IS2 are you kidding me?

Panthers, with their ludicrous turbo-chargers, can warp around unsupported. Soviet heavy tanks, which lumber about like sclerotic dinosaurs, require a retinue of babysitters.

Like I say I play both factions. I happily spam warp-panthers. They are, however, the best tank in the game and cheap at the price.

You need to qualify this with "I spam warp-panthers in 4v4". In 1v1 panthers are almost never built and in 2v2 you might have 1 out, 2 if the game is going long. I completely understand that heavy tank spam is an issue in larger team games and would be happy to see something done specifically there.

The IS2 in general is a very good tank and generally balanced. The problem isn't that unit directly, it's the incredibly poor squad AI that gets themselves killed combined with the low model count of the Ostheer squads.

The solution has also been talked about to death in other threads. I'm not sure anything else needs to be talked about until Relic:

1.) Fixes squad AI so that it doesn't stand on top of itself so much.

If problem persists (or just generally this would be good I think):

2.) Increase both pgren and gren to 5 man with a corresponding decrease in armor / dps and an increase in RoF on the sov sniper.

IS2 is like the brummbar right?

But get better armor i think... Or no... Dont know lol

IS2 is like the brummbar right?

But get better armor i think... Or no... Dont know lol

Try Soviets. One time.

For 240F good tank, but germans get better for their fuel price. This inballance is most obvious in team games.

I so rarely use the IS-2, even in team games, due to the 9 CP and high fuel cost. If it's wiping your squads then you're presenting it infantry to shoot--and thus, you're doing it wrong.

I so rarely use the IS-2, even in team games, due to the 9 CP and high fuel cost. If it's wiping your squads then you're presenting it infantry to shoot--and thus, you're doing it wrong.

I wouldn't say that since infantry are often used to scout ahead of danger/ATGs/SU-85s before you decide to roll the tanks in which puts them at risk unless you got a Vet 2 Scout Car laying around. Add spotting scopes for risk of being called out for map hacks.

I really don't have a problem with the IS-2 one shotting since Ostheer has the tools in nearly all Tiers can pose a major threat to them, but it is annoying as it allows Soviets to have more control over portions of the map/VPs until you can make an effective push as you're at that point in the game where you don't want to risk your vetted infantry on capturing points.

Also Relic needs to hurry up and fix the Pak's Target Weakpoint. I could easily stun and finish off the IS-2 if they'd decide to fire the HEAT at the tank and not at the ground.

But if forces the Panther into an offensive role where it is at risk and the IS-2 is not. A single AT nade will end the circle strafe and give the IS-2 the upper hand again. And if you have an IS-2 I don't know why its not supported.

The IS-2 is an excellent, excellent tank. I don't think it needs to be nerfed or buffed per se, but you are way under selling such a well rounded unit.

Stop bringing up the Tiger please, its goal is to kill tanks, and its not like when it arrives the IS-2 automatically dies. It just means the IS-2 has to be careful not to over extend. Again a single AT nade can cripple the tank, and then the IS-2 can dodge in and out of the max range firing a shot off and weakening it or killing Pio's trying to repair.

I dont disagree. It is an excellent tank yes. But its not an overpowered or imho a cost appropriate tank. It should cost the same as the Tiger and no more.

The squad whipes are rare unless a unit is in a bad spot or low on health.

And I will bring up the Tiger lol why wouldnt I? They are both the respective heavy tanks. Tiger is hardly terrible at killing infantry, is cheaper and will kill the IS2.

And you have to know by now that a single AT nade is usually not enough against German heavies because of two reasons.

1.) It has lower Pen then the Faust
2.) German heavies tend to have very high armor. And just forget about it if its a Vet 2 Panther.

To get a Panther snared or a Tiger I usually have to use 2-3 AT nades.

Also I dont send in an IS2 unsupported thats crazy talk. I am pointing out that it is highly counter-able. Its not this OMG beast that its made out to be. In fact it should always be backed up by a Zis in the case of Tigers coming to end its life.

I dont particularly care for the IS2 as noted above it comes so late now that its life span is usually very short and further its expensive.

Also I dont have a problem actually with the Panther doing well against it because an SU85 can kill a Tiger. The Panther in my eyes is the German SU85 (but better in almost every way)

Just pointing out the facts is all.

IS2 so stronk Kappa

Well it IS more expensive then a tiger, but loses to it. What do you think it should get for that extra cost? Nothing?

Beautiful, succinct ownage. German is OP and Soviet is hard mode, period. OCCASIONALLY LOSING A MATCH TO SOVIETS DOES NOT MAKE THEM TEH OP DEVIL, PEOPLE. YOU DID SOMETHING WRONG. Play both factions instead of being some sort of fanboy so you'll stop confusing Relic with all this bogus whining.

You need to qualify this with "I spam warp-panthers in 4v4". In 1v1 panthers are almost never built and in 2v2 you might have 1 out, 2 if the game is going long. I completely understand that heavy tank spam is an issue in larger team games and would be happy to see something done specifically there.

Actually, if you do do not build t3 units it's pretty easy to field 2-3 Panthers in a 40 minute game, even in 1v1. They're only 30f more than a pIV afterall, you know...

Actually, if you do do not build t3 units it's pretty easy to field 2-3 Panthers in a 40 minute game, even in 1v1. They're only 30f more than a pIV afterall, you know...

30F more plus I can't even remember how much more MP (120?) + the cost of teching T4 + cost of building. That's not even counting the opportunity cost of trying to stay on the field using just T1+T2 since there are no medium tank callins to fill the gap except maybe the stubby P4.

Not saying it's impossible by any stretch or that it has never happened, but in a balanced game holding out until T4 in a 1v1 as Ostheer is not a valid tactic I've encountered either playing or watching others play.

1 Tiger costs 760 mp/200f. A Panther costs 520/145f.

So, this is a difference of 240mp, which actually is 40 more mp than t4 teching cost. Getting t4 up is 150mp I think, so it's a difference of ~50-100mp. Which isn't really much, considering that t4 also offers Brummbär/pwerfer as anti blob.

I agree that teching to t4 takes a bit more time than teching/building t3 ofc. On the other hand - t4 still comes earlier than Tiger CP unlock.

But well, I guess everyone has to know himself whether he uses t4 or not.

I bet that IS2 anger RNG God and miss all shot.
2 P4 can handle IS2? Are we playing the same game?

Two hints:
1.Panzer speed is faster than IS-2 turret rotation so yes,two well microed Panzer's can take down an IS-2,even better when P4 has vet1 NOS...
2.Again,L2P and don't attack IS-2 with infantry....

Two hints:
1.Panzer speed is faster than IS-2 turret rotation so yes,two well microed Panzer's can take down an IS-2,even better when P4 has vet1 NOS...
2.Again,L2P and don't attack IS-2 with infantry....

Rotating the tank with turret ~ 2x rotating speed

Rotating the tank with turret ~ 2x rotating speed

Just a piece of advice,play Soviets,get IS-2,then good luck rotating yourself after a Panzer with its speed hack activated while another one shoots you in the ass...

Just a piece of advice,play Soviets,get IS-2,then good luck rotating yourself after a Panzer with its speed hack activated while another one shoots you in the ass...

Seriously? You're saying the IS2 is weak because it will lose to 2 panthers (one of them at least vet 1)?

People need to stop giving these ridiculously imbalanced arguments in a vacuum none the less. Where's ANY of the support for the IS2 in this scenario? Is that the only unit the player has left?

That's like saying the Tiger is under powered because it can be beat by a rear ram from a T34 while two ZiS and SU-85 shoot at it and it has Marked Target active. Buff the Tiger!

Just a piece of advice,play Soviets,get IS-2,then good luck rotating yourself after a Panzer with its speed hack activated while another one shoots you in the ass...

If you play IS2 like the old Tiger Ace, I cannot help you
or can you read my stat before spitting bullshit?

1.Panzer speed is faster than IS-2 turret rotation so yes,two well microed Panzer's can take down an IS-2,even better when P4 has vet1 NOS...

The stats you are basing this off of are incomplete - just because the speed is faster than the turret rotation speed doesn't mean that an IS 2 will not be able to target it - this would essentially only work in a vacuum where the IS-2 is not using terrain and both the pIVs managed to teleport right next to it.

Seriously? You're saying the IS2 is weak because it will lose to 2 panthers (one of them at least vet 1)?

People need to stop giving these ridiculously imbalanced arguments in a vacuum none the less. Where's ANY of the support for the IS2 in this scenario? Is that the only unit the player has left?

That's like saying the Tiger is under powered because it can be beat by a rear ram from a T34 while two ZiS and SU-85 shoot at it and it has Marked Target active. Buff the Tiger!

If you'll learn how to read I didn't even said IS-2 is underpowered...I said that 2 well microed Panzers can deal with it...
@Porygon 415 games as Germans and 109 as Soviets...yep,you're totaly unbiased

@Porygon 415 games as Germans and 109 as Soviets...yep,you're totaly unbiased

http://www.coh2.org/ladders/playercard/viewBoard/0/steamid/76561198096775527

hmmmm...

http://www.coh2.org/ladders/playercard/viewBoard/0/steamid/76561198096775527

hmmmm...

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