tanks that are nearly impenetrable. To top that off... Axis get schreck PanzerGrenadiers and VOlks running at your tanks. THe game is fucking broken at 4v4 level.

T-34/76 front plate: 45 mm/60° = 90 mm effective armour
Sherman M4A3 front plate: 51 mm/56° = 91,2 mm effective armour
PzKpfw IV Ausf. H front plate: 80 mm/9° = 81 mm effective armour

Relic logic:
T-34/76 front armour 150
Sherman front armour 160
PzKpfw IV front armour 180

No, not biased at all...

It can be explained that the p4 75 kwk l/48 packed a lot more punch then the t-34 76 mm. for example the p4 j could penetrate the regular t-34 from 2000 meters. the t-34 need to get close to nearly 500 meters.

Exactly. Veterancy is a large part of the problem here. Actually, toning down vet bonuses for all units is the right way to do it, and would improve many things.

It would also help to even out the survivability edge heavy tanks have over medium tanks, making them much easier to accumulate veterancy on.

Volks vet is not an issue. even with vet they remain only a meatshield and vetted rifles will still defeat albeit slowly. and are people actually complaining about the heavy tanks? medium tanks do not have the durability of the heavies put they pack a lot more firepower and its easy to flank if you have 2 tanks instead of one.

Volks vet is not an issue. even with vet they remain only a meatshield and vetted rifles will still defeat albeit slowly. and are people actually complaining about the heavy tanks? medium tanks do not have the durability of the heavies put they pack a lot more firepower and its easy to flank if you have 2 tanks instead of one.

i think it is because the midgame doesn't last too long, and late game usually comes quick with the hold for call-ins type meta. There was a really good topic about the discrepancy between mediums and heavies a coupe pages back. Basically heavy tanks are superior to mediums in every single way. Getting an equal investment with medium tanks still put you at a disadvantage versus heavy tnak of similar resource value.

And are people actually complaining about the heavy tanks? medium tanks do not have the durability of the heavies put they pack a lot more firepower and its easy to flank if you have 2 tanks instead of one.

Am I reading this right? Did you just try to say medium tanks have more firepower than heavy tanks? The only heavy tank lacking firepower is the KV-1, and the KV-8 if we're talking AT ability, though it's #1 if we're talking about AI ability.