Relic and Org need to update their banning policies

Why would you even discuss the gender or sexuality of a game dev on a gaming forum/Discord in the first place It has nothing to do with the quality of the game whatsoever

Why did Donald Trump get voted in?
Why are people still trying to get him voted in after anyone he talks to has gone to jail?
Why did a bunch of idiots storm the US Capital on Jan 6th?

Misinformation, confusion, and being dumb.

The ESG argument was made that Coh3 was a failure because of hiring employees based on "inclusion and diversity". Anyone who looked at the LinkedIn page posted by the OP would see employees that support that argument.

I agree 100%, under normal circumstances these employees should never be talked about. In the context of Coh3s failure, the release of 120 employees, the promotion of said employee, and multiple ESG discussions I wanted to show how people could be confused into thinking the ESG argument was valid.

The OPs post links you to a specific person and their picture. Posting two other pictures just saves you a mouse click. All three were on the LinkedIn page already.

I never attacked any individual. I merely showed how it could be confusing. I even stated these people are smarter than I am. At no point did I say they were not good at their jobs.

If I wanted to break the rules I would have shit all over the people who got layed off that we all know were responsible for Coh3 being trash. I would never do that. That is a personal attack. And I would never wish anyone lose their job. I, like about 600 other people, shit posted about the generic Relic Management in hopes they would wake up and get the game going. Not that they would actually lose their jobs.

I will never support the thought that an intelligent conversation should be avoided because a single word or image might trigger some small minded person.

The mistake I made was not thinking of the poor mods that have to try and read thru all this crap to make sure it is a valid discussion. For that mistake I was banned. And I 100% agree with it. I should be banned.


All I am asking for is a clearer reporting system.

Aha. So you're on the spectrum

Not gonna lie, you wrote some unhinged shit and modern day companies are not very forgiving with those things.

You had it coming. Gotta L2Dogwhistle

Not gonna lie, you wrote some unhinged shit and modern day companies are not very forgiving with those things.

You had it coming. Gotta L2Dogwhistle

Since no one is reading the big posts and understanding them (which is what got me banned):

No one is arguing I should not have been banned and demoted.

Anyone who read all of the posts on the original problem would understand I did not intend to defame anyone at Relic. But that is an unreasonable request to make of a mod or community manager.

Mods here are not paid. It is not reasonable to expect them to read every crazy word I write.

Community Mangers are paid employees. However, they have to police many different sites and are trying to work with hundreds of thousands of customers. Once again, it is not reasonable to expect them to try and read every thing.

COH2.ORG
Much better than Relic at every turn. Would like to see some time information added to communications.

RELIC
Customers need to be able to ask "Why and How Long!". Otherwise no one should buy a Relic/Sega game.

Here is an easy example of what I would expect from a large gaming company.

Player: Calls someone a C@nt.
Relic: You are banned for code of conduct.

If the player is from Australia, they may not see anything wrong with saying C@nt. So how do they know why they got banned? What will stop them from saying it again? Do you remember everything you have ever typed in 100's of games? What was it that got you banned?

Nowhere does it say how long they got banned. As a player, how long would you wait? Someone banned you for no reason and never said anything about how long? I would never play the game again. I would tell everyone I know and post everywhere "Dont buy this game, the mods are insane".


The bare minimum in game response from Relic should be:
"You are banned for code of conduct rule xx. This ban will be lifted 2 weeks from the ban date. For further help please go to web page xxxxx"

Web page xxxx cant say "You are not allowed to ask us why or how long". The player will never know what happened and will get perma-banned next time.

There has to be some way to message Relic and discuss details of the issue.

For games on Steam, Relic should message you on Steam and state the actual reasons for being banned.

Anyone who read all of the posts on the original problem would understand I did not intend to defame anyone at Relic. But that is an unreasonable request to make of a mod or community manager.

The Community has spent the last week or so dumping on relic because COH3 is shit because they didn't hire people who could make a good game but instead to fill diversity quotas [Citation needed]


Then you chose to post pictures of Relic Team Members and ask if they are men or women.

- Because if you can't tell they must be trans and therefore only hired to fil quotas and therefore bad at their jobs

- Or if they are ciswomen they were only hired to fill quotas etc etc


Either you did mean to do exactly what you did or you are really stupid and arrogant or you were not thinking clearly because you were reacting emotionally



Also you are moving through the standard internet defences of:

"It was just a joke" - If you have explain it it isn't funny

"I was just asking to be polite" - Now that is a joke, Hahahahah

"Y'all are too stupid to understand me" - Because it everyone else's fault you are bad at communication


+++++++++


I get it, you put a lot of effort into supporting the franchise and now feel upset that it isn't what you wanted.


Go ahead, vent a bit, but it doesn't mean the rules don't apply to you and it doesn't make you special


That's a tale as old as this website, here's your very worn participation trophy because the BlackAdmins didn't order enough and people have to share

It's obvious why you got banned. You posted a really strange rant about the appearence of a relic employee. I don't think your posts are malignant in any way but they are just not socially adequate, I don't know how else to put it. You should really focus on your talents as a mapmaker and modder.


This is true for a lot of the people criticizing relic on reddit and discord as well. They articulate their critiques in a way that at best will be ignored by relic and at worst will insult or demotivate them, understandibly so. And again, I don't think these people are necessarily malignant, they are just getting carried away because they are so used to deranged internet antics. I've tried making this point a few times but it just results in mass downvotes and "Clown Emote" and "consumer whore" responses.

People are literally lacking basic social skills. I don't know if it's that CoH attracts weirdos or that people become weirdos on the internet. I feel like a good Litmus test for whether a piece of internet communication is adequate is to consider whether you'd get your face smashed in if you acted the same way in real life on a consistent basis. If yes it's probably worth reconsidering.

What rubs me the wrong way about this is:

Relic did abandon .org a long time ago because a former community manager was harrassed from people here (correct me if im wrong).

Yet they get out of their way to give direction who to ban on here. Weird silent big-brother vibes, further alienating their customers and people who give a shit.

I can agree on forums policies, snowflakiest of snowflakes with broadest of broad rule interpretations moderate these.

However to get banned from the game itself, you were toxic pos and that's end of story.

This is no FPS, there is zero reason to react with anything else then /l when things go unsalvageable bad.

It's obvious why you got banned. You posted a really strange rant about the appearence of a relic employee. I don't think your posts are malignant in any way but they are just not socially adequate, I don't know how else to put it. You should really focus on your talents as a mapmaker and modder.


This is true for a lot of the people criticizing relic on reddit and discord as well. They articulate their critiques in a way that at best will be ignored by relic and at worst will insult or demotivate them, understandibly so. And again, I don't think these people are necessarily malignant, they are just getting carried away because they are so used to deranged internet antics. I've tried making this point a few times but it just results in mass downvotes and "Clown Emote" and "consumer whore" responses.

People are literally lacking basic social skills. I don't know if it's that CoH attracts weirdos or that people become weirdos on the internet. I feel like a good Litmus test for whether a piece of internet communication is adequate is to consider whether you'd get your face smashed in if you acted the same way in real life on a consistent basis. If yes it's probably worth reconsidering.

Looking at how game studios and publishers have been operating for the past 10 years. Constructive criticism doesn't work. Only shitstorm works. Constructive criticism can be appropriate for an indie studio that employs a dozen people and they make a game that they want to show or that players want to see. We are talking about a studio that works for a huge publisher, this huge publisher does not care about constructive criticism, they can only reason with the fall in their stock prices due to a shitstorm.

Looking at how game studios and publishers have been operating for the past 10 years. Constructive criticism doesn't work. Only shitstorm works. Constructive criticism can be appropriate for an indie studio that employs a dozen people and they make a game that they want to show or that players want to see. We are talking about a studio that works for a huge publisher, this huge publisher does not care about constructive criticism, they can only reason with the fall in their stock prices due to a shitstorm.

What kind of shit take is this

What kind of shit take is this

It's just the truth. Did you already forget how much "constructive criticism" Relic recieved during the multiplayer test and alpha? Hell, they're taking their time even in the midst of a shitstorm.

Hell, they're taking their time even in the midst of a shitstorm.

Looks like it's not working then

Since I actually have regular conversations with game devs I can tell you this rabid over-the-top negativity is achieving nothing but them not wanting to engage with the community and their feedback at all. And do you seriously believe anyone at Relic is not aware of the problems that CoH3 has in multiplayer right now?

What rubs me the wrong way about this is:

Relic did abandon .org a long time ago because a former community manager was harrassed from people here (correct me if im wrong).

Yet they get out of their way to give direction who to ban on here. Weird silent big-brother vibes, further alienating their customers and people who give a shit.

In the interests of accuracy, Relic abandoned .org as an unofficial partner in circa mid-2014. I am not aware of harassment of a former community manager, but I am aware of the drunk stream which ended with a Senior Admin and his Caster friend playing some online gambling game and discussing the demerits of COH2...which was the final nail in the coffin, after other ranked individuals had previously (out of public gaze), given the Devs something of a good kicking.

Relic are as entitled to make complaints about adverse posts on this board, as any poster is.

I admit I didn't know about the whole 'commenting on pictures of their actual employees' thing. I thought he'd probably just made some off colour jokes on their forum, or similar. I still doubt that there is any geniune malice behind it but I suppose that isn't the point, they probably consider it to be crossing a line.

So your actual in game accounts have been banned as well? Ouch...

While there was a point I appreciated your various contributions, including maps and Mako, I refused to use any of it after you mentioned leaving or going AFK if people had yellow in their flags.

Absolutely disgusting behavior.

You've threatened to quit or uninstall however many times over the years yet lack the self control or resolve to actually follow through. Then you single out individuals, asked to be banned, and when you finally get banned you ask for clarification you should already have?

This isn't even mentioning the unhinged rants about RNG for years...

I'm not your biggest fan obviously. I'm glad you were banned, since you clearly can't control yourself to just walk away. Your toxicity reached levels that started touching on people's lives on a personal level. Posting pictures and singling people out is an absolutely wretched thing to do.

That just caps your awful behavior in-game.

The Community has spent the last week or so dumping on relic because COH3 is shit because they didn't hire people who could make a good game but instead to fill diversity quotas [Citation needed]

Then you chose to post pictures of Relic Team Members and ask if they are men or women.

This is the problem. No one can read a post a large as mine and understand it. I am not saying it is an excuse. I fully accept being banned. I am telling users on this website to not make the mistake I made.

I posted just above your post the explanation for the male/female question:
I agree 100%, under normal circumstances these employees should never be talked about. In the context of Coh3s failure, the release of 120 employees, the promotion of said employee, and multiple ESG discussions I wanted to show how people could be confused into thinking the ESG argument was valid.

Looks like it's not working then

If it's not working then there's nothing that can be done to save Relic. Nothing else to be said. Thankfully, it is working.

Since I actually have regular conversations with game devs I can tell you this rabid over-the-top negativity is achieving nothing but them not wanting to engage with the community and their feedback at all.

Don't care, didn't ask if they wanted to hear it or not. I'm the consumer, it's my right to speak my mind about the product. If you're a chef and you burn the eggs, you certainly can plug your ears when the diner starts bitching at you about it, but it doesn't change the fact you burned the eggs. If you get thousands upon thousands of complaints about burning the eggs, it might be time to consider the possibility that it's not the fault of the people eating at the restaurant having bad taste.

It's obvious why you got banned...

Great post filled with higher order thinking.

In a vacuum, my post could be seen as harassment. In the context of the ESG discussion, it makes perfect sense.

So what exactly triggered Relic? We will never know? Pictures? Asking if a person with a male name and female image is male/female? Saying Relic does weird crap to motivate their employees? I said 30 things that could be used for ban? Which one was it?

I guarantee if I sat John or Gabby down and explained each statement line by line to them, they would probably lift the ban. It was the logical next step of the ESG discussion.

But it is not reasonable for them to have to do this for every person who says something stupid. I will not waste their valuable time for my problems. I made the mistake of making too large of a post and made it funny so it is hard to understand. I should be punished.

This is why Sega/Relic says "You have no rights, you cant ask questions". Because they would have to pay someone to answer those questions. And that is bullshit. That is unacceptable.

do you seriously believe anyone at Relic is not aware of the problems that CoH3 has in multiplayer right now?

Playing the part of Aerafield: If they did, there would not be any problems