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Opinion on recent responds Relic made regarding War Spoil

14 Jul 2014, 23:38 PM
#1
avatar of Sir Buttsmith

Posts: 13

Noun and Cynthia both just replied to one of the popular topic on official COH2 forum regarding War Spoils. The topic has gone over 13 pages and more than 150 replies in the past week, and finally some official replies from Relic.
Link:
http://community.companyofheroes.com/forum/company-of-heroes-2/company-of-heroes-2-general-discussion/69861-the-war-spoils-system-what-do-you-think-of-it-and-how-could-it-be-improved/page12

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Cynthia_RE Developer July 14th, 02:57 PM
Hi folks, I just wanted to take a moment to step in and let you all know that we are reading this, and paying attention. This feedback is being passed along to our developer team, so thank you to everyone that has taken the time to voice their concerns.

It seems that some people have registered specifically to discuss this issue, and we recognize that - thank you for your efforts in this.


Noun Relic Community Manager July 14th, 03:06 PM
Just for clarification the War Spoils system is working as intended. We realize that many people have had a negative reaction to it, and we're looking at a lot of different ways that we can tweak, tune and improve the system.

As Cynthia said we definitely appreciate the feedback.

However prior to the system there was no way for players to receive free content based on their playtime, and there was only the option of buying content. While some people certainly prefer simply buying content, not everyone does and we've given out thousands of items to players who would not have normally had access to them before the system.

It's not perfect and we're working on improving it, and listening to your feedback, but I do feel that it's a step in a good direction where we're giving fans new content without reaching for their wallets at the same time.

Thank you all again for your feedback and your patience.


-------------------------------------------------------
I personally am quite disappointed by these replies, as for me it seems that Relic is strongly positive with the current War Spoil system, as it is currently "working as intended". This could mean that the duplication issue most of us hate is just an intended feature of the new system in order to make sure players do not get the content they want very fast.

I am also quite confused by Noun saying " While some people certainly prefer simply buying content, not everyone does " to argue that the current system is better than the previous one. For me war spoil is just like the previous system, pleasing a portion of the player base and left the other portion disappointed. The only difference is that now the player base being pleased is switched, so those who prefer grinding than purchasing is currently pleased while previously those who prefer purchasing was happy.

For me the solution to this mess is quite simple, why not have both? With the current war spoil system plus the WFA content in steam store, both side can get what they want. After all, time is just another currency. However, from what Noun said, I feel that Relic is strongly against the idea of putting anything on sale at this moment, possibly trying to counter the rumor of "pay to win" haunting this game. While this war spoil system could potentially do that, it could introduce the all new "luck to win" rumor in my opinion, so I do not get it. Also the reason why those Wehr and Soviet DLC are still on store for sale is beyond my understanding.
14 Jul 2014, 23:51 PM
#2
avatar of Dullahan

Posts: 1384

Eh, blame the people who whined about the game being pay2win.

Relic should never had added fucking bulletins in the first place. They knew enough to make them utterly insignificant for the sake of balance atleast.

I'd be happier if I had the option of purchasing the commanders. No reason the two systems can't coexist.
14 Jul 2014, 23:58 PM
#3
avatar of Ohme
Honorary Member Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 889 | Subs: 1

An economy system would have been much better. Play games, earn points, spend points. Be happy.
14 Jul 2014, 23:59 PM
#4
avatar of WiFiDi
Honorary Member Badge

Posts: 3293

in a spoils system its good to have duplicates with different rarities for collect-ability but right now there is no way to craft duplicates into something better. duplicates and random drops imo are an important part of this system otherwise it would be an unlock system which tbh iw would have preferred ala cod style. but relic wants to do this system and duplicates are very necessary otherwise you run out of unlocks.

from there statements it sounds like the idea wasn't even fully thoughtout when they implemented it. it feels that way tbh but its a way to get items free which is a good thing expeically with all the dlc they have but it seems like a half baked idea that isn't finished yet hopefully they finsih the system soon.

somtimes i wonder...
15 Jul 2014, 00:02 AM
#5
avatar of This isn't taken

Posts: 79

Make sure you post in the thread to let them know your concerns.

I totally agree with you. They do need to clarify exactly why duplications of commanders/skins/strikes/faceplates are happening, not least because they are causing a large amount of frustration universally within the community.

If they really worried about costs they could just place all the commanders/skins/strikes/faceplates on the steam store for free and let people download the ones they want.
They did that with the commanders from the 'Make War' competition, so we know it's possible.
15 Jul 2014, 00:05 AM
#6
avatar of RightNow0815

Posts: 31

I think there are two viable options:

a) merge the pay2win and farm2win systems together - PROFIT.

b) leave the war spoil system unaffected, except the improvement that you get ONE GUARANTEED LOOT-ITEM for every win and the same for every second defeat.
15 Jul 2014, 00:15 AM
#7
avatar of Vulture

Posts: 32

I don't want to "craft loot," I don't want to "grind for legendary drops," and I don't want to buy commanders.

Here is what I want: I pay $60 ($80 now with this expansion) and I receive all of the content that I paid for immediately.

This drop system is the most half assed attempt at artificial longevity I have ever seen implemented into a game.

It is amazing that even 1 person at Relic thought this drop system was a good idea or would be well received by the community.
15 Jul 2014, 00:17 AM
#8
avatar of van Voort
Honorary Member Badge

Posts: 3552 | Subs: 2

I think I would do this:


You can get one copy of every bulletin under the old system
Link to achievements, you have to do a certain thing a certain number of time to unlock


Everything else comes from drop, but they need to do one of a few things:

1) Arrange it so you cannot recieve duplicates you cannot use (Skins, Commanders, Strikes, Faceplates more than 3 bulletins)

2) Allow a trading mechanic

3) Give you a choice of what you get


The problem with 2 and 3 is that Commanders are so much better than everything else they probably basically going to be the only thing that anyone wants, a trade in commanders would probably only be for other commanders.

If you have choice of unlock, but base the cost in XP on how popular the choice is, Commanders would rapidly become very expensive


I would probably also base it on XP and level not time, not least because that stops AFK farming.
15 Jul 2014, 00:18 AM
#9
avatar of This isn't taken

Posts: 79

As someone else has said, the proposed points system is HUGELY better than the current system, and would fix all the problems.

If the community could all agree to that and collectively ask for it, instead of just offering to literally throw their money at the problem, then I think that would be a huge step in the right direction.
15 Jul 2014, 00:22 AM
#10
avatar of Stonethecrow01

Posts: 379

I don't see much to take issue with there. They said they heard the communities critiques and are giving feedback to the relevant parties. Don't know what else you can ask for.
15 Jul 2014, 00:24 AM
#11
avatar of Vulture

Posts: 32

I don't see much to take issue with there. They said they heard the communities critiques and are giving feedback to the relevant parties. Don't know what else you can ask for.


That's marketing speak for "we really don't care what you guys think, enjoy your TF2 hats."
15 Jul 2014, 00:36 AM
#12
avatar of Stonethecrow01

Posts: 379

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Jul 2014, 00:24 AMVulture


That's marketing speak for "we really don't care what you guys think, enjoy your TF2 hats."


Well if you're not going to believe what they say then there is no point in discussing their comments at all.
15 Jul 2014, 00:41 AM
#13
15 Jul 2014, 00:53 AM
#14
avatar of Omega_Warrior

Posts: 2561

You are focusing too much on "working as intended". All that means is that it is working as they initially intended. Not that they think it is perfect and won't fix it. The tiger ace was also "working as intended" but they fixed that because they realized that the intended design has issues.

I'm sure it will get fixed in time, but it sucks balls right now.
15 Jul 2014, 01:02 AM
#15
avatar of This isn't taken

Posts: 79

'We realize that many people have had a negative reaction to it, and we're looking at a lot of different ways that we can tweak, tune and improve the system.'

I just hope that happens in a matter of days, and not weeks. Duplicates could be fixed instantly with a quick fix, that's most of the problem solved straight away, whilst they work on the rest.
15 Jul 2014, 01:11 AM
#16
avatar of Z3r07
Donator 11

Posts: 1006

I'm way more happy with this then the previous system.

But like Dullahan said, bulletins and commanders shouldn't have been there in the first place.
15 Jul 2014, 01:19 AM
#17
avatar of Ohme
Honorary Member Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 889 | Subs: 1

Bulletins bore me to death. They don't do enough for me to care, and disappoint me every time I win one.
15 Jul 2014, 01:19 AM
#18
avatar of Brichals

Posts: 85

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Jul 2014, 00:15 AMVulture
I don't want to "craft loot," I don't want to "grind for legendary drops," and I don't want to buy commanders.

Here is what I want: I pay $60 ($80 now with this expansion) and I receive all of the content that I paid for immediately.


I don't understand the hatred so many people have with the DLC model. Sure, maybe people don't like it but there's so much pitchfork waving. I remember there was the same problem with Civ5, people went nuts. And that community is extremely civilised compared to most multiplayer type stressfull e-peen games like RTS/FPS etc.

Here is the reality, they are continuing adding content and patching the game, so they can justify to the publishers to let them keep working on this game if there is a continued revenue stream. Game companies that release a game now and never touch it again will never compete with games that have regular patches and development cycles. It's not Relics fault, it's how the industry is.

And do you know what, it works really really well. Come on, a few commanders in a steam sale cost you the same as a big coffee. You can pick up CoH2 for next to nothing if you are willing to not get it on release, just like most other games.

I remember gaming pre-internet. You paid a fortune for a console or computer (an old Amiga would be about 3000 bucks at todays prices probably), then you paid a pretty hefty amount for a cartridge or disc and these games never got patched and you couldn't get 1000 hours out of them in multiplayer. These games had much less production value than current games also. The value you get is so much more than pretty much any other form of entertainment. How much does it cost you to book a 5-aside football court for 1000 hours.
15 Jul 2014, 01:21 AM
#19
avatar of After Effect

Posts: 67

I think it's a perfectly fine response. They acknowledge the problems people have with it and are looking for solutions. We should be glad the devs make such an effort to get community feedback and that relic usually comes through for us in situations like this.
15 Jul 2014, 01:23 AM
#20
avatar of Rooster Illusion

Posts: 28

The duplicate bulletins is what's really hurting it for me right now. Though I only tend to play group games multiplayer, I have over 300 hours of the game played, so I don't need that same mortar bulletin that I have for Ostheer while I keep the original 5 bulletins I get for the US and OKW.

If this is the system we're stuck with at the moment, I think it'd be nice if there was an option to select what type of War Spoils it is you want to work toward. For instance, if you select "Commanders," you know that it's going to take longer for a drop, but you're guaranteed a commander when the drop finally happens. Maybe have the time requirement go Commander --> Skins --> Bulletins? I dunno, it just pisses me off to be playing OKW guys with all three of the new commanders in their loadout already, and "Anti-Infantry Tactics" has dropped for the second time for me. But maybe I'm being unreasonable.
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Lady Xenarra: Does anyone else think that USF needs buffs? It feels like they’re on life support sometimes
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Willy Pete: @Rosbone Ahh I missed that memo. I still think its a bad decision though. Adds frustration for players and isnt gonna make them that much money
27 Mar 2025, 15:46 PM
Rosbone: It is also good they left it free until after the free to play weekend. Points for that.
27 Mar 2025, 09:34 AM
Rosbone: But I agree, the cost to get a full decent Coh game pushing $115 US is not the best idea. Especially when it needs so much more work for casuals.
27 Mar 2025, 09:32 AM
Rosbone: To be fair, it was a thank you to early fans right? They said it was not free for long and it would become a pay DLC at some point.
27 Mar 2025, 09:30 AM
Willy Pete: Re-releasing free DLC so they can charge new players money for it. Brilliant marketing strategy :clap:
27 Mar 2025, 04:31 AM
Soheil: Coh2 still broken server ?
25 Mar 2025, 18:27 PM
Rosbone: Congrats to Relic. Looks like Coh3 has finally usurped Coh2 s the popular Coh. You smell terrific. :snfQuinn:.
24 Mar 2025, 02:46 AM
Nickbn: and again someone else replies. I mean come on guys. Give @adamírcz a chance
22 Mar 2025, 14:00 PM
Willy Pete: @Nickbn you didn't ask a question, and this is a chat box...
20 Mar 2025, 13:11 PM
Nickbn: @Rosbone it's incredibly rude to speak on someone elses behalf, especially when a question is directly adressed to them. I understand your passion for the subject at hand but I want to hear from him.
20 Mar 2025, 10:16 AM
Rosbone: @Nickbn No, I am just saying people should not be using any Relic owned forum since they have proven they ban anyone who says true things about Coh3.
18 Mar 2025, 19:01 PM
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18 Mar 2025, 16:47 PM
Rosbone: #RelicModdedEchoChamber
16 Mar 2025, 17:54 PM
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16 Mar 2025, 17:54 PM
Nickbn: @adamírcz might be a better idea to voice this to relic directly than to voice it here, in a shoutbox of a nearly deade fansite #justsaying...
16 Mar 2025, 16:36 PM
webdesign-muenchen-w: @Rosbone it is sick
14 Mar 2025, 22:09 PM
aerafield: @adamírcz aren't the first two disconnects free every day?
14 Mar 2025, 19:26 PM
Rosbone: It is so unlike Relic to punish its fans and community.
14 Mar 2025, 12:07 PM
adamírcz: So, I just got a leaver penalty without even getting onto the loading screen because of the game disconnecting, bravo Relic
14 Mar 2025, 10:45 AM
Rosbone: It is an indicator of the very short sighted capitalist view that plagues any company where leadership does not understand the product.
13 Mar 2025, 20:00 PM
Rosbone: They dont care about Coh3 or Coh in general. They are just trying to grab cash by ripping off the small user base they have.
13 Mar 2025, 19:58 PM
Rosbone: Just making mistake after mistake after mistake.
13 Mar 2025, 19:57 PM
Rosbone: It is clear they crapped out an unfinished game. And are now barely supporting it as they make new smaller games. Coh3 is stillborn. It will be meh for at least another 2-4 years. Meaning they killed the whole franchise instead of growing it.
13 Mar 2025, 19:56 PM
Rosbone: For a thing they could fix in minutes. Literally minutes.
13 Mar 2025, 19:53 PM
Rosbone: If I did play coh3 and was mainly a skirmish player, I would be pissed and probably stop playing. And it has been like this since release. Why? I would not tell my friends to buy a game I am not even playing. Lost sales and angered users.
13 Mar 2025, 19:53 PM
Rosbone: I am just saddened how Relic keeps hurting themselves by not fixing 5 minute things like menus. Why anger users with stuff that could be fixed in minutes???
13 Mar 2025, 19:50 PM
Rosbone: I was wondering why people think I was raging. I think it was when I said "because coh3 sucks so bad". That was not my opinion. Just a general feel from top players/streamers. I dont play Coh3 and have NO opinion of it.
13 Mar 2025, 19:48 PM
OKSpitfire: You can rage as often as you like btw, you usually manage to make it pretty funny.
12 Mar 2025, 11:18 AM
Rosbone: So it was a systemic failure across multiple disciplines and check points.
12 Mar 2025, 04:30 AM
Rosbone: Knowing how companies work, I imagine a new hire making the menus. The API they are using is complicated and things were hard to figure out. But at some point QA or management should have addressed these things. Usually within 6 months of starting.
12 Mar 2025, 04:29 AM
Rosbone: @theekvn I dont hate Coh3 or Relic. I just dont understand how you work on Coh3 for like 7 years and the menu system is worse than if a Programming 101 student made it. Feel free to explain it to me.
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theekvn: + 33% dmg rear hit was best deal ever.
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theekvn: KT just need fuel debuf from 15% to 50%, Ele arc of fire- aim time improve and they are good to go
12 Mar 2025, 03:59 AM
theekvn: and please Rosbone,I know you hate Coh3 to the bone due to your drama with relic, Still, Can you give a proper point of view instead of raging ?.
12 Mar 2025, 03:54 AM
theekvn: you rather go 76 to unity Whizbang 2.0 or go home.
12 Mar 2025, 03:52 AM
theekvn: also US tier 4 is 145f and Sherman pen 140 nerf is too much.
12 Mar 2025, 03:52 AM
theekvn: Whizbang lock behind CP, meanwhile stuka is techtree progress
12 Mar 2025, 03:51 AM
KoRneY: @aerafield It's possible that it is underpriced for what it is capable of now, no need to go full retard and take it immediately as a massive problem. It costs 60 more MP than a pz.3 and in 2v2 the barrage can be quite strong.
07 Mar 2025, 19:14 PM
OKSpitfire: I do like that they made the Stuka more expensive instead of nerfing it into the ground though. Found it pretty unsatisfying to use before that buff a while back....
06 Mar 2025, 16:35 PM
aerafield: USF already is by far the shittiest faction in terms of countering blobbing and turtling, now they supposedly have one overtuned tool locked behind a BG and it's immediately a massive problem?
06 Mar 2025, 13:33 PM
Lady Xenarra: I think post-2.0 Whizbang buffs, the price is too low esp since the Stuka got nerfed in cost too. Speaking of which, how exactly is one supposed to successfully dive this Sherman in disguise? Med tank spam running into SSFs?
06 Mar 2025, 12:13 PM
OKSpitfire: A powerful, doctrinal unit that outperforms stock stuff? Colour me shocked! :P
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